9 ms·

Interesting. I'd be all up for a low-cost, IKEA style house (in my locale the cost of the building is a small fraction of total cost of property in a city anyw

Interesting. I'd be all up for a low-cost, IKEA style house (in my locale the cost of the building is a small fraction of total cost of property in a city anyway). If nothing else, construction work is such a gamble, the variance of outcome of quality is enormous. The thing that hampers it, as far as I know, is generally quality constraints. Pre-fab houses just tend to be low quality. This is in part self-selecting, there is a stigma to a "pre-fab" or "portable" home, but in part also that somehow building prefab houses to a good standard is hard. I don't just mean colour and feel, but just basics like "not leaking". The staple of Eastern European bleak suburbs, the high-rise apartment buildings, were all built out of prefab components. These were built in central locations ("home factories"), transported and only assembled on site. These were certainly not created equal, and customer satisfaction wasn't high on the requirements list, but they generally suffered from this kind of problems (leaks, poor quality plumbing / gas connections etc.). I wonder how this company would tackle these problems.

dahfizz 4y ago
The issue is that pre-fab housing is fundamentally about low cost. There's nothing preventing a master craftsman from building the perfect pre-fab, but it will be so expensive that anyone who could afford it would rather buy a "real home".
- cjrp 4y ago
  There's other advantages to pre-fab though. Known costs (building a house from scratch can cost 2x or 3x the original estimate) Assembly time (could be the difference between living on-site in a caravan for 1 month vs. 2-3 years).
  - bluGill 4y ago
    When a builder makes a spec house they will estimate the costs to within a very small error every time. When someone hires the same builder to make the same house the price often will be 2x or more of the estimate, but that is because it isn't the same house. It starts with the same plan, but instead of putting the $10 lights in they put in the $300 ceiling fan. Instead of putting in the cheap toilet they put in the upgraded one. They put in the more expensive doors and trim. they choose the more expensive counter tops. they get the more expensive stove. And on and on with many little upgrades, each alone isn't very much money, but the end total is doubling the cost. If you are willing to stick with the same cheap choices the builder would choose you can build a house for the estimate. It is safe to bet money that you wouldn't.
- rich_sasha 4y ago
  I'm not sure. I mean, in practice it seems it is as you say, but I wonder if that's necessary. What would pre-fab look like if it targeted a high-quality finish? First, you'd think high-quality hand-made houses ought to be more expensive than high-quality prefab houses, made in a well-optimised factory process. Cost, quality etc. should just be more consistent. Second, the amount of general headscratching should be much lower. If I can design the pieces together and the on-site job is just to put them together well, that cuts out a lot of general "how do I connect these pieces" work, not to mention all the painstaking work of laying bricks etc. Finally, as also mentioned by sibling, the variance of cost should just be drastically lower. Clearly it doesn't work like that, but I wonder what the root cause is.
  - michaelt 4y ago
    > What would pre-fab look like if it targeted a high-quality finish? Let me introduce you to Huf Haus [1] premium quality prefabricated houses. They go for modern designs, but I don't see why you couldn't target a traditional look with the same quality level. [1] https://www.huf-haus.com/en-uk/home-ideas/ https://www.huf-haus.com/en-uk/home-ideas/
    - jaclaz 4y ago
      ... if cost is not an issue. Huf Haus is world reknown for their quality, but they are not cheap.
  - bluGill 4y ago
    What you are calling "hand-made houses" are entirely factory made. They bring the factory in on a truck, and pack it up, but it is still a factory, and the process are not much different from what you would do in any factory. And most of the parts are made off-sight, most of the parts are things like 2x4 that are made offsight in a factory. There isn't much room for doing more in a factory. Most pre-fab houses are cheaper only because they carefully limit your floor plans and options, and thus can just pay off a few jigs, but there isn't much savings possible there. They also often cut quality to save money.
idontwantthis 4y ago
My sister lives in a prefab home ordered from Sears 100 years ago. They don’t have to be low quality or expensive.
- iancmceachern 4y ago
  My parents used to collect old sears and roebuck catalogs. Looking at the various house kits for sale ($2k at the time!) Was one of my favorite parts of those catalogs. They really sold some very nice house kits. One detail though, they were really more like house kits, not pre fab homes.
- throwaway0a5e 4y ago
  That wasn't a prefab home. It was a kit. You can still get kits today if you are looking but they are generally not targeted at the HN demographics.
- quickthrowman 4y ago
  Sears (Crafsman) homes were kits that were field assembled, not prefabricated homes.
turtlebits 4y ago
Manufactured homes tend to be cheap/poor quality. Pre-fab is different, and generally more expensive per square foot than your traditional built on site stick frame house. Until people care about energy efficient homes, they are a tough sell.
- JohnHaugeland 4y ago
  > Pre-fab is different, and generally more expensive per square foot Prefab tends to be the second cheapest option, behind panelized.
digdugdirk 4y ago
This is a historical design/manufacturing problem, not a factual blanket statement. Given the higher quality control standards that would be possible with a modern automated manufacturing process, each individual panel would now be higher quality than the variation of contractors building housing from scratch on-site. From there, its just a matter of ensuring the final build site is prepped to spec. Leveling and grading, water runoff, etc. This would be the only variation between homes, and could be accomplished by a more highly trained crew with specialized equipment, as this would be their regular job. In the end, its just a better way to go than building homes from scratch on site.
- notahacker 4y ago
  Yup. People would be surprised just how rough the fit of stuff cut to size and lined up on site. Manufactured frames, panels and modules can be built to much tighter tolerances with the benefit of an orderly indoor environment and often precision cuts from CNC machines too.
kwere 4y ago
once upon a time SEARS sold kit homes, homes that are still standing today in very good shape[0] [0]https://www.mansionglobal.com/articles/the-million-dollar-vintage-kit-homes-that-come-from-sears-112156 https://www.mansionglobal.com/articles/the-million-dollar-vi...

dahfizz 4y ago

The issue is that pre-fab housing is fundamentally about low cost. There's nothing preventing a master craftsman from building the perfect pre-fab, but it will be so expensive that anyone who could afford it would rather buy a "real home".

cjrp 4y ago
There's other advantages to pre-fab though. Known costs (building a house from scratch can cost 2x or 3x the original estimate) Assembly time (could be the difference between living on-site in a caravan for 1 month vs. 2-3 years).
- bluGill 4y ago
  When a builder makes a spec house they will estimate the costs to within a very small error every time. When someone hires the same builder to make the same house the price often will be 2x or more of the estimate, but that is because it isn't the same house. It starts with the same plan, but instead of putting the $10 lights in they put in the $300 ceiling fan. Instead of putting in the cheap toilet they put in the upgraded one. They put in the more expensive doors and trim. they choose the more expensive counter tops. they get the more expensive stove. And on and on with many little upgrades, each alone isn't very much money, but the end total is doubling the cost. If you are willing to stick with the same cheap choices the builder would choose you can build a house for the estimate. It is safe to bet money that you wouldn't.
rich_sasha 4y ago
I'm not sure. I mean, in practice it seems it is as you say, but I wonder if that's necessary. What would pre-fab look like if it targeted a high-quality finish? First, you'd think high-quality hand-made houses ought to be more expensive than high-quality prefab houses, made in a well-optimised factory process. Cost, quality etc. should just be more consistent. Second, the amount of general headscratching should be much lower. If I can design the pieces together and the on-site job is just to put them together well, that cuts out a lot of general "how do I connect these pieces" work, not to mention all the painstaking work of laying bricks etc. Finally, as also mentioned by sibling, the variance of cost should just be drastically lower. Clearly it doesn't work like that, but I wonder what the root cause is.
- michaelt 4y ago
  > What would pre-fab look like if it targeted a high-quality finish? Let me introduce you to Huf Haus [1] premium quality prefabricated houses. They go for modern designs, but I don't see why you couldn't target a traditional look with the same quality level. [1] https://www.huf-haus.com/en-uk/home-ideas/ https://www.huf-haus.com/en-uk/home-ideas/
  - jaclaz 4y ago
    ... if cost is not an issue. Huf Haus is world reknown for their quality, but they are not cheap.
- bluGill 4y ago
  What you are calling "hand-made houses" are entirely factory made. They bring the factory in on a truck, and pack it up, but it is still a factory, and the process are not much different from what you would do in any factory. And most of the parts are made off-sight, most of the parts are things like 2x4 that are made offsight in a factory. There isn't much room for doing more in a factory. Most pre-fab houses are cheaper only because they carefully limit your floor plans and options, and thus can just pay off a few jigs, but there isn't much savings possible there. They also often cut quality to save money.

idontwantthis 4y ago

My sister lives in a prefab home ordered from Sears 100 years ago. They don’t have to be low quality or expensive.

iancmceachern 4y ago
My parents used to collect old sears and roebuck catalogs. Looking at the various house kits for sale ($2k at the time!) Was one of my favorite parts of those catalogs. They really sold some very nice house kits. One detail though, they were really more like house kits, not pre fab homes.
throwaway0a5e 4y ago
That wasn't a prefab home. It was a kit. You can still get kits today if you are looking but they are generally not targeted at the HN demographics.
quickthrowman 4y ago
Sears (Crafsman) homes were kits that were field assembled, not prefabricated homes.

turtlebits 4y ago

Manufactured homes tend to be cheap/poor quality. Pre-fab is different, and generally more expensive per square foot than your traditional built on site stick frame house. Until people care about energy efficient homes, they are a tough sell.

JohnHaugeland 4y ago
> Pre-fab is different, and generally more expensive per square foot Prefab tends to be the second cheapest option, behind panelized.

digdugdirk 4y ago

This is a historical design/manufacturing problem, not a factual blanket statement. Given the higher quality control standards that would be possible with a modern automated manufacturing process, each individual panel would now be higher quality than the variation of contractors building housing from scratch on-site. From there, its just a matter of ensuring the final build site is prepped to spec. Leveling and grading, water runoff, etc. This would be the only variation between homes, and could be accomplished by a more highly trained crew with specialized equipment, as this would be their regular job. In the end, its just a better way to go than building homes from scratch on site.

notahacker 4y ago
Yup. People would be surprised just how rough the fit of stuff cut to size and lined up on site. Manufactured frames, panels and modules can be built to much tighter tolerances with the benefit of an orderly indoor environment and often precision cuts from CNC machines too.

kwere 4y ago

once upon a time SEARS sold kit homes, homes that are still standing today in very good shape[0] [0]https://www.mansionglobal.com/articles/the-million-dollar-vintage-kit-homes-that-come-from-sears-112156 https://www.mansionglobal.com/articles/the-million-dollar-vi...