4 ms·

Don't I wish. Currently in the middle of a big thing with a director who keeps mandating unrealistic deadlines with zero engineer input.

bluefirebrand 4y ago
When you find yourself in this position, it's time to look for a new job. It will likely never improve
treis 4y ago
This misses the point. Pretty much all businesses are going to want to mandate unrealistic deadlines. Their default stance is to get as much out of the dev team as they think they can get. It doesn't matter because they don't know what a realistic deadline or a realistic amount of work is. The point is that they have no real understanding of time it takes to develop anything. It all comes from what the developers tell them. You have a huge asymmetric information advantage and should be able to use that to limit the amount of work you have to do. To put it bluntly, if you work 45 hours a week now and want to work 40 start padding you estimates by 10%. Nobody is going to know.
- VyseofArcadia 4y ago
  I don't think you understand what I mean by zero engineer input. I only have an information advantage if they in some way incorporate my information into their decisions. That does not happen. That would be a wonderful strategy if they asked for estimates.
  - treis 4y ago
    I've been in a lot of dysfunctional organizations and I've never seen one that took zero engineering estimates. Directors may set deadlines without it but that scope & timeline filters down to the engineering team and then the engineering team plans their time. It's at that point you pad your estimates. Stretch 40 hours of work into 50 hours of estimate and you look like you're killing it when you do 40 hours of work. Even if engineering has literally 0 planning input at all they're still the ones doing the work. I've never seen a PM sit behind an engineer 45 hours a week and make sure their working. Just stop working and go home or take a longer lunch if you want to work less. They're not going to fire you. The logic doesn't make sense. Firing an engineer on a project behind schedule is going to make the problem worse. Not better. If you are legitimately worried about being fired you're in the top 1% worst organizations and it's time to move on.
    - VyseofArcadia 4y ago
      I inherited a part of the org with a history of underperforming[1]. I'm not worried about losing my job, but I am worried about the entire division getting re-orged, or, worst case scenario, laid off. [1] It would not be an exaggeration to say that this division has literally never produced value for the company.
mbrodersen 4y ago
That’s actually nothing too bad. If you know you will guaranteed miss the deadline then relax, slow down, do the quality work you want to do and meanwhile look for a better job.

bluefirebrand 4y ago

When you find yourself in this position, it's time to look for a new job. It will likely never improve

treis 4y ago

This misses the point. Pretty much all businesses are going to want to mandate unrealistic deadlines. Their default stance is to get as much out of the dev team as they think they can get. It doesn't matter because they don't know what a realistic deadline or a realistic amount of work is. The point is that they have no real understanding of time it takes to develop anything. It all comes from what the developers tell them. You have a huge asymmetric information advantage and should be able to use that to limit the amount of work you have to do. To put it bluntly, if you work 45 hours a week now and want to work 40 start padding you estimates by 10%. Nobody is going to know.

VyseofArcadia 4y ago
I don't think you understand what I mean by zero engineer input. I only have an information advantage if they in some way incorporate my information into their decisions. That does not happen. That would be a wonderful strategy if they asked for estimates.
- treis 4y ago
  I've been in a lot of dysfunctional organizations and I've never seen one that took zero engineering estimates. Directors may set deadlines without it but that scope & timeline filters down to the engineering team and then the engineering team plans their time. It's at that point you pad your estimates. Stretch 40 hours of work into 50 hours of estimate and you look like you're killing it when you do 40 hours of work. Even if engineering has literally 0 planning input at all they're still the ones doing the work. I've never seen a PM sit behind an engineer 45 hours a week and make sure their working. Just stop working and go home or take a longer lunch if you want to work less. They're not going to fire you. The logic doesn't make sense. Firing an engineer on a project behind schedule is going to make the problem worse. Not better. If you are legitimately worried about being fired you're in the top 1% worst organizations and it's time to move on.
  - VyseofArcadia 4y ago
    I inherited a part of the org with a history of underperforming[1]. I'm not worried about losing my job, but I am worried about the entire division getting re-orged, or, worst case scenario, laid off. [1] It would not be an exaggeration to say that this division has literally never produced value for the company.

mbrodersen 4y ago

That’s actually nothing too bad. If you know you will guaranteed miss the deadline then relax, slow down, do the quality work you want to do and meanwhile look for a better job.