7 ms·

I have had an opposite experience. Daily notes makes no difference. I was in a relationship for 2 years and have written a poem every day for 400 days straight

I have had an opposite experience. Daily notes makes no difference. I was in a relationship for 2 years and have written a poem every day for 400 days straight to her. But it failed nevertheless. In fact, I was told by her that these notes put her in guilt. Weird. Gestures like these amplify whatever the relationship there is to start with. If there's a lot of love, they amplify it. If there's a lot of lack of commitment, they amplify it. They do not change lack of commitment into love magically. Sorry for being the party pooper. I understand where the OP is coming from and I truly respect that. Just wanted to add a bit of more context.

ok_dad 4y ago
Sure but if your problem is that you don’t think about your spouse enough, this might help. There’s a lot of reasons relationships fail, this seems to try to address one or more ways it can fail.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
xupybd 4y ago
I'm sorry for what you went through. When one person is giving more that the other relationships can be a real struggle. I've been there I gave 110% and it scared someone off. The entire thing felt awful. Some years later I found my wife and she responds very differently. She would love a note every day. Any attention I give her is welcomed. I hope things work out for you.
User23 4y ago
Since we're being party poopers, it's worth noting that if your relationship fails it is, by definition, because you are unattractive to your partner. If that's the case, then yes attention from an unattractive person is a major turn-off. That's hardly a great revelation, but even so that kind of common sense appears to be sorely lacking amongst many persons.
- philosopher1234 4y ago
  I think your use of the word attractive is wrongheaded, but if I set that aside your logic is also self contradictory. Lack of attention can cause lack of attraction, and thus attention from an “unattractive” person can cause attraction.
  - hndamien 4y ago
    I think they are using the term "attraction" explicitly as a force to draw them together. If they fell apart, it was due to a lack of attraction.It isn't so much attention from an "unattractive" person can cause attraction - this appears to be very rare, but you are sure to not be attracted to anybody that you give no attention. Best bet is to first change your attractivity to your target (may or may not be possible) and then change the attention.
- em-bee 4y ago
  attraction is created through interaction. but what attracts is different for every person, and if i am attracted to someone, i need to find out what makes me attractive to them. it's not just looks or first impressions. those help to get the foot in the door, but even an initially unattractive person can become attractive as you get to know them.
  - em-bee 4y ago
    could the downvoters please explain why? i am really interested, do you not believe that getting to know someone can make them more attractive? do you not believe that it is possible to misjudge someone on their first impression? what else am i missing that makes you disagree with me?
    - Ruthalas 4y ago
      I didn't downvote, but its possible the "get a foot in the door" is coming across more coercive than you intended. It brings to mind pushy salesmen. I think your statement is fine, if the reader interprets your statement charitably, but it could be misread. Just a guess!
mullikine 4y ago
Regardless of outcomes, your faithfulness is still virtuous. Living completely in inner truth is what you want to aim for. Sometimes that means persevering in truth over a period of time. When it doesn't work out, you have trained yourself to be faithful. The most important thing is probaly that whatever you are doing is truth for you, but without dependency on the other. There is no dependency when reciprocation is not necessary in order for you to feel loved by the simple act of doing what is true for you. I've met a person with an imaginary relationship and it keeps him focused on his creative output. It's very important to be able to maximise creative output (perhaps through your muse?) and to not overrationalise. That is because we live in the age of DALLE and artificial imagination, and you need all the entropy you can get!
em-bee 4y ago
this is probably related to the effect of different ways we perceive love. see the five love languages. we need to talk to our partners about that and try things to find out what makes them feel our love. and also tell them how we receive them.
- sneak 4y ago
  The love languages concept is pseudoscience, just like the MBTI.
  - yunohn 4y ago
    > love languages concept is pseudoscience Love is not a science. Disclaimer: This is not an endorsement of “love languages”.
  - em-bee 4y ago
    just like MBTI this is not an absolute where these types define your personality and predict your behavior that you can't escape. that of course is nonsense. but both are useful to get a better understanding about yourself, your partner and your relationship. talking about these things with your partner works, and that helps to improve your relationship. i can confirm that from my personal experience.
  - zarzavat 4y ago
    I wouldn't say it's pseudoscience, it's not science at all. It's just a list of five different things which different people may value more or less. Understanding your partner's values may not be scientific, but it is a good idea.
    - morelisp 4y ago
      If you say stuff like "people communicate and reciprocate love differently", then it's neither science nor pseudoscience. If you say stuff like "these are the five specific love languages and everyone has two", that's either science or pseudoscience, and I'll give you two guesses how rigorously tested the hypothesis is. Can't write a best-seller framed like the first one, though! People eat scientism up.
gexla 4y ago
From the article... > Though, I’ve set that expectation, and she holds me accountable to it, so I do it very often. This is a shared ritual, which I feel is powerful in any type of relationship. You have rituals at work and with your friends. These rituals are an ingredient in the glue which give relationships meaning. They need that shared sense of importance to work though. Other parts of the relationship should be healthy. Good communication is a must. Did she tell you that the notes made her feel guilty during this 400 day stretch? If not, then maybe communication was off.
TheCowboy 4y ago
Writing a poem is a bit different than the writing OP doing which is communicating in general about everything and everyone. I don't want to dunk on the act of writing poems which is perfectly fine, but that's the creation of art. If you look at how he structures his communication, there are active day-to-day issues/problems being addressed that if left unresolved prevent the appreciation of something like a poem. And as everyone else said, sometimes relationships don't work out and you did your best.
smt88 4y ago
> have written a poem every day for 400 days straight to her I'm sure this was a painful lesson to learn, but I hope you took the right thing away from it. No healthy relationship is going to include 400 daily poems. It makes it seem like the subject of the poems is being put on a pedestal and idealized, not perceived as a real person with flaws. It comes across as obsessive and, perhaps, insincere -- how can someone have 400 poems' worth of feelings for someone they've known for less than 2 years? And if they don't have those sincere feelings, what are they trying to accomplish? Read a little bit about "love bombing" (not because I think you love-bombed anyone, but because it might help you understand how the recipient of this behavior might feel about it).
- Ntrails 4y ago
  > No healthy relationship is going to include 400 daily poems. A bold and absolutist claim. The GPs relationship was clearly not healthy, but the idea that no healthy relationship could exist where there is a daily poem is kinda ridiculous?
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - jrh206 4y ago
    It's a pretty good first order approximation. If you've written 400 daily poems and it doesn't seem to be having a positive effect, then it's certainly time to stop. If it's going well, then fair enough, you do you.
    - Ntrails 4y ago
      > If you've written 400 daily poems and it doesn't seem to be having a positive effect, then it's certainly time to stop. I'd probably say stop at around 7 if not positive, because then it is just a weird week long gimmick...
funklute 4y ago
> But it failed nevertheless. In fact, I was told by her that these notes put her in guilt. Weird. I think you're missing some perspective here. You make it sound like you were the one really trying, and your partner is the one who was weird for not "getting it". I would honestly be pretty freaked out if my partner wrote me daily poems for 400 days. It would come off as very needy and obsessive, and if it continued after me bringing it up, I could see it as a reason to break things off. Of course some people might really like daily poems. But from what you wrote, it sounds a little like you've failed to read the room, and are now blaming others for that.
- Broken_Hippo 4y ago
  I would honestly be pretty freaked out if my partner wrote me daily poems for 400 days. It would come off as very needy and obsessive, and if it continued after me bringing it up, I could see it as a reason to break things off. Same. Occasional poem? I'm not necessarily a fan, but it is thoughtful and boy, does that thoughtfulness go a long way. But daily is intense, and I'd much rather daily communication to be fairly direct and daily thoughtfulness being small things that are optional but nice (making me a cup of coffee when I'm groggily heading to the toilet in the morning, for example).
- onion2k 4y ago
  If you read what the OP wrote; "I was in a relationship for 2 years and have written a poem every day for 400 days straight to her." 2 years is a lot more than 400 days. Maybe the relationship failed because they stopped.
  - eCa 4y ago
    Or perhaps they started on day 330.
  - smt88 4y ago
    Read the comment again. The recipient clearly didn't like the poems, and yet he still wrote four hundred of them. > In fact, I was told by her that these notes put her in guilt. No healthy relationship has one partner who cares so little about the other's feelings that they do something 400 times without finding out if it's welcome or not.
oxplot 4y ago
Now you can go and turn them into a poetry book with artwork from Dall E. Sort of recycling effort.
mihaaly 4y ago
I feel the poems are more like gesture, as you say, than communication. And yes, 400 could easily slip into the category of demonstration, that may be bothersome for the receiving end. Pure kind words in natural form may be better.
simonswords82 4y ago
> Just wanted to add a bit of more context. This isn't really context it's more a subjective and singular viewpoint from somebody who's relationship failed and perhaps was always going to fail regardless of the poems. Not trying to be horrible here...just pointing out that this is not context.
elmolino89 4y ago
> I was in a relationship for 2 years and have written a poem every day for 400 days straight to her. While there may be some people like you enjoying maxed up romantic relationships I would run away in no time from a partner just trying to hard. Imagine getting home everyday to be greeted with a "gift of a day", 10 bullet points in refined calligraphy how much he/she loves me, new scent, yet another laborious make up etc. Most of us will never be able to match that, be it because of no time/energy or a simple "let me rest after work, read a book/go for a walk". Relationship imho is not an attempt to create a Siamese twins in a mental space. Satisfy the needs of your partner, top it with extra stuff, but do not try to kill it drowning him/her in a waterfall of attention, gifts, questions about everything, etc.
- em-bee 4y ago
  Most of us will never be able to match that this is part of the problem though. the expectation that the contributions to our relationship should somehow be equal. yes, both partners should contribute something, and it is possible that one (or both) of the partners are not contributing enough, but wanting to limit my partners contributions because i can't keep up is a problem in itself. the proper response is to talk about it, to share how these poems or whatever it is, make you feel. and come to an understanding that both can work with. the most important thing to do is to listen what the partner has to say, and how they feel. as with all these things, it comes down to communication.
nlnn 4y ago
Obviously it's not quite the same thing, but reminds me of an old neighbour we had. She used to love baking, and would bring round cakes/pastries/bread for us all the time. It was really nice at first, but also made us feel very awkward/bad that we didn't reciprocate (neither of us really cook much), even though we'd never asked for the cakes. Eventually we had to ask her to stop, since we just didn't want to eat that much unhealthy food. She took it as a bit of an insult, and ended up being a lot colder to us after that. It was a shame, but I'm not sure what else we could have done - she was giving us something unasked for (which we felt burdened by, even though she said she never expected anything in return), and got upset when we asked her to stop.
- newshorts 4y ago
  I learned about this from my mom. She’s a giver, but to the point where we don’t want the stuff. We appreciated the thought, but she would bring so many toys for our daughter it was overwhelming and we didn’t Have that much space. It was clearly more for my mom than for us, she just likes to give. So I reciprocated by saying thanks and promptly throwing/donating something older. This allowed my mom to keep giving and us to not have the clutter. I’m glad to confirm what I already knew by your story. It would have hurt her and damaged our relationship if I would have asked her to stop.
  - gsinclair 4y ago
    My mother likes to give cheap things found in op shops. Definitely more about her than the recipient: the satisfaction of a bargain and seeing things be continued to be used. I think it’s also a subtle way to try to control others’ spending because … hey, you don’t need a new X anymore. Anyway, after seeing the relationship futility of resisting the unwanted gifts too persistently, I now just give some approximation of a warm thank-you, then donate the items to a charity shop. Cycle of life.
- mempko 4y ago
  Debts are what bind neighbors and communities together. You felt bad because you were in debt to her giving but didn't want to have a relationship with that person by reciprocating. Often, the worst thing you can do in relationships is to get out of debt. Debts are a reason for people to see each other. By telling that person to 'stop baking', you told them essentially 'i don't want to have a relationship with you'. (see Debt, the first 500 years by David Graeber)
InitialLastName 4y ago
In order for a relationship to remain healthy, the communication has to be bi-directional (and both parties need to feel that it is bi-directional). Writing a poem to your partner every day can be fine; if it makes your partner feel like it drowns out or undermines their signals to you, it's insensitive. If you have an issue with your communication to your partner (either in not producing it consistently or not feeling that it's received consistently), changing it up to something you can generate (and/or your partner can receive in the intended spirit), building a habit that changes up your communication can help. On the other hand, if that habit makes your partner feel inundated, overwhelmed, or drowns out their communication to you, it can make things worse.

ok_dad 4y ago

Sure but if your problem is that you don’t think about your spouse enough, this might help. There’s a lot of reasons relationships fail, this seems to try to address one or more ways it can fail.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

xupybd 4y ago

I'm sorry for what you went through. When one person is giving more that the other relationships can be a real struggle. I've been there I gave 110% and it scared someone off. The entire thing felt awful. Some years later I found my wife and she responds very differently. She would love a note every day. Any attention I give her is welcomed. I hope things work out for you.

User23 4y ago

Since we're being party poopers, it's worth noting that if your relationship fails it is, by definition, because you are unattractive to your partner. If that's the case, then yes attention from an unattractive person is a major turn-off. That's hardly a great revelation, but even so that kind of common sense appears to be sorely lacking amongst many persons.

philosopher1234 4y ago
I think your use of the word attractive is wrongheaded, but if I set that aside your logic is also self contradictory. Lack of attention can cause lack of attraction, and thus attention from an “unattractive” person can cause attraction.
- hndamien 4y ago
  I think they are using the term "attraction" explicitly as a force to draw them together. If they fell apart, it was due to a lack of attraction.It isn't so much attention from an "unattractive" person can cause attraction - this appears to be very rare, but you are sure to not be attracted to anybody that you give no attention. Best bet is to first change your attractivity to your target (may or may not be possible) and then change the attention.
em-bee 4y ago
attraction is created through interaction. but what attracts is different for every person, and if i am attracted to someone, i need to find out what makes me attractive to them. it's not just looks or first impressions. those help to get the foot in the door, but even an initially unattractive person can become attractive as you get to know them.
- em-bee 4y ago
  could the downvoters please explain why? i am really interested, do you not believe that getting to know someone can make them more attractive? do you not believe that it is possible to misjudge someone on their first impression? what else am i missing that makes you disagree with me?
  - Ruthalas 4y ago
    I didn't downvote, but its possible the "get a foot in the door" is coming across more coercive than you intended. It brings to mind pushy salesmen. I think your statement is fine, if the reader interprets your statement charitably, but it could be misread. Just a guess!

mullikine 4y ago

Regardless of outcomes, your faithfulness is still virtuous. Living completely in inner truth is what you want to aim for. Sometimes that means persevering in truth over a period of time. When it doesn't work out, you have trained yourself to be faithful. The most important thing is probaly that whatever you are doing is truth for you, but without dependency on the other. There is no dependency when reciprocation is not necessary in order for you to feel loved by the simple act of doing what is true for you. I've met a person with an imaginary relationship and it keeps him focused on his creative output. It's very important to be able to maximise creative output (perhaps through your muse?) and to not overrationalise. That is because we live in the age of DALLE and artificial imagination, and you need all the entropy you can get!

em-bee 4y ago

this is probably related to the effect of different ways we perceive love. see the five love languages. we need to talk to our partners about that and try things to find out what makes them feel our love. and also tell them how we receive them.

sneak 4y ago
The love languages concept is pseudoscience, just like the MBTI.
- yunohn 4y ago
  > love languages concept is pseudoscience Love is not a science. Disclaimer: This is not an endorsement of “love languages”.
- em-bee 4y ago
  just like MBTI this is not an absolute where these types define your personality and predict your behavior that you can't escape. that of course is nonsense. but both are useful to get a better understanding about yourself, your partner and your relationship. talking about these things with your partner works, and that helps to improve your relationship. i can confirm that from my personal experience.
- zarzavat 4y ago
  I wouldn't say it's pseudoscience, it's not science at all. It's just a list of five different things which different people may value more or less. Understanding your partner's values may not be scientific, but it is a good idea.
  - morelisp 4y ago
    If you say stuff like "people communicate and reciprocate love differently", then it's neither science nor pseudoscience. If you say stuff like "these are the five specific love languages and everyone has two", that's either science or pseudoscience, and I'll give you two guesses how rigorously tested the hypothesis is. Can't write a best-seller framed like the first one, though! People eat scientism up.

gexla 4y ago

From the article... > Though, I’ve set that expectation, and she holds me accountable to it, so I do it very often. This is a shared ritual, which I feel is powerful in any type of relationship. You have rituals at work and with your friends. These rituals are an ingredient in the glue which give relationships meaning. They need that shared sense of importance to work though. Other parts of the relationship should be healthy. Good communication is a must. Did she tell you that the notes made her feel guilty during this 400 day stretch? If not, then maybe communication was off.

TheCowboy 4y ago

Writing a poem is a bit different than the writing OP doing which is communicating in general about everything and everyone. I don't want to dunk on the act of writing poems which is perfectly fine, but that's the creation of art. If you look at how he structures his communication, there are active day-to-day issues/problems being addressed that if left unresolved prevent the appreciation of something like a poem. And as everyone else said, sometimes relationships don't work out and you did your best.

smt88 4y ago

> have written a poem every day for 400 days straight to her I'm sure this was a painful lesson to learn, but I hope you took the right thing away from it. No healthy relationship is going to include 400 daily poems. It makes it seem like the subject of the poems is being put on a pedestal and idealized, not perceived as a real person with flaws. It comes across as obsessive and, perhaps, insincere -- how can someone have 400 poems' worth of feelings for someone they've known for less than 2 years? And if they don't have those sincere feelings, what are they trying to accomplish? Read a little bit about "love bombing" (not because I think you love-bombed anyone, but because it might help you understand how the recipient of this behavior might feel about it).

Ntrails 4y ago
> No healthy relationship is going to include 400 daily poems. A bold and absolutist claim. The GPs relationship was clearly not healthy, but the idea that no healthy relationship could exist where there is a daily poem is kinda ridiculous?
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- jrh206 4y ago
  It's a pretty good first order approximation. If you've written 400 daily poems and it doesn't seem to be having a positive effect, then it's certainly time to stop. If it's going well, then fair enough, you do you.
  - Ntrails 4y ago
    > If you've written 400 daily poems and it doesn't seem to be having a positive effect, then it's certainly time to stop. I'd probably say stop at around 7 if not positive, because then it is just a weird week long gimmick...

funklute 4y ago

> But it failed nevertheless. In fact, I was told by her that these notes put her in guilt. Weird. I think you're missing some perspective here. You make it sound like you were the one really trying, and your partner is the one who was weird for not "getting it". I would honestly be pretty freaked out if my partner wrote me daily poems for 400 days. It would come off as very needy and obsessive, and if it continued after me bringing it up, I could see it as a reason to break things off. Of course some people might really like daily poems. But from what you wrote, it sounds a little like you've failed to read the room, and are now blaming others for that.

Broken_Hippo 4y ago
I would honestly be pretty freaked out if my partner wrote me daily poems for 400 days. It would come off as very needy and obsessive, and if it continued after me bringing it up, I could see it as a reason to break things off. Same. Occasional poem? I'm not necessarily a fan, but it is thoughtful and boy, does that thoughtfulness go a long way. But daily is intense, and I'd much rather daily communication to be fairly direct and daily thoughtfulness being small things that are optional but nice (making me a cup of coffee when I'm groggily heading to the toilet in the morning, for example).
onion2k 4y ago
If you read what the OP wrote; "I was in a relationship for 2 years and have written a poem every day for 400 days straight to her." 2 years is a lot more than 400 days. Maybe the relationship failed because they stopped.
- eCa 4y ago
  Or perhaps they started on day 330.
- smt88 4y ago
  Read the comment again. The recipient clearly didn't like the poems, and yet he still wrote four hundred of them. > In fact, I was told by her that these notes put her in guilt. No healthy relationship has one partner who cares so little about the other's feelings that they do something 400 times without finding out if it's welcome or not.

oxplot 4y ago

Now you can go and turn them into a poetry book with artwork from Dall E. Sort of recycling effort.

mihaaly 4y ago

I feel the poems are more like gesture, as you say, than communication. And yes, 400 could easily slip into the category of demonstration, that may be bothersome for the receiving end. Pure kind words in natural form may be better.

simonswords82 4y ago

> Just wanted to add a bit of more context. This isn't really context it's more a subjective and singular viewpoint from somebody who's relationship failed and perhaps was always going to fail regardless of the poems. Not trying to be horrible here...just pointing out that this is not context.

elmolino89 4y ago

> I was in a relationship for 2 years and have written a poem every day for 400 days straight to her. While there may be some people like you enjoying maxed up romantic relationships I would run away in no time from a partner just trying to hard. Imagine getting home everyday to be greeted with a "gift of a day", 10 bullet points in refined calligraphy how much he/she loves me, new scent, yet another laborious make up etc. Most of us will never be able to match that, be it because of no time/energy or a simple "let me rest after work, read a book/go for a walk". Relationship imho is not an attempt to create a Siamese twins in a mental space. Satisfy the needs of your partner, top it with extra stuff, but do not try to kill it drowning him/her in a waterfall of attention, gifts, questions about everything, etc.

em-bee 4y ago
Most of us will never be able to match that this is part of the problem though. the expectation that the contributions to our relationship should somehow be equal. yes, both partners should contribute something, and it is possible that one (or both) of the partners are not contributing enough, but wanting to limit my partners contributions because i can't keep up is a problem in itself. the proper response is to talk about it, to share how these poems or whatever it is, make you feel. and come to an understanding that both can work with. the most important thing to do is to listen what the partner has to say, and how they feel. as with all these things, it comes down to communication.

nlnn 4y ago

Obviously it's not quite the same thing, but reminds me of an old neighbour we had. She used to love baking, and would bring round cakes/pastries/bread for us all the time. It was really nice at first, but also made us feel very awkward/bad that we didn't reciprocate (neither of us really cook much), even though we'd never asked for the cakes. Eventually we had to ask her to stop, since we just didn't want to eat that much unhealthy food. She took it as a bit of an insult, and ended up being a lot colder to us after that. It was a shame, but I'm not sure what else we could have done - she was giving us something unasked for (which we felt burdened by, even though she said she never expected anything in return), and got upset when we asked her to stop.

newshorts 4y ago
I learned about this from my mom. She’s a giver, but to the point where we don’t want the stuff. We appreciated the thought, but she would bring so many toys for our daughter it was overwhelming and we didn’t Have that much space. It was clearly more for my mom than for us, she just likes to give. So I reciprocated by saying thanks and promptly throwing/donating something older. This allowed my mom to keep giving and us to not have the clutter. I’m glad to confirm what I already knew by your story. It would have hurt her and damaged our relationship if I would have asked her to stop.
- gsinclair 4y ago
  My mother likes to give cheap things found in op shops. Definitely more about her than the recipient: the satisfaction of a bargain and seeing things be continued to be used. I think it’s also a subtle way to try to control others’ spending because … hey, you don’t need a new X anymore. Anyway, after seeing the relationship futility of resisting the unwanted gifts too persistently, I now just give some approximation of a warm thank-you, then donate the items to a charity shop. Cycle of life.
mempko 4y ago
Debts are what bind neighbors and communities together. You felt bad because you were in debt to her giving but didn't want to have a relationship with that person by reciprocating. Often, the worst thing you can do in relationships is to get out of debt. Debts are a reason for people to see each other. By telling that person to 'stop baking', you told them essentially 'i don't want to have a relationship with you'. (see Debt, the first 500 years by David Graeber)

InitialLastName 4y ago

In order for a relationship to remain healthy, the communication has to be bi-directional (and both parties need to feel that it is bi-directional). Writing a poem to your partner every day can be fine; if it makes your partner feel like it drowns out or undermines their signals to you, it's insensitive. If you have an issue with your communication to your partner (either in not producing it consistently or not feeling that it's received consistently), changing it up to something you can generate (and/or your partner can receive in the intended spirit), building a habit that changes up your communication can help. On the other hand, if that habit makes your partner feel inundated, overwhelmed, or drowns out their communication to you, it can make things worse.