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Have said all along: The only "smart" way to use anything euphemistically called "smart" -- is to ban them from your household. Seriously, why would anyone who

Have said all along: The only "smart" way to use anything euphemistically called "smart" -- is to ban them from your household. Seriously, why would anyone who is technically savvy want an Internet-connected computer running software whose source code you have no way to examine (or have someone else examine)? How can anyone trust such a setup? Why would anyone have a computer they do not trust?

patch_cable 4y ago
Someone might acknowledge they have a limited amount of time in their lives to worry about such things and life involves trust to one degree or another. Maybe they believe the incentives involved result in the risk of something actually terrible happening being relatively low. The same reason I don't worry about auditing the engineering that went into my toaster or microwave. Or car.
- xg15 4y ago
  > they have a limited amount of time in their lives That's a good rationale for hiring a cleaner or eating at a restaurant. But I honestly haven't seen a smart device actually saving you a significant amount of time. Even a perfectly functioning vacuum robot only relieves you of vacuuming the floor. You still have to do all the other chores that are involved in keeping your place clean and tidy. > and life involves trust to one degree or another. Indeed it does, but trust includes deciding who you can trust. Why would you specifically trust a tech company not to collect data about you? > The same reason I don't worry about auditing the engineering that went into my toaster or microwave. Or car. Incentives of toaster and car companies are roughly aligned with yours: The companies have no interest in setting your house on fire or causing a car crash. Meanwhile, incentives of smart device makers are strongly disaligned with yours: They you want to keep privacy, they want as much data about you as they can get.
  - patch_cable 4y ago
    > That's a good rationale for hiring a cleaner or eating at a restaurant. But I honestly haven't seen a smart device actually saving you a significant amount of time. Even a perfectly functioning vacuum robot only relieves you of vacuuming the floor. You still have to do all the other chores that are involved in keeping your place clean and tidy. I completely agree with this. In practice I've never owned one that did anything to improve my life. > Indeed it does, but trust includes deciding who you can trust. Why would you specifically trust a tech company not to collect data about you? > Incentives of toaster and car companies are roughly aligned with yours: The companies have no interest in setting your house on fire or causing a car crash. Meanwhile, incentives of smart device makers are strongly disaligned with yours: They you want to keep privacy, they want as much data about you as they can get. I don't think it is that black and white. A random fly-by-night company certainly does have the incentive to vacuum up as much data about you as possible. Other companies do, to some degree or another, have a reputation to consider. For example, I do believe Amazon is interested in learning about my house. However, I do believe they are also incentivized to not sell it to the highest bidder on the open market. I think reasonable people may disagree. See also AWS. I trust AWS not to use my interactions with them to pry into my data to sell me ads. This trust seems to so far not be violated.
diffeomorphism 4y ago
That is only some amount of "smart" devices. Lots of them work just fine offline and use standards that you can use with any gateway you like, e.g. home assistant.
- sammoody 4y ago
  This is my preference, plus you don’t worry about brands shutting down and you have more control

patch_cable 4y ago

Someone might acknowledge they have a limited amount of time in their lives to worry about such things and life involves trust to one degree or another. Maybe they believe the incentives involved result in the risk of something actually terrible happening being relatively low. The same reason I don't worry about auditing the engineering that went into my toaster or microwave. Or car.

xg15 4y ago
> they have a limited amount of time in their lives That's a good rationale for hiring a cleaner or eating at a restaurant. But I honestly haven't seen a smart device actually saving you a significant amount of time. Even a perfectly functioning vacuum robot only relieves you of vacuuming the floor. You still have to do all the other chores that are involved in keeping your place clean and tidy. > and life involves trust to one degree or another. Indeed it does, but trust includes deciding who you can trust. Why would you specifically trust a tech company not to collect data about you? > The same reason I don't worry about auditing the engineering that went into my toaster or microwave. Or car. Incentives of toaster and car companies are roughly aligned with yours: The companies have no interest in setting your house on fire or causing a car crash. Meanwhile, incentives of smart device makers are strongly disaligned with yours: They you want to keep privacy, they want as much data about you as they can get.
- patch_cable 4y ago
  > That's a good rationale for hiring a cleaner or eating at a restaurant. But I honestly haven't seen a smart device actually saving you a significant amount of time. Even a perfectly functioning vacuum robot only relieves you of vacuuming the floor. You still have to do all the other chores that are involved in keeping your place clean and tidy. I completely agree with this. In practice I've never owned one that did anything to improve my life. > Indeed it does, but trust includes deciding who you can trust. Why would you specifically trust a tech company not to collect data about you? > Incentives of toaster and car companies are roughly aligned with yours: The companies have no interest in setting your house on fire or causing a car crash. Meanwhile, incentives of smart device makers are strongly disaligned with yours: They you want to keep privacy, they want as much data about you as they can get. I don't think it is that black and white. A random fly-by-night company certainly does have the incentive to vacuum up as much data about you as possible. Other companies do, to some degree or another, have a reputation to consider. For example, I do believe Amazon is interested in learning about my house. However, I do believe they are also incentivized to not sell it to the highest bidder on the open market. I think reasonable people may disagree. See also AWS. I trust AWS not to use my interactions with them to pry into my data to sell me ads. This trust seems to so far not be violated.

diffeomorphism 4y ago

That is only some amount of "smart" devices. Lots of them work just fine offline and use standards that you can use with any gateway you like, e.g. home assistant.

sammoody 4y ago
This is my preference, plus you don’t worry about brands shutting down and you have more control