4 ms·

Are these new jobs or recently vacant ones?

bombcar 4y ago
From what I've seen, many many companies are still suffering from post-Covid rehiring problems. Airports, restaurants, almost all service industries are severely understaffed and continue to be so. I wonder how many people have decided to permanently leave the workforce - I know a number of families where one parent stopped working during covid and has no plans to return.
- radpanda 4y ago
  This feels like it matches my anecdata as well. Some folks in positions where they have the choice to work or not work are staying on the sidelines. I know a school administrator who retired earlier than planned rather than deal with the madness, I know a college kid who just took the summer off rather than get a summer job, I know a speech therapist turned stay-at-home mom, etc. Rather than a few years ago when people's decision calculus was "do I want to trade my time for $X/hr to do some work?" it feels like it's become "do I want to trade my time for $X/hr AND risk getting myself or family members seriously sick AND deal with unhinged people at a time of political strife?" And sure, the X in $X/hr has gone up, but apparently not enough to convince as many people to wait tables as in 2019.
  - spaceman_2020 4y ago
    A number of friends made a bunch of money from stocks and crypto and decided to quit their jobs and build something of their own. They always had plans to do it but never enough savings to take the leap.
  - shusaku 4y ago
    You can look at the labor force participation rate: https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/labor-force-participation-rate https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/labor-force-parti... But I think controlling for demographic factors would take some work (look at the drop past 2000)
    - lotsofpulp 4y ago
      A more official source: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CIVPART https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CIVPART
      - bombcar 4y ago
        More interesting than the drop at 2020 is the continual decline since 2000.
        jhickok 4y ago
        Prime age participation is actually pretty high: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNS11300060 https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNS11300060
        lotsofpulp 4y ago
        If the conversation is about price of labor, then the ratio of aggregate labor sellers to labor buyers is the relevant metric to compare over the years. For example, more old people or otherwise disabled people wanting to buy labor relative to people willing and able to supply it, compared to previous decades.
        jhickok 4y ago
        Thanks, that's an interesting way to look at it.
    - jhickok 4y ago
      Prime age work force participation is still high. A lot of the people that left the labor force were retirement age people that saw their retirement money go up by 50% or more and didn't really see a reason to come back.
- localhost 4y ago
  My anecdata: the McDonald's in my area still hasn't opened up its in-restaurant seating because they can't staff it. Drive-through only.
  - symfoniq 4y ago
    Restaurants in my area are still having staffing issues, too, to the point that some are completely closed on random days they'd normally be open.
    - moate 4y ago
      As someone who spent a decade burning and bleeding for the restaurant industry: Fucking great. If there's one sector that needs its entire economic plan blown up and rebooted, it's restaurants. The fact that labor has seemingly collectively walked away from restaurants en masse has been one of the best things about the pandemic. Of course it's complicated (What about the ability for people to source food from restaurants, what about other economic factors that go into it, poor sad owners who invested all their money, went belly up, and now have to act like the labor they abused, "not all restaurants", etc) but the food service industry is one of the most vile, exploitative sectors out there and the schadenfreude over it getting a swift kick in the teeth has been massive.
    - Consultant32452 4y ago
      Some of the fast food stores in my area still have their dining areas closed due to short staffing.
  - shapefrog 4y ago
    Alternate theory: they havent opend the in-restaurant seating becuase they make more money keeping it closed and operating drive-through (and delivery) only.
    - bombcar 4y ago
      The only real difference is cleaning staff on the in-restaurant seating and maybe one more employee for the register (though many seem to be slow enough to have one person doing double-duty). Out here in the sticks everything is basically back to normal, though one restaurant that was already on the edge appears to be slowly folding.
- Consultant32452 4y ago
  As the other poster said, this matches my anecdata also. I will also add that I know multiple families who have decided to home school permanently, and that added extra incentive for the family to stay in the single income status.
salawat 4y ago
Rehiring I'll bet.

From what I've seen, many many companies are still suffering from post-Covid rehiring problems. Airports, restaurants, almost all service industries are severely understaffed and continue to be so. I wonder how many people have decided to permanently leave the workforce - I know a number of families where one parent stopped working during covid and has no plans to return.

radpanda 4y ago
This feels like it matches my anecdata as well. Some folks in positions where they have the choice to work or not work are staying on the sidelines. I know a school administrator who retired earlier than planned rather than deal with the madness, I know a college kid who just took the summer off rather than get a summer job, I know a speech therapist turned stay-at-home mom, etc. Rather than a few years ago when people's decision calculus was "do I want to trade my time for $X/hr to do some work?" it feels like it's become "do I want to trade my time for $X/hr AND risk getting myself or family members seriously sick AND deal with unhinged people at a time of political strife?" And sure, the X in $X/hr has gone up, but apparently not enough to convince as many people to wait tables as in 2019.
- spaceman_2020 4y ago
  A number of friends made a bunch of money from stocks and crypto and decided to quit their jobs and build something of their own. They always had plans to do it but never enough savings to take the leap.
- shusaku 4y ago
  You can look at the labor force participation rate: https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/labor-force-participation-rate https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/labor-force-parti... But I think controlling for demographic factors would take some work (look at the drop past 2000)
  - lotsofpulp 4y ago
    A more official source: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CIVPART https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/CIVPART
    - bombcar 4y ago
      More interesting than the drop at 2020 is the continual decline since 2000.
      - jhickok 4y ago
        Prime age participation is actually pretty high: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNS11300060 https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNS11300060
        lotsofpulp 4y ago
        If the conversation is about price of labor, then the ratio of aggregate labor sellers to labor buyers is the relevant metric to compare over the years. For example, more old people or otherwise disabled people wanting to buy labor relative to people willing and able to supply it, compared to previous decades.
        jhickok 4y ago
        Thanks, that's an interesting way to look at it.
  - jhickok 4y ago
    Prime age work force participation is still high. A lot of the people that left the labor force were retirement age people that saw their retirement money go up by 50% or more and didn't really see a reason to come back.
localhost 4y ago
My anecdata: the McDonald's in my area still hasn't opened up its in-restaurant seating because they can't staff it. Drive-through only.
- symfoniq 4y ago
  Restaurants in my area are still having staffing issues, too, to the point that some are completely closed on random days they'd normally be open.
  - moate 4y ago
    As someone who spent a decade burning and bleeding for the restaurant industry: Fucking great. If there's one sector that needs its entire economic plan blown up and rebooted, it's restaurants. The fact that labor has seemingly collectively walked away from restaurants en masse has been one of the best things about the pandemic. Of course it's complicated (What about the ability for people to source food from restaurants, what about other economic factors that go into it, poor sad owners who invested all their money, went belly up, and now have to act like the labor they abused, "not all restaurants", etc) but the food service industry is one of the most vile, exploitative sectors out there and the schadenfreude over it getting a swift kick in the teeth has been massive.
  - Consultant32452 4y ago
    Some of the fast food stores in my area still have their dining areas closed due to short staffing.
- shapefrog 4y ago
  Alternate theory: they havent opend the in-restaurant seating becuase they make more money keeping it closed and operating drive-through (and delivery) only.
  - bombcar 4y ago
    The only real difference is cleaning staff on the in-restaurant seating and maybe one more employee for the register (though many seem to be slow enough to have one person doing double-duty). Out here in the sticks everything is basically back to normal, though one restaurant that was already on the edge appears to be slowly folding.
Consultant32452 4y ago
As the other poster said, this matches my anecdata also. I will also add that I know multiple families who have decided to home school permanently, and that added extra incentive for the family to stay in the single income status.

salawat 4y ago

Rehiring I'll bet.