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Since this is Hacker News and a lot of people here runs Linux, I want to remind everybody to hold your horses before you tested Linux on these machines. The ma

by nirui 4y ago

Since this is Hacker News and a lot of people here runs Linux, I want to remind everybody to hold your horses before you tested Linux on these machines. The machine that I'm currently using comes with a Ryzen 6800H CPU and LPDDR5-6400 RAMs, made by Lenovo. On Linux, the builtin keyboard don't work because of IRQ problems (See [1], a fix is also available at [2]), and it constantly spams out "mce: [Hardware Error]: Machine check events logged" messages. [1]: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=277260 https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=277260 [2]: https://lore.kernel.org/all/20220712020058.90374-1-gch981213@gmail.com/ https://lore.kernel.org/all/20220712020058.90374-1-gch981213... If you read the code in [2], the patch basically disables IRQ override for every new Ryzen machines (`boot_cpu_has(X86_FEATURE_ZEN)`). Based on that, I assume every new Ryzen CPU has the same problem(???) Edit: wait... blaming it on the CPU might be unjust, it's more like a kernel adoption problem. Luckily, compiling Linux kernel with 16 threads is not really too big of a struggle, you can just apply the patch manually every time the kernel updates :-) :-| :-(

lhl 4y ago
Here's a user report from back in April from a user running w/ 5.17.x on a 2022 Asus Zephyrus G14 w/ an 6800HS w/o keyboard issues so I don't think it affects all laptops running Ryzen 6000. https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/u5p1rs/zephyrus_g14_2022_hardware_compatibility_report/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/u5p1rs/zephy...
kramerger 4y ago
Note that this is more of a motherboard issue than a CPU problem. The fix is basically to disable a previous fix for some other buggy hardware. Plenty of people have new Ryzen laptops that work just fine.
koiueo 4y ago
My AMD Gen 1 has been nothing but trouble under Linux. But it's not CPU, it's Lenovo. Lenovo has terrible firmware team.
- ttarr 4y ago
  My experience is otherwise, see my comment above.
- FeistySkink 4y ago
  I'm on T14 Gen 1 AMD with Fedora with the latest BIOS for the past 2 years and hasn't really experienced any issues. Perhaps I'm missing something here. Care to elaborate?
  - koiueo 4y ago
    Battery life is worse than in my 10 year old laptop. Battery life in suspend is exceptionally bad. I haven't ever used anything THAT bad. You can read more about this in my blog https://127001.me/post/ten-years-of-thinkpadding/#_the_ugly_the_tale_of_x13amd https://127001.me/post/ten-years-of-thinkpadding/#_the_ugly_...
    - FeistySkink 4y ago
      Thanks. The posts says all AMD-based ThinkPads are affected. And I can't confirm that with both of my T14 Gen 1s which I leave on S3 for multiple days. I haven't tried the S0-something yet, but will do. It looks like you did way more research than me, so I believe that it's a real issue. Perhaps it's down to individual component combination, like planar revision, battery, etc.?
pizza234 4y ago
> On Linux, the builtin keyboard don't work because of IRQ problems (See [1] The exact problem is that an IRQ/ACPI workaround is not needed anymore on modern Zen platforms, and it (the workaround) now breaks compatibility. It's already in linux master, and will be released for v6.0 Commit message of the fix: commit 9946e39fe8d0a5da9eb947d8e40a7ef204ba016e Author: Chuanhong Guo <gch981213@gmail.com> ACPI: resource: skip IRQ override on AMD Zen platforms IRQ override isn't needed on modern AMD Zen systems. There's an active low keyboard IRQ on AMD Ryzen 6000 and it will stay this way on newer platforms. This IRQ override breaks keyboards for almost all Ryzen 6000 laptops currently on the market. Skip this IRQ override for all AMD Zen platforms because this IRQ override is supposed to be a workaround for buggy ACPI DSDT and we can't have a long list of all future AMD CPUs/Laptops in the kernel code. If a device with buggy ACPI DSDT shows up, a separated list containing just them should be created.
- secondcoming 4y ago
  These ACPI tables are commonly broken. Who creates and tests them?
  - voltagex_ 4y ago
    The vendors, against Windows.
  - halz 4y ago
    Some vendors may only 'test' as far as getting the compiler to produce something without errors. So, first thing an end-user/consumer/enterprise customer can do when encountering a new platform is to run the platform through https://uefi.org/testtools https://uefi.org/testtools, in particular the FWTS/Firmware Test Suite and SCT/ACPI Self-Certification Test, and hold the vendor accountable. Chances are the vendor already has a member on the board of the Unified Extensible Firmware Interface Forum.
beebeepka 4y ago
I've been running Linux on a Lenovo with a 5800h for almost an year with zero issues. I did have plenty of freezes on my old 2500u machine though. Was very disappointed. Thankfully, those days are long gone
ttarr 4y ago
If you don't mind, can you test Ubuntu or Fedora to see if the issue is present? The reason I'm asking, according to a Lenovo talk from DebConf22 [0], the guy said it takes some time for patches to reach upstream, but with Fedora and Ubuntu they have some connections to shortcut some patches before they reach upstream. [0] https://www.phoronix.com/news/Lenovo-Linux-2022-State https://www.phoronix.com/news/Lenovo-Linux-2022-State
- nirui 4y ago
  I've already setup production environment on this machine, it's not really easy to test Ubuntu on it. Fedora on the other hand, is the exact distro I'm using. Sad news is, according to my test, the latest kernel Fedora 36 offered, which is kernel-5.18.16-200.fc36.x86_64, does not come with the keyboard (IRQ override) fix. Another thing is the mce errors, or more specifically, errors similar to: [ 332.990256] mce: [Hardware Error]: Machine check events logged [ 332.990267] [Hardware Error]: Corrected error, no action required. [ 332.990276] [Hardware Error]: CPU:0 (19:44:1) MC15_STATUS[Over|CE|MiscV|AddrV|-|-|SyndV|CECC|-|-|-]: 0xdc204000000c011b [ 332.990299] [Hardware Error]: Error Addr: 0x00000000efcf8bc0 [ 332.990304] [Hardware Error]: IPID: 0x0000009600050f00, Syndrome: 0x000001ff0a240701 [ 332.990312] [Hardware Error]: Unified Memory Controller Ext. Error Code: 12 [ 332.990316] [Hardware Error]: cache level: L3/GEN, tx: GEN, mem-tx: RD It was never fixed by both patched and unpatched kernel. Of course, those were just the most annoying two. There are many smaller problems such as: 1) Screen won't turn off after timeout if an external display is plugged in via HDMI, 2) Linux S2 (Suspend-to-RAM) never wakes up, 3) Builtin mic don't work, 4) Fingerprint scanner crashes when you put your finger on. I guess it takes time for those engineers in Lenovo to address those problems, and Lenovo is not a Linux-friendly company (they are more like a Linux-meh company). Framework on the other hand, cares about Linux more. Sadly they don't operate in my country :(

by nirui 4y ago

lhl 4y ago

Here's a user report from back in April from a user running w/ 5.17.x on a 2022 Asus Zephyrus G14 w/ an 6800HS w/o keyboard issues so I don't think it affects all laptops running Ryzen 6000. https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/u5p1rs/zephyrus_g14_2022_hardware_compatibility_report/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/u5p1rs/zephy...

kramerger 4y ago

Note that this is more of a motherboard issue than a CPU problem. The fix is basically to disable a previous fix for some other buggy hardware. Plenty of people have new Ryzen laptops that work just fine.

koiueo 4y ago

My AMD Gen 1 has been nothing but trouble under Linux. But it's not CPU, it's Lenovo. Lenovo has terrible firmware team.

ttarr 4y ago
My experience is otherwise, see my comment above.
FeistySkink 4y ago
I'm on T14 Gen 1 AMD with Fedora with the latest BIOS for the past 2 years and hasn't really experienced any issues. Perhaps I'm missing something here. Care to elaborate?
- koiueo 4y ago
  Battery life is worse than in my 10 year old laptop. Battery life in suspend is exceptionally bad. I haven't ever used anything THAT bad. You can read more about this in my blog https://127001.me/post/ten-years-of-thinkpadding/#_the_ugly_the_tale_of_x13amd https://127001.me/post/ten-years-of-thinkpadding/#_the_ugly_...
  - FeistySkink 4y ago
    Thanks. The posts says all AMD-based ThinkPads are affected. And I can't confirm that with both of my T14 Gen 1s which I leave on S3 for multiple days. I haven't tried the S0-something yet, but will do. It looks like you did way more research than me, so I believe that it's a real issue. Perhaps it's down to individual component combination, like planar revision, battery, etc.?

pizza234 4y ago

> On Linux, the builtin keyboard don't work because of IRQ problems (See [1] The exact problem is that an IRQ/ACPI workaround is not needed anymore on modern Zen platforms, and it (the workaround) now breaks compatibility. It's already in linux master, and will be released for v6.0 Commit message of the fix: commit 9946e39fe8d0a5da9eb947d8e40a7ef204ba016e Author: Chuanhong Guo <gch981213@gmail.com> ACPI: resource: skip IRQ override on AMD Zen platforms IRQ override isn't needed on modern AMD Zen systems. There's an active low keyboard IRQ on AMD Ryzen 6000 and it will stay this way on newer platforms. This IRQ override breaks keyboards for almost all Ryzen 6000 laptops currently on the market. Skip this IRQ override for all AMD Zen platforms because this IRQ override is supposed to be a workaround for buggy ACPI DSDT and we can't have a long list of all future AMD CPUs/Laptops in the kernel code. If a device with buggy ACPI DSDT shows up, a separated list containing just them should be created.

secondcoming 4y ago
These ACPI tables are commonly broken. Who creates and tests them?
- voltagex_ 4y ago
  The vendors, against Windows.
- halz 4y ago
  Some vendors may only 'test' as far as getting the compiler to produce something without errors. So, first thing an end-user/consumer/enterprise customer can do when encountering a new platform is to run the platform through https://uefi.org/testtools https://uefi.org/testtools, in particular the FWTS/Firmware Test Suite and SCT/ACPI Self-Certification Test, and hold the vendor accountable. Chances are the vendor already has a member on the board of the Unified Extensible Firmware Interface Forum.

beebeepka 4y ago

I've been running Linux on a Lenovo with a 5800h for almost an year with zero issues. I did have plenty of freezes on my old 2500u machine though. Was very disappointed. Thankfully, those days are long gone

ttarr 4y ago

If you don't mind, can you test Ubuntu or Fedora to see if the issue is present? The reason I'm asking, according to a Lenovo talk from DebConf22 [0], the guy said it takes some time for patches to reach upstream, but with Fedora and Ubuntu they have some connections to shortcut some patches before they reach upstream. [0] https://www.phoronix.com/news/Lenovo-Linux-2022-State https://www.phoronix.com/news/Lenovo-Linux-2022-State

nirui 4y ago
I've already setup production environment on this machine, it's not really easy to test Ubuntu on it. Fedora on the other hand, is the exact distro I'm using. Sad news is, according to my test, the latest kernel Fedora 36 offered, which is kernel-5.18.16-200.fc36.x86_64, does not come with the keyboard (IRQ override) fix. Another thing is the mce errors, or more specifically, errors similar to: [ 332.990256] mce: [Hardware Error]: Machine check events logged [ 332.990267] [Hardware Error]: Corrected error, no action required. [ 332.990276] [Hardware Error]: CPU:0 (19:44:1) MC15_STATUS[Over|CE|MiscV|AddrV|-|-|SyndV|CECC|-|-|-]: 0xdc204000000c011b [ 332.990299] [Hardware Error]: Error Addr: 0x00000000efcf8bc0 [ 332.990304] [Hardware Error]: IPID: 0x0000009600050f00, Syndrome: 0x000001ff0a240701 [ 332.990312] [Hardware Error]: Unified Memory Controller Ext. Error Code: 12 [ 332.990316] [Hardware Error]: cache level: L3/GEN, tx: GEN, mem-tx: RD It was never fixed by both patched and unpatched kernel. Of course, those were just the most annoying two. There are many smaller problems such as: 1) Screen won't turn off after timeout if an external display is plugged in via HDMI, 2) Linux S2 (Suspend-to-RAM) never wakes up, 3) Builtin mic don't work, 4) Fingerprint scanner crashes when you put your finger on. I guess it takes time for those engineers in Lenovo to address those problems, and Lenovo is not a Linux-friendly company (they are more like a Linux-meh company). Framework on the other hand, cares about Linux more. Sadly they don't operate in my country :(