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They certainly haven't done it yet, though some things viewed in this perspective seem on the spectrum. The iOS 14 change of tracking preferences to opt-in abs

by ajross 4y ago

They certainly haven't done it yet, though some things viewed in this perspective seem on the spectrum. The iOS 14 change of tracking preferences to opt-in absolutely put a knife in Meta's advertising business. And, sure, it can be viewed as a privacy feature, and that's great. So what happens next year when Apple rolls out their own user-targetted ad system based on the same tracking data they disallowed to competitors? It's a slippery slope for sure. Apple deserves the benefit of the doubt, but I don't see how anyone would look at this as good news.

aorloff 4y ago
Apple doesn't have to even roll out a user-targeted ad system. All they have to do is offer a buying platform where you can track conversion on Apple devices and software better. In other words, they don't have to offer more user-level accuracy to the end buyer, they simply need to measure campaigns more accurately on iOS (a bit of a simplification but not much). That alone will make their DSP a dominant player in the industry.
heavyset_go 4y ago
> Apple deserves the benefit of the doubt No trillion dollar corporation deserves the benefit of the doubt, including Apple.
- UnpossibleJim 4y ago
  Especially a trillion dollar company who routinely exploits foreign labor [1] not to mention Apple still collects your data, so long as it is "aggregated and annonymized" [2]. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/09/09/apple-accused-worker-violations-chinese-factories-by-labor-rights-group/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/09/09/apple-a... [2] https://www.computerworld.com/article/3646190/apple-is-sneaking-around-its-own-privacy-policy-and-will-regret-it.html https://www.computerworld.com/article/3646190/apple-is-sneak...
  - dwaite 4y ago
    The article in [2] says that Apple is backtracking on their privacy policy, without ever specifying what stated Apple policy they were not adhering to. "Ask Apps not to Track" was about an advertiser you did not have a relationship with, building profiles across multiple organizations to profile you without any consent. So a policy was created where apps did have to prompt, and to make it a business requirement to work with Apple. If you track without explicit OS-gathered user consent, you can be kicked from the store. AFAIK, even if you do so via means like IP address correlation. But the feature wasn't "privacy", it was "ask apps not to track". It is very clearly specified about whether you want multiple organizations to correlate you. It is not meant to be a policy to limit e.g. what the Meta learns about you while you are interacting within Facebook, Instagram and WhatsApp.
    - ajross 4y ago
      That's a deeply cynical way to view things, and exactly what people here are afraid of happening. Clearly the iOS marketing of the past few years has led people to believe that Apple is opposed to advertising technologies that rely on persistently-stored and correlated user behavior, because that persistent store can be plausibly (and terribly) misused. And remember that the misuse itself hasn't really happened anywhere. People like to complain about Facebook and Google's (also Amazon's, and TikTok is in this conversation now too) accumulation of this data, but so far the actual abuses haven't happened. Tech companies have been, on the whole, actually pretty good stewards of this stuff. But people hate that they have it anyway, and mistrust them. And now Apple's going to do the same thing.

by ajross 4y ago

aorloff 4y ago

Apple doesn't have to even roll out a user-targeted ad system. All they have to do is offer a buying platform where you can track conversion on Apple devices and software better. In other words, they don't have to offer more user-level accuracy to the end buyer, they simply need to measure campaigns more accurately on iOS (a bit of a simplification but not much). That alone will make their DSP a dominant player in the industry.

heavyset_go 4y ago

> Apple deserves the benefit of the doubt No trillion dollar corporation deserves the benefit of the doubt, including Apple.

UnpossibleJim 4y ago
Especially a trillion dollar company who routinely exploits foreign labor [1] not to mention Apple still collects your data, so long as it is "aggregated and annonymized" [2]. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/09/09/apple-accused-worker-violations-chinese-factories-by-labor-rights-group/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/09/09/apple-a... [2] https://www.computerworld.com/article/3646190/apple-is-sneaking-around-its-own-privacy-policy-and-will-regret-it.html https://www.computerworld.com/article/3646190/apple-is-sneak...
- dwaite 4y ago
  The article in [2] says that Apple is backtracking on their privacy policy, without ever specifying what stated Apple policy they were not adhering to. "Ask Apps not to Track" was about an advertiser you did not have a relationship with, building profiles across multiple organizations to profile you without any consent. So a policy was created where apps did have to prompt, and to make it a business requirement to work with Apple. If you track without explicit OS-gathered user consent, you can be kicked from the store. AFAIK, even if you do so via means like IP address correlation. But the feature wasn't "privacy", it was "ask apps not to track". It is very clearly specified about whether you want multiple organizations to correlate you. It is not meant to be a policy to limit e.g. what the Meta learns about you while you are interacting within Facebook, Instagram and WhatsApp.
  - ajross 4y ago
    That's a deeply cynical way to view things, and exactly what people here are afraid of happening. Clearly the iOS marketing of the past few years has led people to believe that Apple is opposed to advertising technologies that rely on persistently-stored and correlated user behavior, because that persistent store can be plausibly (and terribly) misused. And remember that the misuse itself hasn't really happened anywhere. People like to complain about Facebook and Google's (also Amazon's, and TikTok is in this conversation now too) accumulation of this data, but so far the actual abuses haven't happened. Tech companies have been, on the whole, actually pretty good stewards of this stuff. But people hate that they have it anyway, and mistrust them. And now Apple's going to do the same thing.