5 ms·

> Musk's popularity is largely BECAUSE of his Twitter antics I don't really buy this. I knew loads of Musk fanboys who were crazy about him before Teslas even

> Musk's popularity is largely BECAUSE of his Twitter antics I don't really buy this. I knew loads of Musk fanboys who were crazy about him before Teslas even become available. The 50+ folks that I'm friends with have mostly never used Twitter or read a Musk tweet, but they think Teslas are cool and are reminded that StarLink brought rural Ontario better internet than our own government tried to do for decades. Obviously Musk is an ass on Twitter (and probably in person), but like a lot of neuroatypicals, their talent seemingly makes up for their abrasiveness.

wahern 4y ago
> I don't really buy this. I think you're both correct. My experience is as you described, but Musk has also developed a following among political conservatives attracted to his abrasive, thumb-nosing antics.
- jollybean 4y ago
  It's not 'conservatives' as 1/2 of them loath that stuff - and 'agitation' is traditionally an artifact of leftist populism (with traditional conservatives usually being small-c, establishment, older etc.) - it's more a bit of a businessy libertarianism, with hints of anti establishmentism that's in many ways more popular among the youth. Also, it's a hugely populist and international appeal, spreading his 'Noisy Tweets' around the globe. See how much more popular he is now that he makes 'controversial' statements [1] It's as PR trick as old as time. Edit: but yes, technically he has taken a public shift to the 'Current American Right' in the mysterious political situation we are in, that's fair to say. Just wanted to indicate it's a 'new and kind of specific normal'. [1] https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=CA&q=%2Fm%2F03nzf1 https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=CA&q=%...
  - cycomanic 4y ago
    I appreciate your analysis, but would like to add that I feel that "traditional conservatives" seem to have largely disappeared or become voiceless not only in the US but also in other places like e.g. the UK. I imagine in decades prior traditional conservatives would have found people like Trump or Boris Johnson obscene and distasteful. However, I don't see many of that old guard speak out against them. It seems with the reducing success projections due to changing demographics, many see winning as more important than values. Or at least that is my only explanation.
    - netsharc 4y ago
      > many see winning as more important than values. Interesting thought. For some analogy, if a bunch of skinheads joined my local baseball team and started playing dirty against the other teams and became the champions, would I care that my team has been hijacked, or would I not care because now my team is winning? Obviously in the political example, the skinheads talk about "values" and people who want to be deluded just nod and repeat "values!", or they demonize the opponents by saying they'll bring in "dirty migrants", etc...
    - onos 4y ago
      I wonder if the lack of voices you notice is at all related to the well-publicized data indicating conservatives do not feel they can express their opinions publicly without risk of punishment.
      - mjmsmith 4y ago
        It's a demonstrated fact that traditional conservatives are punished for expressing the opinion that Donald Trump is obscene and distasteful.
        jollybean 4y ago
        I think you and onos are not quite making the same point. Conservative voices are a bit suppressed in some places, like on Campus. Some don't like to accept that, but it's true. But it's a kind of Social Justice institutionalism that would be the issue there. Otherwise, 'classical conservatives' who voice their opinion against Trump, are also ostracized by that far right gang, which is very true. So that's a different kind of 'fear to speak up'. Liz Cheney is getting punted out of Office for that right now. But that has always existed - the centre/far elements of 'each side' definitely have wars. You can see it play out at the NYT editorial staff among the Social Justice left (younger) and the Traditional Liberal left (middle aged). I don't feel that Musk can be reasonably located anywhere in there.
        antifa 4y ago
- rgbrenner 4y ago
  thats definitely a recent development. conservatives weren't big proponents of early EVs.
  - detaro 4y ago
    Liking him for railing against government agencies and brash style doesn't necessarily mean they are EV fans.
  - ThunderSizzle 4y ago
    Conservatives still aren't a proponent of EV, especially government mandates for them or to pay for them. That has nothing to do with Conservatives liking or disliking someone. I guess Conservatives are just better at respecting people they don't agree with on everything.
  - kortilla 4y ago
    Neither was Musk, which is sort of the whole point of Tesla.
jollybean 4y ago
The fanboyism is quite considerably amplified by his public statements. Without them, we may not get much press at all from him, he may be a bit of an unknown quantity. His Social Media / PR is a gigantic part of his value. It distorts reality to a much, much larger audience. Do you remember 'Maroon 5' the band? They had 'Really Big Hits' back in the day . Banger / Chart toppers. But it wasn't until the lead singer was on 'The Voice' did it make them a 'Household Global Name'. There were a poppy band with a tiny bit of an edge that appealed to a demographic, now, they are like 'Jeopardy and Wheel of Fortune' - multigeneratoinal giants. Musk has fanboys that are Dentists in Malaysia, street kids in Cairo, wannabe ballers in mid level cities in China etc. etc..
- pooper 4y ago
  I wouldn't call myself a fanboy but I believed he genuinely wanted to advance the electric car, no matter who ends up coming on top. This was the version of reality I saw in 2009 ish. The goal was not to make money. I thought he actually wanted to show the big carmakers that you can actually sell an electric car. Back then I didn't know about how good public transit is better than even the cleanest electric car because I had never experienced good public transit and well I have very limited imagination (I thought the Dropbox was a sucker that I was taking advantage of because I could get extra 50 MB or whatever by just walking up to someone in my dorm and referring them to use Dropbox, even if they had no intention to continue using Dropbox...)
  - jollybean 4y ago
    He still does the car for the same reasons, and it's still 'a good thing for green' he's just a bit older, a bit fatter, a bit richer (and targeted by 'socialists' a bit more often), he's a bit more irritated, and frankly, anyone who starts to let loose on Twitter is going to make waves. About 80% of the people that I respect, I have lost respect for because of Twitter. They just can't help themselves with the populism.
  - sbf501 4y ago
    Musk's companies have done some truly amazing things. He absolutely created enough buzz with Tesla to put EVs on the map, after they were fading. Battery tech. StarLink. SpaceX. They are all long overdue. Also: He's a complete hobgoblin of a human being. Both things can be true.
rgbrenner 4y ago
note, musk created his twitter account in 2009... shortly after he became tesla's CEO. So unless you're talking about the original roadster, his twitter account existed before those people learned about tesla/musk. Musk has pretty much used Twitter has his primary media communication method. Going so far as to say Tesla has no marketing budget because he's such a star on twitter. He has practically zero reach elsewhere. Sure, if he publishes on another platform, people will pay attention, but he doesn't... twitter is pretty much the way he communicates with the world. If you dont think twitter is the reason you know Musk, then let me ask you this: who was the CEO of Fiskar? They released their EV product shortly before the model S. But you dont know the guys name do you? The product isnt why we know musk.
- falcolas 4y ago
  Musk was pretty well known prior to Tesla because he was one of the PayPal co-founders (technically a co-founder of X.com which merged with Confinity to form PayPal).
  - andsoitis 4y ago
    > Musk was pretty well known prior to Tesla because he was one of the PayPal co-founders Well known outside of tech? I don't think so.
  - rtkwe 4y ago
    I'll say as a person who was just coming out of HS and not in tech yet at that point I don't think I had any idea who Musk was until after he come into Tesla. I'll also say he wasn't as wild on his twitter till after Tesla and SpaceX bumped up his public profile.

wahern 4y ago

> I don't really buy this. I think you're both correct. My experience is as you described, but Musk has also developed a following among political conservatives attracted to his abrasive, thumb-nosing antics.

jollybean 4y ago
It's not 'conservatives' as 1/2 of them loath that stuff - and 'agitation' is traditionally an artifact of leftist populism (with traditional conservatives usually being small-c, establishment, older etc.) - it's more a bit of a businessy libertarianism, with hints of anti establishmentism that's in many ways more popular among the youth. Also, it's a hugely populist and international appeal, spreading his 'Noisy Tweets' around the globe. See how much more popular he is now that he makes 'controversial' statements [1] It's as PR trick as old as time. Edit: but yes, technically he has taken a public shift to the 'Current American Right' in the mysterious political situation we are in, that's fair to say. Just wanted to indicate it's a 'new and kind of specific normal'. [1] https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=CA&q=%2Fm%2F03nzf1 https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=CA&q=%...
- cycomanic 4y ago
  I appreciate your analysis, but would like to add that I feel that "traditional conservatives" seem to have largely disappeared or become voiceless not only in the US but also in other places like e.g. the UK. I imagine in decades prior traditional conservatives would have found people like Trump or Boris Johnson obscene and distasteful. However, I don't see many of that old guard speak out against them. It seems with the reducing success projections due to changing demographics, many see winning as more important than values. Or at least that is my only explanation.
  - netsharc 4y ago
    > many see winning as more important than values. Interesting thought. For some analogy, if a bunch of skinheads joined my local baseball team and started playing dirty against the other teams and became the champions, would I care that my team has been hijacked, or would I not care because now my team is winning? Obviously in the political example, the skinheads talk about "values" and people who want to be deluded just nod and repeat "values!", or they demonize the opponents by saying they'll bring in "dirty migrants", etc...
  - onos 4y ago
    I wonder if the lack of voices you notice is at all related to the well-publicized data indicating conservatives do not feel they can express their opinions publicly without risk of punishment.
    - mjmsmith 4y ago
      It's a demonstrated fact that traditional conservatives are punished for expressing the opinion that Donald Trump is obscene and distasteful.
      - jollybean 4y ago
        I think you and onos are not quite making the same point. Conservative voices are a bit suppressed in some places, like on Campus. Some don't like to accept that, but it's true. But it's a kind of Social Justice institutionalism that would be the issue there. Otherwise, 'classical conservatives' who voice their opinion against Trump, are also ostracized by that far right gang, which is very true. So that's a different kind of 'fear to speak up'. Liz Cheney is getting punted out of Office for that right now. But that has always existed - the centre/far elements of 'each side' definitely have wars. You can see it play out at the NYT editorial staff among the Social Justice left (younger) and the Traditional Liberal left (middle aged). I don't feel that Musk can be reasonably located anywhere in there.
        antifa 4y ago
rgbrenner 4y ago
thats definitely a recent development. conservatives weren't big proponents of early EVs.
- detaro 4y ago
  Liking him for railing against government agencies and brash style doesn't necessarily mean they are EV fans.
- ThunderSizzle 4y ago
  Conservatives still aren't a proponent of EV, especially government mandates for them or to pay for them. That has nothing to do with Conservatives liking or disliking someone. I guess Conservatives are just better at respecting people they don't agree with on everything.
- kortilla 4y ago
  Neither was Musk, which is sort of the whole point of Tesla.

jollybean 4y ago

The fanboyism is quite considerably amplified by his public statements. Without them, we may not get much press at all from him, he may be a bit of an unknown quantity. His Social Media / PR is a gigantic part of his value. It distorts reality to a much, much larger audience. Do you remember 'Maroon 5' the band? They had 'Really Big Hits' back in the day . Banger / Chart toppers. But it wasn't until the lead singer was on 'The Voice' did it make them a 'Household Global Name'. There were a poppy band with a tiny bit of an edge that appealed to a demographic, now, they are like 'Jeopardy and Wheel of Fortune' - multigeneratoinal giants. Musk has fanboys that are Dentists in Malaysia, street kids in Cairo, wannabe ballers in mid level cities in China etc. etc..

pooper 4y ago
I wouldn't call myself a fanboy but I believed he genuinely wanted to advance the electric car, no matter who ends up coming on top. This was the version of reality I saw in 2009 ish. The goal was not to make money. I thought he actually wanted to show the big carmakers that you can actually sell an electric car. Back then I didn't know about how good public transit is better than even the cleanest electric car because I had never experienced good public transit and well I have very limited imagination (I thought the Dropbox was a sucker that I was taking advantage of because I could get extra 50 MB or whatever by just walking up to someone in my dorm and referring them to use Dropbox, even if they had no intention to continue using Dropbox...)
- jollybean 4y ago
  He still does the car for the same reasons, and it's still 'a good thing for green' he's just a bit older, a bit fatter, a bit richer (and targeted by 'socialists' a bit more often), he's a bit more irritated, and frankly, anyone who starts to let loose on Twitter is going to make waves. About 80% of the people that I respect, I have lost respect for because of Twitter. They just can't help themselves with the populism.
- sbf501 4y ago
  Musk's companies have done some truly amazing things. He absolutely created enough buzz with Tesla to put EVs on the map, after they were fading. Battery tech. StarLink. SpaceX. They are all long overdue. Also: He's a complete hobgoblin of a human being. Both things can be true.

rgbrenner 4y ago

note, musk created his twitter account in 2009... shortly after he became tesla's CEO. So unless you're talking about the original roadster, his twitter account existed before those people learned about tesla/musk. Musk has pretty much used Twitter has his primary media communication method. Going so far as to say Tesla has no marketing budget because he's such a star on twitter. He has practically zero reach elsewhere. Sure, if he publishes on another platform, people will pay attention, but he doesn't... twitter is pretty much the way he communicates with the world. If you dont think twitter is the reason you know Musk, then let me ask you this: who was the CEO of Fiskar? They released their EV product shortly before the model S. But you dont know the guys name do you? The product isnt why we know musk.

falcolas 4y ago
Musk was pretty well known prior to Tesla because he was one of the PayPal co-founders (technically a co-founder of X.com which merged with Confinity to form PayPal).
- andsoitis 4y ago
  > Musk was pretty well known prior to Tesla because he was one of the PayPal co-founders Well known outside of tech? I don't think so.
- rtkwe 4y ago
  I'll say as a person who was just coming out of HS and not in tech yet at that point I don't think I had any idea who Musk was until after he come into Tesla. I'll also say he wasn't as wild on his twitter till after Tesla and SpaceX bumped up his public profile.