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How well does FreeBSD support a “modern” web backend? Does Java run here? Mono (C#)? Node.js? PostgreSQL? Any noSQL databases?

sophacles 4y ago
For the most part: yes. The one I'm not sure of is Mono. That being said, some tooling assumes linux sometimes, but the popular stuff is generally gtg, especially if you get it via the ports tree.
- Yuioup 4y ago
  dotnet core is not supported
carlavilla 4y ago
You can run Spring with Java 17 in FreeBSD without problems. Same with Node.js, Postgres and MongoDB for example. About Mono, I don’t have experience with this environment. But I’m using the other technologies at my work without problems.
whalesalad 4y ago
In the server sense, FreeBSD will do essentially everything that Linux does as far as running software. For your examples, yes.
pid_0 4y ago
pjmlp 4y ago
I guess calling POSIX modern is a point of view, unless a language runtime is bound to Linux specific syscalls, any UNIX like OS will run "modern" web backends. From that point of view, you can even do "modern" web backends on IBM and Unisys mainframes, using their POSIX environments. And yes, they do actually support everything on that list, by the way, mainframes invented noSQL databases before SQL was a thing, have a look on ISAM.
- trasz 4y ago
  Very, very few things depend on Linux-specific syscalls. There are two reasons for this: first, they are unportable, so you need another code path for everything !Linux anyway, and even when you only care about Linux you can't assume those syscalls are available, because you first need to get them into the kernel, then into glibc, which is a separate project, and then you need to ship them in the distro, which in some cases (RHEL) means either waiting half a decade or porting it to a kernel half a decade old. And no, there aren't many things you can run on z/OS POSIX environment, because it fails to support absolutely basic things, like fork(2). >mainframes invented noSQL databases before SQL was a thing I'm not sure about this; structured storage was popular before Unix made flat files common, but there was a fundamental flaw in how it was implemented: it was all in the kernel, not on top of it.
  - pjmlp 4y ago
    Who said anything about z/OS? There are other mainframes to chose from. In any case, in what concerns "modern" Web development, z/OS has you covered, https://www.ibm.com/products/open-enterprise-sdk-go-zos https://www.ibm.com/products/open-enterprise-sdk-go-zos https://www.ibm.com/support/pages/java-sdk-products-zos https://www.ibm.com/support/pages/java-sdk-products-zos https://www.ibm.com/products/sdk-nodejs-compiler-zos https://www.ibm.com/products/sdk-nodejs-compiler-zos
    - trasz 4y ago
      What mainframes are still alive, apart from z/Architecture? As for "modern Web development" - not really; it's a bit like running Apache and MySQL on Windows 98 - yes, you technically could, but you probably don't want to. Have you heard of anyone wilfully choosing to use mainframes instead of some Unix over the past two decades?
      - pjmlp 4y ago
        IBM i, Unisy ClearPath and OS/2200, related offerings, now you can feel pedantic and differentiate which of them are proper mainframes, which are mini, microcomputers or whatever. We are discussing technicalities here, the whole point started about Linux isn't the only way to have access to such called "modern" Web tools. Technically they exist in any UNIX environment, mainframes (or whatever you feel like calling them), and Windows. Missing stuff like fork () doesn't even matter for most of those runtimes. https://www.usenix.org/publications/login/fall2016/atlidakis https://www.usenix.org/publications/login/fall2016/atlidakis
tomc1985 4y ago
Haven't tried Mono, Node, or anything NoSQL, but Java, Ruby, and Postgres all run pretty well. It is runtime-compatibile with Linux executables and you can even install a linux distro in a jail https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/setting-up-a-debian-linux-jail-on-freebsd.68434/ https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/setting-up-a-debian-linux...
- tester756 4y ago
  here people mess with FreeBSD afaik: Building the .NET Core SDK on FreeBSD https://github.com/dotnet/source-build/issues/1139 https://github.com/dotnet/source-build/issues/1139
RogerDeanCraig 4y ago

sophacles 4y ago

For the most part: yes. The one I'm not sure of is Mono. That being said, some tooling assumes linux sometimes, but the popular stuff is generally gtg, especially if you get it via the ports tree.

Yuioup 4y ago
dotnet core is not supported

carlavilla 4y ago

You can run Spring with Java 17 in FreeBSD without problems. Same with Node.js, Postgres and MongoDB for example. About Mono, I don’t have experience with this environment. But I’m using the other technologies at my work without problems.

whalesalad 4y ago

In the server sense, FreeBSD will do essentially everything that Linux does as far as running software. For your examples, yes.

pid_0 4y ago

pjmlp 4y ago

I guess calling POSIX modern is a point of view, unless a language runtime is bound to Linux specific syscalls, any UNIX like OS will run "modern" web backends. From that point of view, you can even do "modern" web backends on IBM and Unisys mainframes, using their POSIX environments. And yes, they do actually support everything on that list, by the way, mainframes invented noSQL databases before SQL was a thing, have a look on ISAM.

trasz 4y ago
Very, very few things depend on Linux-specific syscalls. There are two reasons for this: first, they are unportable, so you need another code path for everything !Linux anyway, and even when you only care about Linux you can't assume those syscalls are available, because you first need to get them into the kernel, then into glibc, which is a separate project, and then you need to ship them in the distro, which in some cases (RHEL) means either waiting half a decade or porting it to a kernel half a decade old. And no, there aren't many things you can run on z/OS POSIX environment, because it fails to support absolutely basic things, like fork(2). >mainframes invented noSQL databases before SQL was a thing I'm not sure about this; structured storage was popular before Unix made flat files common, but there was a fundamental flaw in how it was implemented: it was all in the kernel, not on top of it.
- pjmlp 4y ago
  Who said anything about z/OS? There are other mainframes to chose from. In any case, in what concerns "modern" Web development, z/OS has you covered, https://www.ibm.com/products/open-enterprise-sdk-go-zos https://www.ibm.com/products/open-enterprise-sdk-go-zos https://www.ibm.com/support/pages/java-sdk-products-zos https://www.ibm.com/support/pages/java-sdk-products-zos https://www.ibm.com/products/sdk-nodejs-compiler-zos https://www.ibm.com/products/sdk-nodejs-compiler-zos
  - trasz 4y ago
    What mainframes are still alive, apart from z/Architecture? As for "modern Web development" - not really; it's a bit like running Apache and MySQL on Windows 98 - yes, you technically could, but you probably don't want to. Have you heard of anyone wilfully choosing to use mainframes instead of some Unix over the past two decades?
    - pjmlp 4y ago
      IBM i, Unisy ClearPath and OS/2200, related offerings, now you can feel pedantic and differentiate which of them are proper mainframes, which are mini, microcomputers or whatever. We are discussing technicalities here, the whole point started about Linux isn't the only way to have access to such called "modern" Web tools. Technically they exist in any UNIX environment, mainframes (or whatever you feel like calling them), and Windows. Missing stuff like fork () doesn't even matter for most of those runtimes. https://www.usenix.org/publications/login/fall2016/atlidakis https://www.usenix.org/publications/login/fall2016/atlidakis

tomc1985 4y ago

Haven't tried Mono, Node, or anything NoSQL, but Java, Ruby, and Postgres all run pretty well. It is runtime-compatibile with Linux executables and you can even install a linux distro in a jail https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/setting-up-a-debian-linux-jail-on-freebsd.68434/ https://forums.freebsd.org/threads/setting-up-a-debian-linux...

tester756 4y ago
here people mess with FreeBSD afaik: Building the .NET Core SDK on FreeBSD https://github.com/dotnet/source-build/issues/1139 https://github.com/dotnet/source-build/issues/1139

RogerDeanCraig 4y ago