5 ms·

the importance of "hi" vs. "hello" is so low, so far down the list of bad messages that it's on the part of the long strip of paper that it is located about hal

the importance of "hi" vs. "hello" is so low, so far down the list of bad messages that it's on the part of the long strip of paper that it is located about halfway back from its trip to the moon. this is what you choose to complain about? your life must be exceptionally trouble-free.

_ktx2 4y ago
Just taking a step back here, I'm willing to bet OP and some of the other folks replying (like here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32338845 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32338845) are just fulfilling predictions made here: https://spectrum.ieee.org/study-nobody-wants-social-robots-that-look-like-humans https://spectrum.ieee.org/study-nobody-wants-social-robots-t... This piece focused on a machines appearance, but later they comment that really what's at the root of peoples issues (the people that have them) is that they resent the anthropomophizing of machines in general - which I would take to include speech.
triyambakam 4y ago
This is an internet forum (kinda), ya know?
josefx 4y ago
It is bad enough that it fucking talks. First time I encountered that it screamed at me from the other side of the building because someone at Microsoft decided greeting new users with speakers turned to eleven is welcoming.
toyg 4y ago
Well, you chose to complain about somebody complaining about an item you deem trivial - so, by your own premise, your comment is effectively "$trivial ^ 3".
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
tomc1985 4y ago
They're trying to come off as friendly and inviting, but I read it as half-assed. Perception is a bitch. If I had my way we'd dispense with all these stupid pleasantries. My computer is not my friend, Windows is not my friend, and Microsoft and their awful marketing droids (who almost certainly guided their choice of words here) are most definitely not my friend. Who decided that Windows needs to talk to me like a middle-aged soccer mom (or an argonian shopkeeper)? Nothing wrong with "Welcome", "Error 404: File Not Found", "Bad command or file name", etc etc etc. (Ok, maybe the last one is a bit cryptic, but it is telling me exactly what went wrong without any fluff, which is how all software should be.) Computers are our servants, not our friends. They should act like it, and we should stop trying to humanize them.
- narshian 4y ago
- wutbrodo 4y ago
  > but I read it as half-assed. Why is formality any more natural for a user interface than casualness? This seems like an extremely arbitrary personal preference masquerading as reasonable criticism, no different from getting riled up about the fact that Windows default theme is blue when it should _obviously_ be green. > Computers are our servants, not our friends. They should act like it. I had a live-in housekeeper for a chunk of my life, which is roughly as close to "servant" as one gets in the modern West; we communicated in normal, casual English. If you are going around insisting that service workers address you like an aristocrat, you're an enormous asshole.
  - sgtnoodle 4y ago
    I think a big part of it is the fact that it's a full-screen captive display, with an excessively long timeout. If it was a stupid little popup in the corner that said, "Hi, welcome to Windows!" It would have been cute. If you're going to get all up in someone's face and demand their complete attention, there's a high bar for expected politeness, or at least some entertaining wit. "Hi" is just lazy and conceited. "Welcome. Please wait while we prepare your desktop," would be tolerable. A Maxis style status bar rambling on about "reticulating splines" would be funny. To relate it to your experience with a housekeeper, if a housekeeper shouted your name from across the room, tapped you on the shoulder repeatedly, and then unplugged the TV you were watching to get your attention, you would expect them to say something like, "my apologies sir, the den is on fire," rather than, "lol, howdy." A computer isn't a servant, though. It's a tool. A circular saw with a sassy personality means a trip to the hospital...
salawat 4y ago
Or the condescending statement from Cortana about agreeing to the Windows EULA, or else... Ya know...<contemptuous pause> No Windows. Seriously. It is the one thing that if I didn't need a Windows test system, I'd reject it every damn time just for being there. In fact, if they were a human, they'd be kindly asked to evict themselves from my domicile in perpetuity.
- tomc1985 4y ago
  The tonality of all the new copy in Windows 10 is just bad. It's like a bunch of nontechnicals got together and tried to cuteify the OS. I had totally forgotten about how obnoxious Cortana was (I always turned that shit off first thing), or the condescending text that accompanies large updates requiring you to re-certify that no, you don't want to use Microsoft Edge, thank you Don't even want to imagine what Windows 11 is like, none of my PCs can run it (thank god)
  - dvsfish 4y ago
    While still bad in that way, its probably better than 10. It has a heap of its own issues, but my personal experience hasn't been quite as grating as far as the language is concerned. It's a healthy reasonably unoffensive middle ground of informative/understandable and casual. W11 has bigger issues than language.

_ktx2 4y ago

Just taking a step back here, I'm willing to bet OP and some of the other folks replying (like here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32338845 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32338845) are just fulfilling predictions made here: https://spectrum.ieee.org/study-nobody-wants-social-robots-that-look-like-humans https://spectrum.ieee.org/study-nobody-wants-social-robots-t... This piece focused on a machines appearance, but later they comment that really what's at the root of peoples issues (the people that have them) is that they resent the anthropomophizing of machines in general - which I would take to include speech.

triyambakam 4y ago

This is an internet forum (kinda), ya know?

josefx 4y ago

It is bad enough that it fucking talks. First time I encountered that it screamed at me from the other side of the building because someone at Microsoft decided greeting new users with speakers turned to eleven is welcoming.

toyg 4y ago

Well, you chose to complain about somebody complaining about an item you deem trivial - so, by your own premise, your comment is effectively "$trivial ^ 3".

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

tomc1985 4y ago

They're trying to come off as friendly and inviting, but I read it as half-assed. Perception is a bitch. If I had my way we'd dispense with all these stupid pleasantries. My computer is not my friend, Windows is not my friend, and Microsoft and their awful marketing droids (who almost certainly guided their choice of words here) are most definitely not my friend. Who decided that Windows needs to talk to me like a middle-aged soccer mom (or an argonian shopkeeper)? Nothing wrong with "Welcome", "Error 404: File Not Found", "Bad command or file name", etc etc etc. (Ok, maybe the last one is a bit cryptic, but it is telling me exactly what went wrong without any fluff, which is how all software should be.) Computers are our servants, not our friends. They should act like it, and we should stop trying to humanize them.

narshian 4y ago
wutbrodo 4y ago
> but I read it as half-assed. Why is formality any more natural for a user interface than casualness? This seems like an extremely arbitrary personal preference masquerading as reasonable criticism, no different from getting riled up about the fact that Windows default theme is blue when it should _obviously_ be green. > Computers are our servants, not our friends. They should act like it. I had a live-in housekeeper for a chunk of my life, which is roughly as close to "servant" as one gets in the modern West; we communicated in normal, casual English. If you are going around insisting that service workers address you like an aristocrat, you're an enormous asshole.
- sgtnoodle 4y ago
  I think a big part of it is the fact that it's a full-screen captive display, with an excessively long timeout. If it was a stupid little popup in the corner that said, "Hi, welcome to Windows!" It would have been cute. If you're going to get all up in someone's face and demand their complete attention, there's a high bar for expected politeness, or at least some entertaining wit. "Hi" is just lazy and conceited. "Welcome. Please wait while we prepare your desktop," would be tolerable. A Maxis style status bar rambling on about "reticulating splines" would be funny. To relate it to your experience with a housekeeper, if a housekeeper shouted your name from across the room, tapped you on the shoulder repeatedly, and then unplugged the TV you were watching to get your attention, you would expect them to say something like, "my apologies sir, the den is on fire," rather than, "lol, howdy." A computer isn't a servant, though. It's a tool. A circular saw with a sassy personality means a trip to the hospital...

salawat 4y ago

Or the condescending statement from Cortana about agreeing to the Windows EULA, or else... Ya know...<contemptuous pause> No Windows. Seriously. It is the one thing that if I didn't need a Windows test system, I'd reject it every damn time just for being there. In fact, if they were a human, they'd be kindly asked to evict themselves from my domicile in perpetuity.

tomc1985 4y ago
The tonality of all the new copy in Windows 10 is just bad. It's like a bunch of nontechnicals got together and tried to cuteify the OS. I had totally forgotten about how obnoxious Cortana was (I always turned that shit off first thing), or the condescending text that accompanies large updates requiring you to re-certify that no, you don't want to use Microsoft Edge, thank you Don't even want to imagine what Windows 11 is like, none of my PCs can run it (thank god)
- dvsfish 4y ago
  While still bad in that way, its probably better than 10. It has a heap of its own issues, but my personal experience hasn't been quite as grating as far as the language is concerned. It's a healthy reasonably unoffensive middle ground of informative/understandable and casual. W11 has bigger issues than language.