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People might dismiss your comment as shallow but I'll add a bit more accuracy: The concept of "Carbon footprint" was fabricated by Ogilvy & Mather a PR company

People might dismiss your comment as shallow but I'll add a bit more accuracy: The concept of "Carbon footprint" was fabricated by Ogilvy & Mather a PR company hired by BP, with the purpose of deflecting attention away from Oil&Gas industry and onto consumers.[0] [0] https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/23/big-oil-coined-carbon-footprints-to-blame-us-for-their-greed-keep-them-on-the-hook https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/23/big-oi...

gruez 4y ago
>The concept of "Carbon footprint" was fabricated by Ogilvy & Mather a PR company hired by BP, with the purpose of deflecting attention away from Oil&Gas industry and onto consumers.[0] What's "fabricated" about it? Are consumers not responsible for the carbon they emit through the gas they buy? If you drive a SUV or fly half way across the world for your vacation why should you be able to pass on the buck to BP/American Airlines?
- oifjsidjf 4y ago
  And in the end YOU will pay for it while big oil pays nothing.
  - gruez 4y ago
    Yeah, because at the end of the day you're burning the oil. If everyone stopped consuming oil, the oil companies will stop drilling. The inverse doesn't really hold. Just look at how gas prices have doubled yet everyone's still driving their cars.
    - DoingIsLearning 4y ago
      CO2 and NO2 emissions are an externalized cost for Oil&Gas industry. If I run a nuclear power business commissioning power plants I am responsible for the nuclear waste that is generated. That means that I have to internalize the cost of proper waste management to avoid environmental impact. If I run an Automotive business or a Refinery the emissions are a by-product of my activity. A costumer wants to go from A to B in a car they don't want to spew NO2 and physically reduce the longevity of everyone around them. For anything related to fossil fuels the industry has largely got away with externalizing the environmental costs of their activity. This is exactly the same as the plastic usage in packaging. Polluting saves on the industry bottom line, the externalized cost is somehow expected to be picked up by governments/citizens. This is the main point were we all disagree with you.
- rdm_blackhole 4y ago
  Do you have a choice in terms of what fuel you can use for your car because I don't. If you drive a diesel car, you can actually swap the diesel fuel with used cooking oil(after removing the impurities and doing a few modifications to the engine/car) Yet, it is still not legal in France(among other countries) to do so for example. Why? because the government does not want people to stop paying 60% taxes each and every time they go to the pump to refill their tank. Supposedly it will be legal soon but guess what, they are still going to tax the used cooking oil as if it was oil from the ground. So where is the incentive to switch? This has been know for the last 15 years if not more. So yeah, I ll say consumers are not responsible for this mess. Give people cheap EV and people will drive them. Where are they today? I am not a Musk die hard fan, but if Tesla had not shaken up the car companies and threaten them we would not even have electric vehicles today. What did we have 10 years ago? A hybrid from Toyota and a few other car makers and that was it.
  - DoingIsLearning 4y ago
    > This has been know for the last 15 years if not more. So yeah, I ll say consumers are not responsible for this mess. No this has been known for more than half a century. In 1958 Bell Labs Bell Science hour broadcast on public 'The Unchained goddess' a 1 hour documentary. Human caused climate change is addressed at about 50:00 mark. [0] Note this is a public documentary not confidential research. Since the early 80's Oil&Gas have adapted there oil platforms designs to deal with incoming sea level rises. [1] We have been conned into an Antropogenic Climate Crisis for profit. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1ph_7C1Jq4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1ph_7C1Jq4 [1] https://gizmodo.com/how-big-oil-rigs-the-system-to-keep-winning-1848180128 https://gizmodo.com/how-big-oil-rigs-the-system-to-keep-winn...
  - gruez 4y ago
    > Do you have a choice in terms of what fuel you can use for your car because I don't. >Give people cheap EV and people will drive them. Where are they today? I am not a Musk die hard fan, but if Tesla had not shaken up the car companies and threaten them we would not even have electric vehicles today. >What did we have 10 years ago? A hybrid from Toyota and a few other car makers and that was it. The way you juxtaposed this is weird. You're implying that if there isn't some pain-free way for consumers to quit fossil fuels then they're not responsible and it's all on governments/corporations. Fossil fuels are currently used because they're the cheapest source of energy, so it's entirely unreasonable to expect that you can quit them without making personal sacrifices. >Yet, it is still not legal in France(among other countries) to do so for example. Why? because the government does not want people to stop paying 60% taxes each and every time they go to the pump to refill their tank. >Supposedly it will be legal soon but guess what, they are still going to tax the used cooking oil as if it was oil from the ground. So where is the incentive to switch? That makes sense considering that the fuel taxes are for funding roads, not as some sort of carbon sin tax.
- dwild 4y ago
  > Are consumers not responsible for the carbon they emit through the gas they buy Sure we are responsible, but it's not our choice that this gas is emitted... we aren't the ones responsible to make the choice toward theses combustibles on the planes sadly. Shifting it over the ones that actually have control over whether they use more or less gas, is a great way to incentive them to go toward the one that use less gas, as they only want the cheaper options, not the best options. At the end of the day, we are still paying for it, but the one that do have the power to change it, now is the one that see it over their balance sheet.

gruez 4y ago

>The concept of "Carbon footprint" was fabricated by Ogilvy & Mather a PR company hired by BP, with the purpose of deflecting attention away from Oil&Gas industry and onto consumers.[0] What's "fabricated" about it? Are consumers not responsible for the carbon they emit through the gas they buy? If you drive a SUV or fly half way across the world for your vacation why should you be able to pass on the buck to BP/American Airlines?

oifjsidjf 4y ago
And in the end YOU will pay for it while big oil pays nothing.
- gruez 4y ago
  Yeah, because at the end of the day you're burning the oil. If everyone stopped consuming oil, the oil companies will stop drilling. The inverse doesn't really hold. Just look at how gas prices have doubled yet everyone's still driving their cars.
  - DoingIsLearning 4y ago
    CO2 and NO2 emissions are an externalized cost for Oil&Gas industry. If I run a nuclear power business commissioning power plants I am responsible for the nuclear waste that is generated. That means that I have to internalize the cost of proper waste management to avoid environmental impact. If I run an Automotive business or a Refinery the emissions are a by-product of my activity. A costumer wants to go from A to B in a car they don't want to spew NO2 and physically reduce the longevity of everyone around them. For anything related to fossil fuels the industry has largely got away with externalizing the environmental costs of their activity. This is exactly the same as the plastic usage in packaging. Polluting saves on the industry bottom line, the externalized cost is somehow expected to be picked up by governments/citizens. This is the main point were we all disagree with you.
rdm_blackhole 4y ago
Do you have a choice in terms of what fuel you can use for your car because I don't. If you drive a diesel car, you can actually swap the diesel fuel with used cooking oil(after removing the impurities and doing a few modifications to the engine/car) Yet, it is still not legal in France(among other countries) to do so for example. Why? because the government does not want people to stop paying 60% taxes each and every time they go to the pump to refill their tank. Supposedly it will be legal soon but guess what, they are still going to tax the used cooking oil as if it was oil from the ground. So where is the incentive to switch? This has been know for the last 15 years if not more. So yeah, I ll say consumers are not responsible for this mess. Give people cheap EV and people will drive them. Where are they today? I am not a Musk die hard fan, but if Tesla had not shaken up the car companies and threaten them we would not even have electric vehicles today. What did we have 10 years ago? A hybrid from Toyota and a few other car makers and that was it.
- DoingIsLearning 4y ago
  > This has been know for the last 15 years if not more. So yeah, I ll say consumers are not responsible for this mess. No this has been known for more than half a century. In 1958 Bell Labs Bell Science hour broadcast on public 'The Unchained goddess' a 1 hour documentary. Human caused climate change is addressed at about 50:00 mark. [0] Note this is a public documentary not confidential research. Since the early 80's Oil&Gas have adapted there oil platforms designs to deal with incoming sea level rises. [1] We have been conned into an Antropogenic Climate Crisis for profit. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1ph_7C1Jq4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1ph_7C1Jq4 [1] https://gizmodo.com/how-big-oil-rigs-the-system-to-keep-winning-1848180128 https://gizmodo.com/how-big-oil-rigs-the-system-to-keep-winn...
- gruez 4y ago
  > Do you have a choice in terms of what fuel you can use for your car because I don't. >Give people cheap EV and people will drive them. Where are they today? I am not a Musk die hard fan, but if Tesla had not shaken up the car companies and threaten them we would not even have electric vehicles today. >What did we have 10 years ago? A hybrid from Toyota and a few other car makers and that was it. The way you juxtaposed this is weird. You're implying that if there isn't some pain-free way for consumers to quit fossil fuels then they're not responsible and it's all on governments/corporations. Fossil fuels are currently used because they're the cheapest source of energy, so it's entirely unreasonable to expect that you can quit them without making personal sacrifices. >Yet, it is still not legal in France(among other countries) to do so for example. Why? because the government does not want people to stop paying 60% taxes each and every time they go to the pump to refill their tank. >Supposedly it will be legal soon but guess what, they are still going to tax the used cooking oil as if it was oil from the ground. So where is the incentive to switch? That makes sense considering that the fuel taxes are for funding roads, not as some sort of carbon sin tax.
dwild 4y ago
> Are consumers not responsible for the carbon they emit through the gas they buy Sure we are responsible, but it's not our choice that this gas is emitted... we aren't the ones responsible to make the choice toward theses combustibles on the planes sadly. Shifting it over the ones that actually have control over whether they use more or less gas, is a great way to incentive them to go toward the one that use less gas, as they only want the cheaper options, not the best options. At the end of the day, we are still paying for it, but the one that do have the power to change it, now is the one that see it over their balance sheet.