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Well … time to get rid of my roomba. The idea that they’ll have ring outside, a camera inside monitoring every movement is kinda nuts, and Alexa monitoring all

Well … time to get rid of my roomba. The idea that they’ll have ring outside, a camera inside monitoring every movement is kinda nuts, and Alexa monitoring all audio is insane. We already know Amazon has a service to sell data to police. I don’t know what people will expect here.

danjoredd 4y ago
We elect our true leaders with each of our purchases, and our ballot is every receipt we get
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
2OEH8eoCRo0 4y ago
It's interesting because I would totally go for that if I could run all of the services locally with some digital assistant AI to tie it together and manage them. It's tragic, really. The cool future I imagined is here but there is a catch. There's always a catch.
firstSpeaker 4y ago
Could you elaborate more on "We already know Amazon has a service to sell data to police" statement?
- belval 4y ago
  It's plain not true, Amazon has shared information with the police, but they don't make money from it. It's also not large-scale with only 11 requests in 2022. There are plenty of reasons to dislike Amazon, no need to invent one: > Ring says it will only "respond immediately to urgent law enforcement requests for information in cases involving imminent danger of death or serious physical injury to any person." Its policy is to review any requests for assistance from police, then make "a good-faith determination whether the request meets the well-known standard, grounded in federal law, that there is imminent danger of death or serious physical injury to any person requiring disclosure of information without delay." https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/07/amazon-finally-admits-giving-cops-ring-doorbell-data-without-user-consent/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/07/amazon-finally-a...
  - aaaaaaaaata 4y ago
    Amazon admits giving police Ring camera footage without owner consent - https://theintercept.com/2022/07/13/amazon-ring-camera-footage-police-ed-markey/ https://theintercept.com/2022/07/13/amazon-ring-camera-foota... Google, like Amazon, may let police see your video without a warrant - https://www.theverge.com/2022/7/26/23279562/arlo-apple-wyze-eufy-google-ring-security-camera-foortage-warrant https://www.theverge.com/2022/7/26/23279562/arlo-apple-wyze-...
    - belval 4y ago
      Yes, the link I shared is from the same story. My point is that they aren't using it to sell ads.
      - lostlogin 4y ago
        The original claim in this thread wasn’t related to adverts, it was that data was sold to the police. Isn’t the reality worse, they just give it to the police?
  - lettergram 4y ago
    Here’s a direct request https://ler.amazon.com/us https://ler.amazon.com/us Here’s an article from Gizmodo https://gizmodo.com/ring-s-hidden-data-let-us-map-amazons-sprawling-home-su-1840312279 https://gizmodo.com/ring-s-hidden-data-let-us-map-amazons-sp... > Neighbors, which has millions of users, is advertised as a way to receive “real-time crime and safety alerts” from local law enforcement and other Neighbors users nearby. A Ring camera isn’t required to use the app. In cities where police have partnered with Ring, police officers have access to a special law enforcement portal, through which the officers can request access to Ring footage. They can choose a date, a time, and a location on a map, and Neighbors users with cameras in the vicinity are alerted.
  - parkingrift 4y ago
    >It's also not large-scale with only 11 requests in 2022. We should definitely take Amazon at their word here. Such a trustworthy company should be given the benefit of the doubt. We don't need to be able to audit these claims. Amazon said it, and therefore it is fact!
tootie 4y ago
Absolutely every American company that get a legal request for data from law enforcement will comply. Small companies don't make the news the way Amazon does, but if robot vacuums have ever collected evidence of a crime, then I guarantee iRobot has been issued and complied with requests for data too. Police routinely collect security camera footage from small businesses. Nobody is immune to due process.
barbazoo 4y ago
How long do folks think until this will lead to actual change within what's now iRobot? Am I naive to assume nothing really will change in the next year or two? I just bought this thing a year ago. It's frustrating to think it's now part of the Amazon data collection system. I wonder if there'll be a way to sever the device from the cloud and use it through HomeAssistant exclusively. As far as I know it is running an MQTT server but I have no idea how much it relies on the cloud to function.

danjoredd 4y ago

We elect our true leaders with each of our purchases, and our ballot is every receipt we get

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

2OEH8eoCRo0 4y ago

It's interesting because I would totally go for that if I could run all of the services locally with some digital assistant AI to tie it together and manage them. It's tragic, really. The cool future I imagined is here but there is a catch. There's always a catch.

firstSpeaker 4y ago

Could you elaborate more on "We already know Amazon has a service to sell data to police" statement?

belval 4y ago
It's plain not true, Amazon has shared information with the police, but they don't make money from it. It's also not large-scale with only 11 requests in 2022. There are plenty of reasons to dislike Amazon, no need to invent one: > Ring says it will only "respond immediately to urgent law enforcement requests for information in cases involving imminent danger of death or serious physical injury to any person." Its policy is to review any requests for assistance from police, then make "a good-faith determination whether the request meets the well-known standard, grounded in federal law, that there is imminent danger of death or serious physical injury to any person requiring disclosure of information without delay." https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/07/amazon-finally-admits-giving-cops-ring-doorbell-data-without-user-consent/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/07/amazon-finally-a...
- aaaaaaaaata 4y ago
  Amazon admits giving police Ring camera footage without owner consent - https://theintercept.com/2022/07/13/amazon-ring-camera-footage-police-ed-markey/ https://theintercept.com/2022/07/13/amazon-ring-camera-foota... Google, like Amazon, may let police see your video without a warrant - https://www.theverge.com/2022/7/26/23279562/arlo-apple-wyze-eufy-google-ring-security-camera-foortage-warrant https://www.theverge.com/2022/7/26/23279562/arlo-apple-wyze-...
  - belval 4y ago
    Yes, the link I shared is from the same story. My point is that they aren't using it to sell ads.
    - lostlogin 4y ago
      The original claim in this thread wasn’t related to adverts, it was that data was sold to the police. Isn’t the reality worse, they just give it to the police?
- lettergram 4y ago
  Here’s a direct request https://ler.amazon.com/us https://ler.amazon.com/us Here’s an article from Gizmodo https://gizmodo.com/ring-s-hidden-data-let-us-map-amazons-sprawling-home-su-1840312279 https://gizmodo.com/ring-s-hidden-data-let-us-map-amazons-sp... > Neighbors, which has millions of users, is advertised as a way to receive “real-time crime and safety alerts” from local law enforcement and other Neighbors users nearby. A Ring camera isn’t required to use the app. In cities where police have partnered with Ring, police officers have access to a special law enforcement portal, through which the officers can request access to Ring footage. They can choose a date, a time, and a location on a map, and Neighbors users with cameras in the vicinity are alerted.
- parkingrift 4y ago
  >It's also not large-scale with only 11 requests in 2022. We should definitely take Amazon at their word here. Such a trustworthy company should be given the benefit of the doubt. We don't need to be able to audit these claims. Amazon said it, and therefore it is fact!

tootie 4y ago

Absolutely every American company that get a legal request for data from law enforcement will comply. Small companies don't make the news the way Amazon does, but if robot vacuums have ever collected evidence of a crime, then I guarantee iRobot has been issued and complied with requests for data too. Police routinely collect security camera footage from small businesses. Nobody is immune to due process.

barbazoo 4y ago

How long do folks think until this will lead to actual change within what's now iRobot? Am I naive to assume nothing really will change in the next year or two? I just bought this thing a year ago. It's frustrating to think it's now part of the Amazon data collection system. I wonder if there'll be a way to sever the device from the cloud and use it through HomeAssistant exclusively. As far as I know it is running an MQTT server but I have no idea how much it relies on the cloud to function.