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Serious question - how old are you? Anecdotally I’ve noticed smart people tend to have this attitude until their late 20s when it starts mellowing out. Now I’m

by klik99 4y ago

Serious question - how old are you? Anecdotally I’ve noticed smart people tend to have this attitude until their late 20s when it starts mellowing out. Now I’m a bit older I see my smarter friends happier than anyone and the less smart just about the same as always

pixl97 4y ago
Could it be that 'smart' people have accomplishment or material gain later in life they are satisfied with?
- ARandomerDude 4y ago
  Unsolicited advice from some random guy on the internet: Don't start down that road. Material success will always be just over the next hill, regardless of how much you already have. Happiness and satisfaction can't come from accomplishment or material gain.
  - valeness 4y ago
    Compared to what it was like when I was working at Walmart...? Yeah, material gain has certainly made me a thousand times happier. I haven't had to worry about an Electric bill in years. I used to have to navigate and memorize the electric company shutoff routine so I could pay as late as possible while selectively mitigating late fees and disconnect fees in relation to payday. I can afford to go on vacations now. Take PTO when I want to. When my AC dies I don't have to just suffer until my landlord decides to do something; I can just pay the repair guy $700 to fix it and have AC in a couple hours. Eating healthier is easier; I don't have to stress in social situations about how run down or holey my clothes are. I have the luxury of being able to eat and survive if I am fired allowing me to be more confident in how I carry myself at work. (Meaning I don't have to kiss-ass when I am being mistreated). I have the money to travel if god-forbid my wife needs an abortion, or I can move away from bad neighborhoods very quickly. The pursuit of wealth in and of itself as a measure of personal worth will not bring happiness, but let's not all pretend that money doesn't bring happiness insofar as it provides individual autonomy over their lives. I agree with the OPs point that some older people may have just reached a level of material success that grants them the luxury of 1. Processing their existential dread through things like therapy; and 2. Live a less stressful life that comes with a certain level of wealth
    - svnt 4y ago
      Whether you like my definition or not, I would argue that you are describing the difference between poverty and sufficiency. This is not wealth or achievement, but our system makes it easy to assume that. The churn at the bottom is intended to motivate your continued activity and striving. You are perhaps still too close to the stress of poverty to see that what you are describing is not happiness either, but something more like the removal of capitalism’s sharp rocks from your shoes.
    - lostboomerang 4y ago
      Jordan Peterson (I know, I know...) made an interesting remark in one of his lectures recorded long before he became famous: "Once you make about $60,000 a year for your family, but let's say for you personally, additional income makes zero has zero impact on your quality of life." https://youtu.be/NV2yvI4Id9Q?t=63 https://youtu.be/NV2yvI4Id9Q?t=63
    - jasonladuke0311 4y ago
      > Compared to what it was like when I was working at Walmart...? No kidding. I wonder how many tech workers have had a job outside the industry. Money solved a whole shitload of my problems.
latexr 4y ago
Ding! At a certain point constant existential dread becomes tiring. You spend years mulling on it and the answer continues to be there’s nothing you can do, so what’s the point in worrying? Might as well go do something else and enjoy yourself.
- 2000UltraDeluxe 4y ago
  Precisely! In the end, life will kill all of us at some point. Until then we have two choices: We either do what we can with what we have, or we don't.
  - tartoran 4y ago
    That’s exactly my strategy for shutting down the existential dread mill. Whenever it bothers me too much I’m pointing my attention to how it all eventually turns to dust. The effect of that enables me to try to enjoy the now.
    - Jensson 4y ago
      To me it is mostly that life is boring. At some point you have seen everything interesting and anything you see hence are just fitting into the same basic patterns. Discussions, tv shows, books etc. Living is still better than not living, but every time you experience something new the things left to experience becomes smaller. A few romance movies and you have seen all of them, a few action movies etc, or even psychology papers or math papers etc. You haven't seen all of them, but the more you see the less value you get from seeing another. So we can conclude that living for an eternity wouldn't be particularly more interesting than living for 100 years, as 100 years is more than enough to see many things in each category. You might not become a world expert in everything, but experiencing the things worth experiencing in the categories doesn't take particularly long to do and after that life is just padding. The main reason to live now is that there are new interesting things coming out still, since computers are still young. That adds new things over the years. But interesting progress isn't really the norm, it isn't like physics or math has gotten any more interesting over my lifetime and I expect computers to get there before I die and then there isn't much left. Edit: For example, everything we produce today is based on the same math and physics my grandfather learned in college. There has been no practical progress since then there. Main thing since is new tools enabled by computers that are more precise or automate things, that is interesting but the discoveries enabled by more automation/precise tools will run out at some point.
Bayart 4y ago
That's been my experience as well. I'm much happier in my 30s, having enough experience that I've learned to let go and accept existential dread for the useless bother that it is, than I was in my 20s. Truly realizing that nobody's that special also was a qualitative leap. Not that I'd call myself « smart » with a straight face, but I certainly used to care a lot about things outside of my control.
- Enginerrrd 4y ago
  Same, but part of that is I realized how much I didn't know about things which I was originally quite certain about. Epistemology is a field which is sadly usually confined to religious schools. It's pretty eye-opening when you start applying it to things you think you knew. It was more than a little disturbing when I started reading the methodology sections of scientific papers that make the headlines and I realized at LEAST 90% of them were absolute bullshit.
  - Bayart 4y ago
    > Epistemology is a field which is sadly usually confined to religious schools. Funny that you're mentioning that, the Epistemology classes I took in university while I was studying History were some of my favourites.
- NotTameAntelope 4y ago
  You have the life experience to know what will and won't affect you, and you've found an equilibrium of control and impact that apparently makes you happy. That's very you specific, not really related to your age, other than that it took you until your 30s to find that equilibrium. There's nothing at all written down anywhere that ensures such an equilibrium for everyone, however. Especially for folks who represent a minority in their society, life is a lot more threatening and a lot less controllable for them, typically. For some, that equilibrium may never come, and while that doesn't invalidate your experience, it certainly doesn't support the idea that "you'll calm down when you're older".
  - 4y ago
throwawaythekey 4y ago
A possible explanation is that the mellowing is due to the loss of acuity with age. The more likely explanation is that it's an evolutionary adaption in response to how ones function in society changes with age.
- badpun 4y ago
  I think it's just increased wisdom and maturity. Some people need a certain number of years (their twenties) before you start noticing how pointless and bad for you it is to be angry at the world.
  - Jensson 4y ago
    I think it is more you start out trying to fix the worlds problems, and then after some years you give up and become happier. I don't think it is wisdom or maturity, many people give up as a kid and just go through the motions from the start, I wouldn't call those wise or mature.
    - nickd2001 4y ago
      Speaking as someone not totally young, and (hopefully) not totally un-smart, I think its true one mellows out with age, also you can "be the change you want to see". That to me is the only thing we can do. If we all do our bit we can make things a bit better. Some people can make a disproportionately large positive difference. Its never too late to do that.
    - badpun 4y ago
      > I think it is more you start out trying to fix the worlds problems, I can't think of that many young twenty-somethings who want to fix the worlds problems. If anything, younger people are more focused on themselves [1] that people after the 30-35 yo mark. [1] That's not an accusation or anything. It's natural that, when you're young, you need to figure out who you are and what you want out of life, and that requires a lot of focusing on oneself. Not to mention just growing into being an actual adult is also not easy and requires a lot of trial, error and introspection - something that is not as required when one is older and more formed already.
seydor 4y ago
Cognitive decline is a natural consequence of aging
- kbelder 4y ago
  Whereas in youth cognition is still developing.
trebbble 4y ago
I've definitely gotten better at consciously adding things the list of shit I try not to to think about. Which is pretty long at this point. I finally tried weed well into my 30s and discovered it's great at making sure I don't think about those things when I'm trying to go to sleep, which is really nice. In general I'm pretty sure I've got a fair amount of derealization going on all the time now, which... helps? I suppose that all adds up to some kind of mellowing out.
ericd 4y ago
Yeah, I find that looking at anything space-related helps me remember that our entire species and history are completely and utterly insignificant in the grander scheme of things. All this day-to-day drama just really isn’t that important.
- chasd00 4y ago
  well i mean it's also completely valid to say everything else in the universe is completely and utterly insignificant compared to my decision on what to have for lunch. just because the universe is big and old doesn't mean it has any special meaning or significance.

by klik99 4y ago

pixl97 4y ago

Could it be that 'smart' people have accomplishment or material gain later in life they are satisfied with?

ARandomerDude 4y ago
Unsolicited advice from some random guy on the internet: Don't start down that road. Material success will always be just over the next hill, regardless of how much you already have. Happiness and satisfaction can't come from accomplishment or material gain.
- valeness 4y ago
  Compared to what it was like when I was working at Walmart...? Yeah, material gain has certainly made me a thousand times happier. I haven't had to worry about an Electric bill in years. I used to have to navigate and memorize the electric company shutoff routine so I could pay as late as possible while selectively mitigating late fees and disconnect fees in relation to payday. I can afford to go on vacations now. Take PTO when I want to. When my AC dies I don't have to just suffer until my landlord decides to do something; I can just pay the repair guy $700 to fix it and have AC in a couple hours. Eating healthier is easier; I don't have to stress in social situations about how run down or holey my clothes are. I have the luxury of being able to eat and survive if I am fired allowing me to be more confident in how I carry myself at work. (Meaning I don't have to kiss-ass when I am being mistreated). I have the money to travel if god-forbid my wife needs an abortion, or I can move away from bad neighborhoods very quickly. The pursuit of wealth in and of itself as a measure of personal worth will not bring happiness, but let's not all pretend that money doesn't bring happiness insofar as it provides individual autonomy over their lives. I agree with the OPs point that some older people may have just reached a level of material success that grants them the luxury of 1. Processing their existential dread through things like therapy; and 2. Live a less stressful life that comes with a certain level of wealth
  - svnt 4y ago
    Whether you like my definition or not, I would argue that you are describing the difference between poverty and sufficiency. This is not wealth or achievement, but our system makes it easy to assume that. The churn at the bottom is intended to motivate your continued activity and striving. You are perhaps still too close to the stress of poverty to see that what you are describing is not happiness either, but something more like the removal of capitalism’s sharp rocks from your shoes.
  - lostboomerang 4y ago
    Jordan Peterson (I know, I know...) made an interesting remark in one of his lectures recorded long before he became famous: "Once you make about $60,000 a year for your family, but let's say for you personally, additional income makes zero has zero impact on your quality of life." https://youtu.be/NV2yvI4Id9Q?t=63 https://youtu.be/NV2yvI4Id9Q?t=63
  - jasonladuke0311 4y ago
    > Compared to what it was like when I was working at Walmart...? No kidding. I wonder how many tech workers have had a job outside the industry. Money solved a whole shitload of my problems.

latexr 4y ago

Ding! At a certain point constant existential dread becomes tiring. You spend years mulling on it and the answer continues to be there’s nothing you can do, so what’s the point in worrying? Might as well go do something else and enjoy yourself.

2000UltraDeluxe 4y ago
Precisely! In the end, life will kill all of us at some point. Until then we have two choices: We either do what we can with what we have, or we don't.
- tartoran 4y ago
  That’s exactly my strategy for shutting down the existential dread mill. Whenever it bothers me too much I’m pointing my attention to how it all eventually turns to dust. The effect of that enables me to try to enjoy the now.
  - Jensson 4y ago
    To me it is mostly that life is boring. At some point you have seen everything interesting and anything you see hence are just fitting into the same basic patterns. Discussions, tv shows, books etc. Living is still better than not living, but every time you experience something new the things left to experience becomes smaller. A few romance movies and you have seen all of them, a few action movies etc, or even psychology papers or math papers etc. You haven't seen all of them, but the more you see the less value you get from seeing another. So we can conclude that living for an eternity wouldn't be particularly more interesting than living for 100 years, as 100 years is more than enough to see many things in each category. You might not become a world expert in everything, but experiencing the things worth experiencing in the categories doesn't take particularly long to do and after that life is just padding. The main reason to live now is that there are new interesting things coming out still, since computers are still young. That adds new things over the years. But interesting progress isn't really the norm, it isn't like physics or math has gotten any more interesting over my lifetime and I expect computers to get there before I die and then there isn't much left. Edit: For example, everything we produce today is based on the same math and physics my grandfather learned in college. There has been no practical progress since then there. Main thing since is new tools enabled by computers that are more precise or automate things, that is interesting but the discoveries enabled by more automation/precise tools will run out at some point.

Bayart 4y ago

That's been my experience as well. I'm much happier in my 30s, having enough experience that I've learned to let go and accept existential dread for the useless bother that it is, than I was in my 20s. Truly realizing that nobody's that special also was a qualitative leap. Not that I'd call myself « smart » with a straight face, but I certainly used to care a lot about things outside of my control.

Enginerrrd 4y ago
Same, but part of that is I realized how much I didn't know about things which I was originally quite certain about. Epistemology is a field which is sadly usually confined to religious schools. It's pretty eye-opening when you start applying it to things you think you knew. It was more than a little disturbing when I started reading the methodology sections of scientific papers that make the headlines and I realized at LEAST 90% of them were absolute bullshit.
- Bayart 4y ago
  > Epistemology is a field which is sadly usually confined to religious schools. Funny that you're mentioning that, the Epistemology classes I took in university while I was studying History were some of my favourites.
NotTameAntelope 4y ago
You have the life experience to know what will and won't affect you, and you've found an equilibrium of control and impact that apparently makes you happy. That's very you specific, not really related to your age, other than that it took you until your 30s to find that equilibrium. There's nothing at all written down anywhere that ensures such an equilibrium for everyone, however. Especially for folks who represent a minority in their society, life is a lot more threatening and a lot less controllable for them, typically. For some, that equilibrium may never come, and while that doesn't invalidate your experience, it certainly doesn't support the idea that "you'll calm down when you're older".
- 4y ago

throwawaythekey 4y ago

A possible explanation is that the mellowing is due to the loss of acuity with age. The more likely explanation is that it's an evolutionary adaption in response to how ones function in society changes with age.

badpun 4y ago
I think it's just increased wisdom and maturity. Some people need a certain number of years (their twenties) before you start noticing how pointless and bad for you it is to be angry at the world.
- Jensson 4y ago
  I think it is more you start out trying to fix the worlds problems, and then after some years you give up and become happier. I don't think it is wisdom or maturity, many people give up as a kid and just go through the motions from the start, I wouldn't call those wise or mature.
  - nickd2001 4y ago
    Speaking as someone not totally young, and (hopefully) not totally un-smart, I think its true one mellows out with age, also you can "be the change you want to see". That to me is the only thing we can do. If we all do our bit we can make things a bit better. Some people can make a disproportionately large positive difference. Its never too late to do that.
  - badpun 4y ago
    > I think it is more you start out trying to fix the worlds problems, I can't think of that many young twenty-somethings who want to fix the worlds problems. If anything, younger people are more focused on themselves [1] that people after the 30-35 yo mark. [1] That's not an accusation or anything. It's natural that, when you're young, you need to figure out who you are and what you want out of life, and that requires a lot of focusing on oneself. Not to mention just growing into being an actual adult is also not easy and requires a lot of trial, error and introspection - something that is not as required when one is older and more formed already.

seydor 4y ago

Cognitive decline is a natural consequence of aging

kbelder 4y ago
Whereas in youth cognition is still developing.

trebbble 4y ago

I've definitely gotten better at consciously adding things the list of shit I try not to to think about. Which is pretty long at this point. I finally tried weed well into my 30s and discovered it's great at making sure I don't think about those things when I'm trying to go to sleep, which is really nice. In general I'm pretty sure I've got a fair amount of derealization going on all the time now, which... helps? I suppose that all adds up to some kind of mellowing out.

ericd 4y ago

Yeah, I find that looking at anything space-related helps me remember that our entire species and history are completely and utterly insignificant in the grander scheme of things. All this day-to-day drama just really isn’t that important.

chasd00 4y ago
well i mean it's also completely valid to say everything else in the universe is completely and utterly insignificant compared to my decision on what to have for lunch. just because the universe is big and old doesn't mean it has any special meaning or significance.