4 ms·

“… because driving will be more inconvenient than walking” Not sure about this. For example, look at the school bus stops and the stacks of cars waiting for ch

by cudgy 4y ago

“… because driving will be more inconvenient than walking” Not sure about this. For example, look at the school bus stops and the stacks of cars waiting for children only to drive 300 feet back to their house. Weather is another factor that makes driving more convenient. Many people are accustomed to air conditioned spaces and have a small comfort range.

ericmay 4y ago
I think there's a couple of things there. One is yea there's a certain level of cultural idiocy and laziness. I live in front of a bus stop and see it. But I also see lots of parents walking to pick up their kids, so I'm not sure what the breakdown is (this is in the suburbs in Ohio with the bad weather and all of that). The other is that we don't really have a lot (any at all?) of examples where you have a true walkable neighborhood with desirable schools. Most walkable neighborhoods that I've seen were built before automobile traffic became prevalent, which puts them close to cities which tend to have the worst schools. So I'm not actually sure what parents would do if they had the combo of schools and neighborhood that we'd be talking about here, but I bet they'd walk because in those neighborhoods it just wouldn't be possible for all or most parents to drive their kid to school at the same time. It's really hard to break out of thinking about things in terms of the suburbs and convenience because most use that as their starting frame of reference. How will I go to Costco if XYZ, well you wouldn't. How will my kids get to school? They'd walk or ride their bikes. "But it's dangerous" ok then make it safe. Participate in your community and your government. That's half the reason we have the problems we have now. For better or worse though economic physics is going to win. We'll either all perish in war over resources or these activities will just become too expensive. EVs won't save us either, and this is particularly true given the underinvestment in nuclear energy that has occurred world wide.
- kixiQu 4y ago
  Ehhh.. "Cultural idiocy and laziness" ignores some important systemic factors. You can be investigated for neglect for letting your kids play in a park you can see from your window. https://www.familydefensecenter.net/client-stories/mother-challenges-dcfs-decision-that-prevents-her-three-children-from-playing-outside/ https://www.familydefensecenter.net/client-stories/mother-ch... You can't "make it safe" for your kid to ride a bike to school if, when you think you HAVE made it safe, a police officer can still charge you with neglect. https://bikeportland.org/2011/09/01/neglect-charges-follow-10-year-olds-bike-ride-in-tennessee-58426 https://bikeportland.org/2011/09/01/neglect-charges-follow-1... The contemporary US has a narrative about parenting and risk to children that creates some very weird requirements.
  - ericmay 4y ago
    Those are just cultural aspects though aren't they? But that also doesn't excuse what I'll call cultural idiocy and laziness for not walking your kid 300 feet to the bus stop.
  - thfuran 4y ago
    That sounds a lot like cultural idiocy to me.
mwint 4y ago
The “cars to drive kids 300ft to the house” problem is due to the rampant safety-ism in today’s society, not really a car problem per se.
- ericmay 4y ago
  Kind of. It's a chicken-egg thing. When you design your society around cars and car infrastructure people take their cars everywhere and watch the news and get scared and all that. We can think back to earlier times where this wasn't the case.
frobozz 4y ago
I have never seen this, and I live right by a school bus stop. The closest place a limited number of cars could wait is down a side road about 200ft from the stop, but they don't.

by cudgy 4y ago

ericmay 4y ago

I think there's a couple of things there. One is yea there's a certain level of cultural idiocy and laziness. I live in front of a bus stop and see it. But I also see lots of parents walking to pick up their kids, so I'm not sure what the breakdown is (this is in the suburbs in Ohio with the bad weather and all of that). The other is that we don't really have a lot (any at all?) of examples where you have a true walkable neighborhood with desirable schools. Most walkable neighborhoods that I've seen were built before automobile traffic became prevalent, which puts them close to cities which tend to have the worst schools. So I'm not actually sure what parents would do if they had the combo of schools and neighborhood that we'd be talking about here, but I bet they'd walk because in those neighborhoods it just wouldn't be possible for all or most parents to drive their kid to school at the same time. It's really hard to break out of thinking about things in terms of the suburbs and convenience because most use that as their starting frame of reference. How will I go to Costco if XYZ, well you wouldn't. How will my kids get to school? They'd walk or ride their bikes. "But it's dangerous" ok then make it safe. Participate in your community and your government. That's half the reason we have the problems we have now. For better or worse though economic physics is going to win. We'll either all perish in war over resources or these activities will just become too expensive. EVs won't save us either, and this is particularly true given the underinvestment in nuclear energy that has occurred world wide.

kixiQu 4y ago
Ehhh.. "Cultural idiocy and laziness" ignores some important systemic factors. You can be investigated for neglect for letting your kids play in a park you can see from your window. https://www.familydefensecenter.net/client-stories/mother-challenges-dcfs-decision-that-prevents-her-three-children-from-playing-outside/ https://www.familydefensecenter.net/client-stories/mother-ch... You can't "make it safe" for your kid to ride a bike to school if, when you think you HAVE made it safe, a police officer can still charge you with neglect. https://bikeportland.org/2011/09/01/neglect-charges-follow-10-year-olds-bike-ride-in-tennessee-58426 https://bikeportland.org/2011/09/01/neglect-charges-follow-1... The contemporary US has a narrative about parenting and risk to children that creates some very weird requirements.
- ericmay 4y ago
  Those are just cultural aspects though aren't they? But that also doesn't excuse what I'll call cultural idiocy and laziness for not walking your kid 300 feet to the bus stop.
- thfuran 4y ago
  That sounds a lot like cultural idiocy to me.

mwint 4y ago

The “cars to drive kids 300ft to the house” problem is due to the rampant safety-ism in today’s society, not really a car problem per se.

ericmay 4y ago
Kind of. It's a chicken-egg thing. When you design your society around cars and car infrastructure people take their cars everywhere and watch the news and get scared and all that. We can think back to earlier times where this wasn't the case.

frobozz 4y ago

I have never seen this, and I live right by a school bus stop. The closest place a limited number of cars could wait is down a side road about 200ft from the stop, but they don't.