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FYI, the Silvertown tunnel is not with controversy: > The scheme has faced widespread opposition from local people, politicians, climate scientists and medical

FYI, the Silvertown tunnel is not with controversy: > The scheme has faced widespread opposition from local people, politicians, climate scientists and medical experts who say it would increase traffic and worsen public health in some of the most deprived boroughs in the country. They also say it will lock in high carbon transport for generations to come. https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/aug/05/london-mayor-urged-halt-silvertown-tunnel-scheme-11th-hour https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/aug/05/london-mayor... Also: https://silvertowntunnel.co.uk/ https://silvertowntunnel.co.uk/ https://stopsilvertowntn.com/ https://stopsilvertowntn.com/ https://twitter.com/silvertowntn https://twitter.com/silvertowntn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induced_demand https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induced_demand

jacquesm 4y ago
The last one is the big one. London is so congested any attempt to relieve the congestion just results in more traffic because of latent demand.
- lbriner 4y ago
  Yeah. If they made it bus/cycle/walking only, that would be much better to actually make it better for people to use public transport. That said, plenty of traffic in London is commercial and a delivery driver can't just use the bus.
  - Sakos 4y ago
    You free up road infrastructure for commercial use by making it easier for people to switch. It'd probably be a big improvement for commercial use.
  - scratcheee 4y ago
    Better yet if the old tunnel was turned into pedestrian/cycle. Then you get proper bus options through the taller tunnel, and proper human-powered options with nobody to run them over, win win. And I guess we're not replacing lorries/vans for a while yet, so they can use the big tunnel with the busses I guess. And cars can go via the m25, no need for them in the city. Maybe multi-pasenger/disabled only (incentivises carpooling, helps families who need a cubic meter of junk per baby, and disabled people have genuine needs for their adapted vehicles). But yeah, the harder cars are to use in cities, the better for everyone (even the drivers often enough, still takes them the same time, but now they're not trapped queuing in a fuming tunnel, instead they're dancing playfully through one-way puzzles... ok, maybe it's not much better for them, but not _much_ worse either).
granzymes 4y ago
Are a few tunnels really going to add a significant amount of pollution to the city of London? “Worsen public health” seems like a bit of a stretch.
- cjrp 4y ago
  In London as a whole, not really. But in the areas adjacent to the tunnel, probably.
  - SideburnsOfDoom 4y ago
    Correct, and that's what it says above: "worsen public health in some of the most deprived boroughs in the country" (i.e. in the area of the tunnel).

jacquesm 4y ago

The last one is the big one. London is so congested any attempt to relieve the congestion just results in more traffic because of latent demand.

lbriner 4y ago
Yeah. If they made it bus/cycle/walking only, that would be much better to actually make it better for people to use public transport. That said, plenty of traffic in London is commercial and a delivery driver can't just use the bus.
- Sakos 4y ago
  You free up road infrastructure for commercial use by making it easier for people to switch. It'd probably be a big improvement for commercial use.
- scratcheee 4y ago
  Better yet if the old tunnel was turned into pedestrian/cycle. Then you get proper bus options through the taller tunnel, and proper human-powered options with nobody to run them over, win win. And I guess we're not replacing lorries/vans for a while yet, so they can use the big tunnel with the busses I guess. And cars can go via the m25, no need for them in the city. Maybe multi-pasenger/disabled only (incentivises carpooling, helps families who need a cubic meter of junk per baby, and disabled people have genuine needs for their adapted vehicles). But yeah, the harder cars are to use in cities, the better for everyone (even the drivers often enough, still takes them the same time, but now they're not trapped queuing in a fuming tunnel, instead they're dancing playfully through one-way puzzles... ok, maybe it's not much better for them, but not _much_ worse either).

granzymes 4y ago

Are a few tunnels really going to add a significant amount of pollution to the city of London? “Worsen public health” seems like a bit of a stretch.

cjrp 4y ago
In London as a whole, not really. But in the areas adjacent to the tunnel, probably.
- SideburnsOfDoom 4y ago
  Correct, and that's what it says above: "worsen public health in some of the most deprived boroughs in the country" (i.e. in the area of the tunnel).