4 ms·

I didn't have a cell phone until work issued me one around 2018 or so. (I never really liked the idea.) Generally, I don't have many single points of failure ti

I didn't have a cell phone until work issued me one around 2018 or so. (I never really liked the idea.) Generally, I don't have many single points of failure tied to the phone not tied to work...certainly nothing related to my banking. You can still live in 2022 without one, although the assumption that you have one gets more annoyingly entrenched year-by-year. I don't quite know what these single points of failure are, but they must tend not to exist when you have a "hard no--I have no such device" in your back pocket...you can choose services that don't require it, use hardware token 2FA, or something. Somehow, it does still work out to simply not have one, but it seems hard to avoid reliance on it once you've got it, since you don't see a service and think "well, I guess I just can't sign up for that one", but instead whip out the cell phone and comply.

didip 4y ago
How is this possible? Are you from an older generation? Do you live so far away from the city?
- dsr_ 4y ago
  How is this possible? It's easy. Let's pretend you have a smartphone and a computer. Take the phone, and look at every application that you actually use. Make sure that application can be used on a web browser and you have the credentials stored in a password manager. Transfer your cell number to a VOIP service. Find your carrier and cancel your contract or autopay or whatever. Now shut off the phone, and leave it in a drawer. If you can take out the battery, that's good, but you probably can't without breaking the case. Put some cash in your pocket if you weren't in the habit of doing that before. That's it, you're done. Remember to check your mail and messages on the VOIP line from time to time. If you ask the VOIP people to send voice mail to email, that makes it just one thing to check.
  - Dr_ReD 4y ago
    Then you discover your bank, your credit card, your shopping mall, watsapp, gmail, facebook and grinder, all have blacklisted sms to VOIP numbers and also, they're phasing out SMS support anyway... So you'll need all their own specific apps anyway... And both your neighbourhood burger king or the whole airport in which you just landed, won't let you order food without a phone, an app and a qr-code... And then you live in Italy where you can't ever buy stuff over 1000€ with cash... And where you need an app to access the nation's many exclusively online services. No. You can't avoid it. All you can do, with this kind of passive resistance, is delay it for a bit. :/ We (the people) need to push back and be vocal about the stupidity of this trend.
    - dsr_ 4y ago
      I've never used an app from my bank. They have a website. My credit card has a website. I don't store my card on my phone. It's a card, I carry it around in a wallet. Why would I need an app for a shopping mall? I was in a mall last year, because that's where the LEGO Store is. I've never used Watsapp. Gmail is a website. Facebook is a website. Never used a dating app. I don't need to use an application to get to Burger King, I have feet and cash. My credit cards work in Italy. Anywhere there's an MC, Visa, Amex or Discover logo, I've got something that will work. Pushing back starts with refusing to do stupid things just because all your friends are doing it.
- AnimalMuppet 4y ago
  The initial question was about "single point of failure". The answer is, don't create such a single point of failure in your life. And you regard someone doing that as "you must be either old or a hick". Maybe they're just someone who doesn't want a single point of failure for everything in their life. For myself, I have a cell phone, but I don't have anything on it. No banking. No work apps. Nothing. When work asked me to put an authentication app on my phone so I could sign in using their new authentication scheme, I said, "No, I'm not putting any work app on my private phone. Hard no. Give me something else." So they gave me a little USB thingy to use instead. If I lose my phone, I lose my contacts (but my carrier has a copy of those), my text history (but maybe my carrier has those too?), and any photos that I haven't copied off. That's it.
boring_twenties 4y ago
Recently I had the displeasure of traveling through Newark Airport and at least at Terminal C, you cannot order anything from any bar or restaurant without a phone. You must scan the QR code and order that way. If you talk to a worker or even manager and tell them you don't have a phone, they will tell you they can't help you.
- Ekaros 4y ago
  That feels just asinine, specially in place like airport where people might prefer not to use their phones for various reasons...
jjav 4y ago
> Generally, I don't have many single points of failure tied to the phone not tied to work Agreed, this is the way to go. I've always found it amazing how easily people will create a fragile SPoF dependency on a phone, which can so easily be lost/broken/etc. And more importantly, it's a single point of centralized tracking, so the last thing you'd want is to have everything tied to it. While I do have a phone, mostly for use as a hotspot, I pretend I don't. I'll always take the course of action of not having a phone.

didip 4y ago

How is this possible? Are you from an older generation? Do you live so far away from the city?

dsr_ 4y ago
How is this possible? It's easy. Let's pretend you have a smartphone and a computer. Take the phone, and look at every application that you actually use. Make sure that application can be used on a web browser and you have the credentials stored in a password manager. Transfer your cell number to a VOIP service. Find your carrier and cancel your contract or autopay or whatever. Now shut off the phone, and leave it in a drawer. If you can take out the battery, that's good, but you probably can't without breaking the case. Put some cash in your pocket if you weren't in the habit of doing that before. That's it, you're done. Remember to check your mail and messages on the VOIP line from time to time. If you ask the VOIP people to send voice mail to email, that makes it just one thing to check.
- Dr_ReD 4y ago
  Then you discover your bank, your credit card, your shopping mall, watsapp, gmail, facebook and grinder, all have blacklisted sms to VOIP numbers and also, they're phasing out SMS support anyway... So you'll need all their own specific apps anyway... And both your neighbourhood burger king or the whole airport in which you just landed, won't let you order food without a phone, an app and a qr-code... And then you live in Italy where you can't ever buy stuff over 1000€ with cash... And where you need an app to access the nation's many exclusively online services. No. You can't avoid it. All you can do, with this kind of passive resistance, is delay it for a bit. :/ We (the people) need to push back and be vocal about the stupidity of this trend.
  - dsr_ 4y ago
    I've never used an app from my bank. They have a website. My credit card has a website. I don't store my card on my phone. It's a card, I carry it around in a wallet. Why would I need an app for a shopping mall? I was in a mall last year, because that's where the LEGO Store is. I've never used Watsapp. Gmail is a website. Facebook is a website. Never used a dating app. I don't need to use an application to get to Burger King, I have feet and cash. My credit cards work in Italy. Anywhere there's an MC, Visa, Amex or Discover logo, I've got something that will work. Pushing back starts with refusing to do stupid things just because all your friends are doing it.
AnimalMuppet 4y ago
The initial question was about "single point of failure". The answer is, don't create such a single point of failure in your life. And you regard someone doing that as "you must be either old or a hick". Maybe they're just someone who doesn't want a single point of failure for everything in their life. For myself, I have a cell phone, but I don't have anything on it. No banking. No work apps. Nothing. When work asked me to put an authentication app on my phone so I could sign in using their new authentication scheme, I said, "No, I'm not putting any work app on my private phone. Hard no. Give me something else." So they gave me a little USB thingy to use instead. If I lose my phone, I lose my contacts (but my carrier has a copy of those), my text history (but maybe my carrier has those too?), and any photos that I haven't copied off. That's it.

boring_twenties 4y ago

Recently I had the displeasure of traveling through Newark Airport and at least at Terminal C, you cannot order anything from any bar or restaurant without a phone. You must scan the QR code and order that way. If you talk to a worker or even manager and tell them you don't have a phone, they will tell you they can't help you.

Ekaros 4y ago
That feels just asinine, specially in place like airport where people might prefer not to use their phones for various reasons...

jjav 4y ago

> Generally, I don't have many single points of failure tied to the phone not tied to work Agreed, this is the way to go. I've always found it amazing how easily people will create a fragile SPoF dependency on a phone, which can so easily be lost/broken/etc. And more importantly, it's a single point of centralized tracking, so the last thing you'd want is to have everything tied to it. While I do have a phone, mostly for use as a hotspot, I pretend I don't. I'll always take the course of action of not having a phone.