6 ms·

Well of course it is soaring. While everyone is happy boasting about how good the job numbers are, average Joe is having a hard time to afford gas and groceries

Well of course it is soaring. While everyone is happy boasting about how good the job numbers are, average Joe is having a hard time to afford gas and groceries with his still same wage gig job

SantalBlush 4y ago
From TFA: >What's happening: Spending on experiences, like travel and entertainment, has supplanted physical goods like clothing and home items as the purchases of choice for consumers. >Zoom out: For spendthrift consumers, a saving grace has been rising wages that, while failing to keep pace with surging inflation, are still rising at the fastest pace in decades. >They’re also bolstered by an unusually strong jobs market that has kept the unemployment rate below 4%, and given job seekers a lot of leverage. While those who boast about job numbers are indeed oversimplifying, complaining that "average Joe is having a hard time to afford gas and groceries with his still same wage gig job" is just false. It's a meme that people spread on the internet because it aligns with their personal views, not because it's backed by the data.
- janef0421 4y ago
  If wages are increasing at a rate less than inflation, real income is falling.
  - SantalBlush 4y ago
    Yes, this is correct. But that isn't what the parent comment was saying. If real wages were staying the same, it wouldn't affect someone's ability to afford gas and groceries on average. They were talking about nominal wages.
    - janef0421 4y ago
      They didn't specify whether they meant nominal or real wages, and their main point was that fuel and groceries were becoming less affordable.
      - SantalBlush 4y ago
        It doesn't make any sense to talk about groceries becoming less affordable with real wages staying flat, because grocery price levels are factored into the definition of a real wage.
        janef0421 4y ago
        Yes it does. The ongoing inflation is sectoral.
        SantalBlush 4y ago
        You haven't contradicted my statement. Maybe if you elaborate, you will. But "inflation is sectoral" has no bearing on the fact that rising grocery prices are a part of real wage computation.
- s_ting765 4y ago
  There is great incentive to show good numbers even when all is going downhill.[0] Even greater incentive when the authorities tasked with safeguarding financial securities and markets don't know whether they are looking at a recession or it just hit them on the face. There's been a great deal of public deception over the past 2-3 years on matters gdp, growth and overall market performance. The chicken has to come home to roost eventually. [0] https://www.marketwatch.com/story/how-companies-are-becoming-creative-with-accounting-during-the-covid-19-pandemic-2020-05-28 https://www.marketwatch.com/story/how-companies-are-becoming...
- djitz 4y ago
  Outside of the tech world, this is absolutely true. My wife is an elementary school teacher and a few of her coworkers have to drive for Lyft or do something similar a couple of nights per week or on weekends just to be able to afford their apartments. These aren’t exactly luxury digs, either.
  - nostrademons 4y ago
    Elementary school teacher (and other government jobs) are some of the worst in inflationary periods, though. You have a monopsony employer; usually some emotional attachment to the job; a school calendar that provides convenient quitting/rehiring times only once a year; and a seniority-based pay system that oftentimes makes you start at the bottom if you switch school districts. This prevents many teachers from job-hopping the way other professions would, which locks them out of the biggest sources of raises. When my mom started teaching in the late 60s, doctors/lawyers/engineers made only about 20-30% more than elementary school teachers. By the time she retired in the mid-00s, it was about 3x more, and my starting salary as a software engineer was basically equal to her retirement salary. 15 years into my career I was making 10x what she ever did.
    - aaaaaaaaata 4y ago
      That's not inflation as much as our society's shattered version of a meritocracy.
    - phkahler 4y ago
      >> usually some emotional attachment to the job; a school calendar that provides convenient quitting/rehiring times only once a year Don't forget that teachers generally have a pension plan. They also work for a district, which means changing employers requires relocating or drastically changing ones commute. It's also not viable to jump between "industries" due to that pension. They're fairly locked in and then taken advantage of.
  - SantalBlush 4y ago
    It is false, your anecdote notwithstanding. Nominal wages are not staying "still same" for the average person in the US. The Atlanta Fed posts the median nominal wage growth nationwide, which is around 6.7% as of June 2022 [0]. If we looked at the average, this number would be even higher, because outliers skew the distribution upwards. Now, if the statement were more like, "The average person is worse off in spite of wage growth because of inflation," I would wholly agree. But wages have not stayed the same. https://www.atlantafed.org/chcs/wage-growth-tracker https://www.atlantafed.org/chcs/wage-growth-tracker
- devwastaken 4y ago
  Data bias. Those that spend on experiences spend more. Physical labor jobs rarely increase or change wages.
- anm89 4y ago
  Lol. Go check out the Hoovervilles at your nearest city and report back I guess the caravans of hundreds to thousands of destitute boomers are just in it because they like the van life?
datavirtue 4y ago
Meanwhile, manufacturers are waiting with baited breath for a few people to trickle out of workforce development programs to fill jobs across a wide range of LIGHT manufacturing jobs using CNC, and additive 3D technologies. They will even hire you with no certificate, training, or proven work history with the expectation of training you. Unfortunately, most people given this opportunity have to be fired for a lack of productivity (bad work ethic). The world is waiting to be grabbed by the balls...still. Dump your shitty gig and get a job.
- ticviking 4y ago
  Having seen the working conditions in many of these places and the work ethic they expect, they(the employer) are being unrealistic. They expect young, unseasoned, immature employees to have the diligence and attention to detail of a 35 year old 10 year veteran, and generally aren't too on top of actually obeying labor laws or paying competitively with gig economy. The opportunity cost of "can't change my mind and do something better" is very high these days.

Well of course it is soaring. While everyone is happy boasting about how good the job numbers are, average Joe is having a hard time to afford gas and groceries with his still same wage gig job

SantalBlush 4y ago

From TFA: >What's happening: Spending on experiences, like travel and entertainment, has supplanted physical goods like clothing and home items as the purchases of choice for consumers. >Zoom out: For spendthrift consumers, a saving grace has been rising wages that, while failing to keep pace with surging inflation, are still rising at the fastest pace in decades. >They’re also bolstered by an unusually strong jobs market that has kept the unemployment rate below 4%, and given job seekers a lot of leverage. While those who boast about job numbers are indeed oversimplifying, complaining that "average Joe is having a hard time to afford gas and groceries with his still same wage gig job" is just false. It's a meme that people spread on the internet because it aligns with their personal views, not because it's backed by the data.

janef0421 4y ago
If wages are increasing at a rate less than inflation, real income is falling.
- SantalBlush 4y ago
  Yes, this is correct. But that isn't what the parent comment was saying. If real wages were staying the same, it wouldn't affect someone's ability to afford gas and groceries on average. They were talking about nominal wages.
  - janef0421 4y ago
    They didn't specify whether they meant nominal or real wages, and their main point was that fuel and groceries were becoming less affordable.
    - SantalBlush 4y ago
      It doesn't make any sense to talk about groceries becoming less affordable with real wages staying flat, because grocery price levels are factored into the definition of a real wage.
      - janef0421 4y ago
        Yes it does. The ongoing inflation is sectoral.
        SantalBlush 4y ago
        You haven't contradicted my statement. Maybe if you elaborate, you will. But "inflation is sectoral" has no bearing on the fact that rising grocery prices are a part of real wage computation.
s_ting765 4y ago
There is great incentive to show good numbers even when all is going downhill.[0] Even greater incentive when the authorities tasked with safeguarding financial securities and markets don't know whether they are looking at a recession or it just hit them on the face. There's been a great deal of public deception over the past 2-3 years on matters gdp, growth and overall market performance. The chicken has to come home to roost eventually. [0] https://www.marketwatch.com/story/how-companies-are-becoming-creative-with-accounting-during-the-covid-19-pandemic-2020-05-28 https://www.marketwatch.com/story/how-companies-are-becoming...
djitz 4y ago
Outside of the tech world, this is absolutely true. My wife is an elementary school teacher and a few of her coworkers have to drive for Lyft or do something similar a couple of nights per week or on weekends just to be able to afford their apartments. These aren’t exactly luxury digs, either.
- nostrademons 4y ago
  Elementary school teacher (and other government jobs) are some of the worst in inflationary periods, though. You have a monopsony employer; usually some emotional attachment to the job; a school calendar that provides convenient quitting/rehiring times only once a year; and a seniority-based pay system that oftentimes makes you start at the bottom if you switch school districts. This prevents many teachers from job-hopping the way other professions would, which locks them out of the biggest sources of raises. When my mom started teaching in the late 60s, doctors/lawyers/engineers made only about 20-30% more than elementary school teachers. By the time she retired in the mid-00s, it was about 3x more, and my starting salary as a software engineer was basically equal to her retirement salary. 15 years into my career I was making 10x what she ever did.
  - aaaaaaaaata 4y ago
    That's not inflation as much as our society's shattered version of a meritocracy.
  - phkahler 4y ago
    >> usually some emotional attachment to the job; a school calendar that provides convenient quitting/rehiring times only once a year Don't forget that teachers generally have a pension plan. They also work for a district, which means changing employers requires relocating or drastically changing ones commute. It's also not viable to jump between "industries" due to that pension. They're fairly locked in and then taken advantage of.
- SantalBlush 4y ago
  It is false, your anecdote notwithstanding. Nominal wages are not staying "still same" for the average person in the US. The Atlanta Fed posts the median nominal wage growth nationwide, which is around 6.7% as of June 2022 [0]. If we looked at the average, this number would be even higher, because outliers skew the distribution upwards. Now, if the statement were more like, "The average person is worse off in spite of wage growth because of inflation," I would wholly agree. But wages have not stayed the same. https://www.atlantafed.org/chcs/wage-growth-tracker https://www.atlantafed.org/chcs/wage-growth-tracker
devwastaken 4y ago
Data bias. Those that spend on experiences spend more. Physical labor jobs rarely increase or change wages.
anm89 4y ago
Lol. Go check out the Hoovervilles at your nearest city and report back I guess the caravans of hundreds to thousands of destitute boomers are just in it because they like the van life?

datavirtue 4y ago

Meanwhile, manufacturers are waiting with baited breath for a few people to trickle out of workforce development programs to fill jobs across a wide range of LIGHT manufacturing jobs using CNC, and additive 3D technologies. They will even hire you with no certificate, training, or proven work history with the expectation of training you. Unfortunately, most people given this opportunity have to be fired for a lack of productivity (bad work ethic). The world is waiting to be grabbed by the balls...still. Dump your shitty gig and get a job.

ticviking 4y ago
Having seen the working conditions in many of these places and the work ethic they expect, they(the employer) are being unrealistic. They expect young, unseasoned, immature employees to have the diligence and attention to detail of a 35 year old 10 year veteran, and generally aren't too on top of actually obeying labor laws or paying competitively with gig economy. The opportunity cost of "can't change my mind and do something better" is very high these days.