26 ms·

I think this kind of affirms the general opinion that Germany and many traditionally powerful European countries is doing poorly when it comes to modern tech. W

I think this kind of affirms the general opinion that Germany and many traditionally powerful European countries is doing poorly when it comes to modern tech. What went wrong with Germany and Europe? They used to be the front runners in tech once upon a time.

lizardactivist 4y ago
"European countries doing poorly when it comes to modern tech" has never been an opinion. You're confused, and your petty vindictiveness is unmotivated. The EU as a space of commerce is not yours to do with as you wish. You have to follow rules and regulations just like our own companies have to. And if your country had not been engaging in espionage and sabotage then there would never have been a need for these "unfair" and "underhanded tactics".
- blocked_again 4y ago
  - 3836293648 4y ago
    If the goal was to stop US companies, the EU parliament wouldn't've thought that the US lived up to the requirements of the GDPR. They assumed they did until courts struck it down
  - xdennis 4y ago
    > You really think laws like this is going to stop US government/NSA from accessing data of whoever they are interested? 1) So if you're helpless you're supposed to not defend yourself at all? 2) Why did they pass the CLOUD Act if they already have access?
  - dang 4y ago
    Please don't take HN threads further into flamewar. It's not what this site is for, and it destroys what it is for. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: actually, I'm seeing so many abusive comments in your account history that I've banned the account. See also https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32393867 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32393867.
    - modabusing 4y ago
      Where do we report a mod that is abusing his authority? Dang is banning people left and right without justification.
- sershe 4y ago
  > You have to follow rules and regulations just like our own companies have to Which companies? Seriously though. Is there a reason the biggest EU software companies are the likes of SAP and Capgemini, or niche players like Spotify? I mean, I'm not talking about the USA or China, even Russia has a more impressive tech sector. Could it have something to do with various regulations?
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
throwaway4good 4y ago
The surveillance capitalism model is a non-starter in the EU.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
johannes1234321 4y ago
Maybe it's just, that the European law makers understand the risk of being are to transfer sensitive persona data into other legislations, and that a local registered company doesn't mean there are technical bounds.
- blocked_again 4y ago
  - johannes1234321 4y ago
    I am not sure which exact incident you are after, but NSA, the largest operater of surveillance in Europe is American and GCHQ, the second alrgest, is British and also outside EU these days. But yes, there are some actions by European governments i condemn. However as a European citizen I have ways to counter actions by a European government. By voting, by legal means etc. Into the US I have now range and the US has very little responsibility towards me. Laws protecting Americans or actions in America don't protect me as a foreigner. That said: The court case here at hand was about the government being the (indirect) customer of that cloud. Thus it's their data amthey want to be protected from foreign governments.
  - xdennis 4y ago
    If you store data in your own country with non-American companies you're protected by your country's judicial system. If you use an American company or American-based company you're subject to illegal spying from the NSA or extra-judicial warrants from the CLOUD Act (which compels Americans to apply American law outside the US).
    - tzs 4y ago
      > or extra-judicial warrants from the CLOUD Act What is an "extra-judicial warrant"?
  - CBarkleyU 4y ago
    > From what we know, so far, it was the EU countries which elected politicians that went after their own people. Not the US. Please stick to Reddit with cheap rhetoric like that.
TheLoafOfBread 4y ago
LOL, they never were. Germans are conservative. Try to pay by card in a shop/restaurant outside bigger German city. Either not possible, cash only, or you can use some local EC card, which only Germans are using. Rest of EU is using Visa / Master card.
simion314 4y ago
But when is about TikTok I see most americans have completely different values, no sorry americans are consistent, only US citizens deserve rights, the rest can be spied on, tortured,killed etc. Give EU citizens same privacy rights and there so no need to start an economic war because some NSA fat and lazy agent does not want to prepare a file to request a warrant. If you are at it, maybe is tiem to let US citizens that killed people(like in car crashes abroad) to get their fair trial and punishment too. We have rights too, you are not more special and deserve more basic human rights because citizenship.
- blocked_again 4y ago
  You do know that nobody in US is forcing you to use this site or any other US companies for that matter. You are doing it with your own free fill. Also, remember the time when Germany decided to go after their own people? How does laws like this help when it comes to situations like that?
  - bettysdiagnose 4y ago
    - blocked_again 4y ago
      All I am saying is Individuals are perfectly capable of making that decision. Whether they should store their data in Germany, California or some random Caribbean island.
      - simion314 4y ago
        And did the Germans put some buy in prison for his personal data, or was about companies sending to US other people private data?
      - simsla 4y ago
        And yet you claim Germany and Europe have "gone wrong" when they make exactly such a determination. Seems like double standards. What's the difference?

lizardactivist 4y ago

"European countries doing poorly when it comes to modern tech" has never been an opinion. You're confused, and your petty vindictiveness is unmotivated. The EU as a space of commerce is not yours to do with as you wish. You have to follow rules and regulations just like our own companies have to. And if your country had not been engaging in espionage and sabotage then there would never have been a need for these "unfair" and "underhanded tactics".

blocked_again 4y ago
- 3836293648 4y ago
  If the goal was to stop US companies, the EU parliament wouldn't've thought that the US lived up to the requirements of the GDPR. They assumed they did until courts struck it down
- xdennis 4y ago
  > You really think laws like this is going to stop US government/NSA from accessing data of whoever they are interested? 1) So if you're helpless you're supposed to not defend yourself at all? 2) Why did they pass the CLOUD Act if they already have access?
- dang 4y ago
  Please don't take HN threads further into flamewar. It's not what this site is for, and it destroys what it is for. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: actually, I'm seeing so many abusive comments in your account history that I've banned the account. See also https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32393867 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32393867.
  - modabusing 4y ago
    Where do we report a mod that is abusing his authority? Dang is banning people left and right without justification.
sershe 4y ago
> You have to follow rules and regulations just like our own companies have to Which companies? Seriously though. Is there a reason the biggest EU software companies are the likes of SAP and Capgemini, or niche players like Spotify? I mean, I'm not talking about the USA or China, even Russia has a more impressive tech sector. Could it have something to do with various regulations?

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

throwaway4good 4y ago

The surveillance capitalism model is a non-starter in the EU.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

johannes1234321 4y ago

Maybe it's just, that the European law makers understand the risk of being are to transfer sensitive persona data into other legislations, and that a local registered company doesn't mean there are technical bounds.

blocked_again 4y ago
- johannes1234321 4y ago
  I am not sure which exact incident you are after, but NSA, the largest operater of surveillance in Europe is American and GCHQ, the second alrgest, is British and also outside EU these days. But yes, there are some actions by European governments i condemn. However as a European citizen I have ways to counter actions by a European government. By voting, by legal means etc. Into the US I have now range and the US has very little responsibility towards me. Laws protecting Americans or actions in America don't protect me as a foreigner. That said: The court case here at hand was about the government being the (indirect) customer of that cloud. Thus it's their data amthey want to be protected from foreign governments.
- xdennis 4y ago
  If you store data in your own country with non-American companies you're protected by your country's judicial system. If you use an American company or American-based company you're subject to illegal spying from the NSA or extra-judicial warrants from the CLOUD Act (which compels Americans to apply American law outside the US).
  - tzs 4y ago
    > or extra-judicial warrants from the CLOUD Act What is an "extra-judicial warrant"?
- CBarkleyU 4y ago
  > From what we know, so far, it was the EU countries which elected politicians that went after their own people. Not the US. Please stick to Reddit with cheap rhetoric like that.

TheLoafOfBread 4y ago

LOL, they never were. Germans are conservative. Try to pay by card in a shop/restaurant outside bigger German city. Either not possible, cash only, or you can use some local EC card, which only Germans are using. Rest of EU is using Visa / Master card.

simion314 4y ago

But when is about TikTok I see most americans have completely different values, no sorry americans are consistent, only US citizens deserve rights, the rest can be spied on, tortured,killed etc. Give EU citizens same privacy rights and there so no need to start an economic war because some NSA fat and lazy agent does not want to prepare a file to request a warrant. If you are at it, maybe is tiem to let US citizens that killed people(like in car crashes abroad) to get their fair trial and punishment too. We have rights too, you are not more special and deserve more basic human rights because citizenship.

blocked_again 4y ago
You do know that nobody in US is forcing you to use this site or any other US companies for that matter. You are doing it with your own free fill. Also, remember the time when Germany decided to go after their own people? How does laws like this help when it comes to situations like that?
- bettysdiagnose 4y ago
  - blocked_again 4y ago
    All I am saying is Individuals are perfectly capable of making that decision. Whether they should store their data in Germany, California or some random Caribbean island.
    - simion314 4y ago
      And did the Germans put some buy in prison for his personal data, or was about companies sending to US other people private data?
    - simsla 4y ago
      And yet you claim Germany and Europe have "gone wrong" when they make exactly such a determination. Seems like double standards. What's the difference?