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Just thinking today of a dark pattern that Twitter uses, amongst others. "Would you like notifications to your desktop?" "Yes" "Not now" For any web site desi

Just thinking today of a dark pattern that Twitter uses, amongst others. "Would you like notifications to your desktop?" "Yes" "Not now" For any web site designers who think this is acceptable, there will be a special purgatory for you. The opposite of Yes is "No". If you want a third option, "remind me later", great. Otherwise, piss off.

djbusby 4y ago
It's not the designer. It's the product "manager" that makes these dumb choices - even when their UI/UX team pushes back.
- fatherzine 4y ago
  It's not the person, it's the system. The market for attention makes the choice, iteratively. If this product manager doesn't do it, his numbers go to shit and he's fired to be replaced with that product manager, with a "better" track record. Who will employ all the dark patterns he can get away with, and keep his track record "stellar".
  - JohnFen 4y ago
    Maybe so, but the PM is still taking hostile action against the users. If the company requires such behavior and employees go along with it, it's still totally fair to blame the employees as well as the company.
uncletaco 4y ago
This has been the case since the dawn of notifications and most choices by apps in general. They don't want you to say no. At least on iphone notifications aren't baked into features like play and pause buttons. Iirc on Android you only get media controls outside of the app if you enable notifications and then you have to fine tune them if all you want are media controls. I can't help but feel like that in itself is a darker pattern.
tippytippytango 4y ago
This one makes me angry every time it comes up. I'm very selective of the notifications I allow on my devices in order to protect my attention, and some product manager has the audacity to assume I need to give loud strangers on the internet the ability to rob me of my finite attention whenever they have a hot take.
ThrustVectoring 4y ago
The pattern is usually worse than you think, because you click "not now". Typically, the browser or phone OS does enforce a yes-or-no answer, and if you pick "no" the site or app is not allowed to ask again. So the "Would you like notifications" screen doesn't actually use the host program's API to enable notifications, it just brings up the dialog and asks you again. This often means that there is a "no and stop asking" option. You just have to realize which dialogs are brought up by the application or the host environment, "accept" the application's request, and then deny the actual permissions request.
- Consultant32452 4y ago
  Yep, if the web page asks if I want notifications, I click "Yes" and then when my browser asks, I say "No." Permanently blocked and worked around the broken anti-user pattern.
  - horsawlarway 4y ago
    I don't want them ever: chrome://settings/content/notifications check the box next to - "Don't allow sites to send notifications Features that need notifications won't work" --- edit: I'll add, a lot of times you'll still need to click "yes" to the site popup asking if you want notifications, so the shitty user tracking they're doing will mark you as enabled. But it skips the second step of having to click no to the actual browser prompt.
    - rnk 4y ago
      The question is what notifications won't show up? Maybe a 'you have email' or 'you have a meeting in 10 minutes'. Only the meeting notification is useful to me out of the thousands of times websites asked. Thanks for pointing out that setting.

djbusby 4y ago

It's not the designer. It's the product "manager" that makes these dumb choices - even when their UI/UX team pushes back.

fatherzine 4y ago
It's not the person, it's the system. The market for attention makes the choice, iteratively. If this product manager doesn't do it, his numbers go to shit and he's fired to be replaced with that product manager, with a "better" track record. Who will employ all the dark patterns he can get away with, and keep his track record "stellar".
- JohnFen 4y ago
  Maybe so, but the PM is still taking hostile action against the users. If the company requires such behavior and employees go along with it, it's still totally fair to blame the employees as well as the company.

uncletaco 4y ago

This has been the case since the dawn of notifications and most choices by apps in general. They don't want you to say no. At least on iphone notifications aren't baked into features like play and pause buttons. Iirc on Android you only get media controls outside of the app if you enable notifications and then you have to fine tune them if all you want are media controls. I can't help but feel like that in itself is a darker pattern.

tippytippytango 4y ago

This one makes me angry every time it comes up. I'm very selective of the notifications I allow on my devices in order to protect my attention, and some product manager has the audacity to assume I need to give loud strangers on the internet the ability to rob me of my finite attention whenever they have a hot take.

ThrustVectoring 4y ago

The pattern is usually worse than you think, because you click "not now". Typically, the browser or phone OS does enforce a yes-or-no answer, and if you pick "no" the site or app is not allowed to ask again. So the "Would you like notifications" screen doesn't actually use the host program's API to enable notifications, it just brings up the dialog and asks you again. This often means that there is a "no and stop asking" option. You just have to realize which dialogs are brought up by the application or the host environment, "accept" the application's request, and then deny the actual permissions request.

Consultant32452 4y ago
Yep, if the web page asks if I want notifications, I click "Yes" and then when my browser asks, I say "No." Permanently blocked and worked around the broken anti-user pattern.
- horsawlarway 4y ago
  I don't want them ever: chrome://settings/content/notifications check the box next to - "Don't allow sites to send notifications Features that need notifications won't work" --- edit: I'll add, a lot of times you'll still need to click "yes" to the site popup asking if you want notifications, so the shitty user tracking they're doing will mark you as enabled. But it skips the second step of having to click no to the actual browser prompt.
  - rnk 4y ago
    The question is what notifications won't show up? Maybe a 'you have email' or 'you have a meeting in 10 minutes'. Only the meeting notification is useful to me out of the thousands of times websites asked. Thanks for pointing out that setting.