7 ms·
Unsurprisingly, we continue to learn that non-human animals are less foreign to us than previously thought. The fact that human beings take a “all animals are
by sweetheart 4y ago
Unsurprisingly, we continue to learn that non-human animals are less foreign to us than previously thought.
The fact that human beings take a “all animals are savage, primitive machines until proven wrong” POV is genuinely tragic. Was it Descartes that posited the screams of a dog being flayed were merely its programming?
Being surprised that animals so different than us possibly dream is just another form of Descartes’ ridiculous thought.
- thanatos519 4y agohttps://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/okay-3 https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/okay-3
- sweetheart 4y agoHey I don’t eat any animals, so you’re preaching to the choir.
- hairofadog 4y agoI was frustrated by an episode of RadioLab recently in which a marine biologist explained why an example of humpback whales saving a seal from orcas wasn’t empathy or altruism but was just an evolutionary urge to save an animal in distress because there was a chance it might be a young member of their own species. It felt like a textbook example of not being able to see the forest for the trees; he was so focused on showing that the whale’s behavior was determined by biology (and therefore was not an example of altruism) that he forgot all behavior in all animals, including humans, is determined by biology.
- SnowHill9902 4y agoAltruism is an evolved trait, so. Would you rather save your brother or a stranger? Why do you think is that?
- hairofadog 4y agoI’m not totally clear on the point you’re making, sorry! But to answer your question, of course I’m partial to my family and people close to me, and I think the reason is that like all other living things I’m programmed to strive for the survival of my own DNA and tribe. That doesn’t mean I don’t think feelings aren’t important or valid—quite the contrary. It just means I don’t think humans are unique in that regard.
- nautilius 4y agoWho do you think is more successful/ safer: the humpback whale that let’s its kin die, or the one where they stick together against predators? To generalize, draw on your “experience” (movies, thought experiments) from crime, business, sports, society etc. ‘Altruism’ only appears so on the individual’s level but there’s zero surprise this is an evolutionary advantageous trait from a species perspective, so, frankly, I never understood why we make it out to be that mystery.
- cecilpl2 4y agoI don't think there's any argument that we, along with animals, are genetically programmed to be altruistic towards our kin. In humans, that genetic programming manifests via feelings of love that make us act accordingly. Why would it be different for animals?
- dhosek 4y agoI remember some pro-vegetarian group passing out flyers that said you wouldn't eat this (picture of a dog), why eat this? (picture of a pig). I was always tempted to respond with, “Good point. I’ll bet dogs are delicious.”
- DangitBobby 4y ago_Hilarious_.
- sweetheart 4y agoThis is embarrassing.
- bena 4y agoI think it's Korea that have a breed of dog that is basically livestock. Like the cow of dogs.
- trash3 4y ago
- sweetheart 4y agoI don’t follow.
- tsol 4y agoWhat does that have to do with insects not generally having REM sleep?
- staticassertion 4y agoPresumably because many other religions focus much more on non-human life. I don't remember the bible super well but it was pretty human oriented as I recall. The Bhagavad Gita, again based on a weak recollection, was more about the universe and life (although plenty of human stuff).
- dang 4y agoWe've banned this account for posting unsubstantive and/or flamebait comments and ignoring our request to stop. If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future. They're here: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html.
- tsol 4y agoFrom a biological perspective, what's interesting about this is that REM sleep hasn't been observed in insects before. Insects sleep, but the REM phase only occurs in mammals and birds. I think some people are reading too much into this.
- throwamon 4y agospiders aren't insects
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- WesolyKubeczek 4y agoI dread the day in which we learn that ticks, those other arachnids, dream of flying.
- flerchin 4y agoWhy would one flay a dog?!
- m0llusk 4y agoscience
- acak 4y agoWhile, in this case, it was for science, presumably, the inhumane and especially cruel flaying of millions of live dogs, cats and other animals happens every year in parts of China and around the world. Not necessarily for the meat, but for a few bucks to be made off the sale of the skin.
- flerchin 4y agoSkinning a carcass seems easier than live flaying.
- DangitBobby 4y agoProbably easier to cook them if they are dead as well, and yet, you can find videos of dogs being boiled alive online.
- jimkleiber 4y agoYea, it has confused me why we seem to think only a handful of things evolved in humans and many other things just magically appeared. I work with emotions and it has baffled me that for a while (and still) many of us don't think other beings (animals, maybe plants and fungi) experience emotional or emotion-like events.
- encryptluks2 4y agoWhat is incredibly annoying to me is how people that choose to eat meat take a lot of offense to peaceful animal rights activist and those videos of people eating meat in front of protesters always go viral. Truth be told it doesn't seem to me like there is much difference than having a farm or small stalls for cattle to slaughter and a farm of dogs that you slaughter. You either believe animals have emotions and empathy or you just don't care enough about certain ones.
- ss108 4y agoYes it was Decartes.