4 ms·
If you can give details about those 3 and their reasons, perhaps you have a slight chance of convincing others that people have valid reasons for suicide other
by PakG1 15y ago
If you can give details about those 3 and their reasons, perhaps you have a slight chance of convincing others that people have valid reasons for suicide other than depression. But EVERY case I've ever heard/seen (and maybe my sample is too small to be reflective of reality) points to depression as the leading and possibly only cause. There may have been root causes of that depression that were hell on earth, but the "but for" test still says depression was the direct cause of suicide in every case I've ever seen/read about/etc.
While I don't know any personally, I know people who know others who had living hell (eg. rape by father, impregnated, abortion). Those people got support, were able to fight back, and regained their lives. What made them different from others was the depression factor, and it's easy to conclude that the support others gave to help them stand up again prevented depression from taking hold.
You're making a very difficult-to-believe claim (for me for sure, and probably for others, given your downvotes) that depression had no factors in those 3 suicides, and an additional difficult-to-believe claim that it's not reasonable to conclude that depression is a leading factor in suicide in general.
Some details would be appreciated if you're going to make such difficult-to-believe claims.
edit: And if you would make the clarification again that you never claimed that depression wasn't a leading cause, just that it's not necessarily a factor, I don't see how that's a profitable statement. People have to make decisions and judgments all the time with incomplete information. Until the picture is 100% known here, it is logical to conclude what the numbers say: depression was a factor, if not the leading factor.
- partition 15y agoI say that "depression" along with "mental illness" are cop-out concepts used to shift the burden off society and onto the individual, by placing blame on some nebulous, bullshit entity. I believe that the "root causes" of depression are what actually deserve any attention, and they are a combination of genes, society, environment and psychology that has been ingrained by these factors. Depression is like smoke from a fire, and we're currently treating it by installing fans to blow the smoke away. This has been supported by research psychology about what makes a fulfilling life: a sense of autonomy, mastery, and relatedness. I guarantee you that someone missing even one of these will be "depressed." What do we say then? We don't think about how the environment he's living in is not encouraging these things, and we don't think about specific actions he can take to improve these factors. No, we just say "Depression!" and tell him to go the therapist. Most people in modern society have eaten this psychiatry bullshit whole and as a consequence are more fit to tend houseplants than to maintain even the shallowest of friends. So NO, what made the people who went through living hell different wasn't the fucking fake concept that is "depression", it was the SUPPORT. I say we don't ever talk about depression. The very existence of the word "depression" pushes real societal and individual shortcomings and responsibility off the table. We talk about what's going right and what's going wrong in the person's life, and if we don't have good advice on how to fix the things that are wrong, at least stop trying to grandstand and signal your social status with some useless platitudes and endlessly repeated refrains about the benefits of therapy and medication.
- PakG1 15y agoI think that's unfair. I agree with what you're saying, but not your conclusion. Depression is probably only a symptom of deeper issues, but people who truly care don't use the word as a cop-out to not help someone. If anything, it's a very useful indicator that someone needs help, and for this reason, we shouldn't throw away the word. Rather, we should demonstrate more willingness to care and dive deep into the messy bits, which I think a lot of people unfortunately don't wish to do because they're too busy with their own things.