4 ms·

> credit cards can really be shady (especially exploitative for those with low financial understanding) and I do think we should get rid of them. Or, promote b

> credit cards can really be shady (especially exploitative for those with low financial understanding) and I do think we should get rid of them. Or, promote better financial literacy.

nilespotter 4y ago
I like your optimism. It's not clear to me your average American and his public education are capable of understanding them, regardless of what financial literacy we may or may not be able to inculcate.
- nyokodo 4y ago
  > It's not clear to me your average American and his public education are capable of understanding them Basic financial literacy sufficient to manage credit is well within the abilities of those with average intelligence. If the Public Schools are unable to teach that then we should reform them. It's not like credit cards are the only financial pitfall that people desperately need help to avoid.
Nextgrid 4y ago
Just because a specific skill can help you avoid the pitfalls doesn't mean those pitfalls should be kept around. Just because OSHA and health & safety rules exist doesn't mean we intentionally make power tools and machines have blunt electrified edges to cut/electrocute anyone who isn't "literate" enough and accidentally touches the thing. I'm personally tired of everything in the world being intentionally hostile.
- nyokodo 4y ago
  > Just because OSHA and health & safety rules exist doesn't mean we intentionally make power tools and machines have blunt electrified edges to cut/electrocute anyone who isn't "literate" enough and accidentally touches the thing. The OP called for the abolition of credit cards, whereas you're describing the regulation of power tools which is all well and good albeit inadequate as people still cut their fingers off and break things all the time with power tools. Power tools are still around and no one is calling for them to be abolished, although there are efforts to train people in power tool safety. People need financial safety training too, and not just for credit cards.
  - Nextgrid 4y ago
    Power tools cut off limbs and cause accidents because those tools are designed to cut hard materials that are much harder than human flesh. You could technically make a completely safe angle grinder by completely covering the cutting wheel but that would make it pretty useless. On the other hand, credit cards' pitfalls are intentional rules that have no other purpose other than to explicitly be "sharp" and "cut" careless people.
    - nyokodo 4y ago
      > On the other hand, credit cards' pitfalls are intentional rules that have no other purpose other than to explicitly be "sharp" and "cut" careless people. You already mentioned one way to ameliorate this that worked for power tools, regulation, that doesn't involve abolishing them. That might work, but far better is to reduce the number of careless people through education.
      - Nextgrid 4y ago
        What makes credit cards "credit cards" is not some technical difference but the fee schedule and repayment terms, which are currently intentionally obtuse and "sharp" so that people who get "cut" subsidize perks for those who know how to play the system to their advantage. If you regulate those away it will just become the equivalent of a debit card with an overdraft attached, essentially abolishing them. > far better is to reduce the number of careless people through education. Maybe. If there's no safer way to achieve the task at hand (like with power tools - the tool is inherently designed to cut things and will cut limbs if misused), sure. But when the danger is intentionally introduced into the system with no other purpose than to subsidize perks for the well-off, is it worth keeping? Why not also extrapolate this and make fraud and scamming legal and instead blame victims for their lack of care and education?

> credit cards can really be shady (especially exploitative for those with low financial understanding) and I do think we should get rid of them. Or, promote better financial literacy.

nilespotter 4y ago

I like your optimism. It's not clear to me your average American and his public education are capable of understanding them, regardless of what financial literacy we may or may not be able to inculcate.

nyokodo 4y ago
> It's not clear to me your average American and his public education are capable of understanding them Basic financial literacy sufficient to manage credit is well within the abilities of those with average intelligence. If the Public Schools are unable to teach that then we should reform them. It's not like credit cards are the only financial pitfall that people desperately need help to avoid.

Nextgrid 4y ago

Just because a specific skill can help you avoid the pitfalls doesn't mean those pitfalls should be kept around. Just because OSHA and health & safety rules exist doesn't mean we intentionally make power tools and machines have blunt electrified edges to cut/electrocute anyone who isn't "literate" enough and accidentally touches the thing. I'm personally tired of everything in the world being intentionally hostile.

nyokodo 4y ago
> Just because OSHA and health & safety rules exist doesn't mean we intentionally make power tools and machines have blunt electrified edges to cut/electrocute anyone who isn't "literate" enough and accidentally touches the thing. The OP called for the abolition of credit cards, whereas you're describing the regulation of power tools which is all well and good albeit inadequate as people still cut their fingers off and break things all the time with power tools. Power tools are still around and no one is calling for them to be abolished, although there are efforts to train people in power tool safety. People need financial safety training too, and not just for credit cards.
- Nextgrid 4y ago
  Power tools cut off limbs and cause accidents because those tools are designed to cut hard materials that are much harder than human flesh. You could technically make a completely safe angle grinder by completely covering the cutting wheel but that would make it pretty useless. On the other hand, credit cards' pitfalls are intentional rules that have no other purpose other than to explicitly be "sharp" and "cut" careless people.
  - nyokodo 4y ago
    > On the other hand, credit cards' pitfalls are intentional rules that have no other purpose other than to explicitly be "sharp" and "cut" careless people. You already mentioned one way to ameliorate this that worked for power tools, regulation, that doesn't involve abolishing them. That might work, but far better is to reduce the number of careless people through education.
    - Nextgrid 4y ago
      What makes credit cards "credit cards" is not some technical difference but the fee schedule and repayment terms, which are currently intentionally obtuse and "sharp" so that people who get "cut" subsidize perks for those who know how to play the system to their advantage. If you regulate those away it will just become the equivalent of a debit card with an overdraft attached, essentially abolishing them. > far better is to reduce the number of careless people through education. Maybe. If there's no safer way to achieve the task at hand (like with power tools - the tool is inherently designed to cut things and will cut limbs if misused), sure. But when the danger is intentionally introduced into the system with no other purpose than to subsidize perks for the well-off, is it worth keeping? Why not also extrapolate this and make fraud and scamming legal and instead blame victims for their lack of care and education?