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Context: Liz Truss being the favourite for next Prime Minister of the United Kingdom. I'm not comparing her to Donald Trump, but there's the same sense of incr

Context: Liz Truss being the favourite for next Prime Minister of the United Kingdom. I'm not comparing her to Donald Trump, but there's the same sense of incredulity that the political system would install someone so populist and devoid of substance in such a position of power. The office of Prime Minister is decided by the ruling party. Due to the timing of party politics and General Elections, she'll have been elected by the Conservative party, not by the actual UK electorate.

yrgulation 4y ago
Well its either her or rishi sunak. Unfortunately she’s the only option.
- dijit 4y ago
  Evidently she’s not the only option as there is another option, like you said. Unless you’re espousing an opinion?
  - yrgulation 4y ago
    The other is a non option.
    - dijit 4y ago
      Rishi was favourite to win at the beginning and has made it to the final voting. So, not really. Until the cards are drawn, both are quite literally options. The entire Conservative party are "non-options" from my perspective, but they're the government, so they were someones choice.
      - yrgulation 4y ago
        He may have been among certain circles but no he wasnt popular at any stage. Hes infamously corrupt and incompetent. The daily mail promotes him giving the impression he is popular but thats far from the truth.
        dijit 4y ago
        You could be speaking about Boris Johnson. He managed to be prime minister.
        yrgulation 4y ago
        Boris is horrible as are most tories. Out of curiosity, what are the reasons to support risi? No need to answer if you feel it is too personal a question, but I am open to hearing arguments in his favor. I am pretty sick of polarization and cultist following of "leaders". I think polarization is the cancer that erodes western democracies. So my question is, what has he done OK and what will he do OK.
        dijit 4y ago
        I don’t support either of them. I consider them to be equivalently bad. But Wetherspoons used to have a “Rishi’s Dishes” deal thing, and that’s quite a lot of brand recognition from a very conservative voter base.
        yrgulation 4y ago
        Gotcha - indeed he's had good PR. I do like that the cons are even considering an ethnic minority as front runner. That's a good sign the UK remains committed to diversity, and by far the most in europe. Shame it had to be him though. Either way I hope labour get their act together and come up with something better than last time to provide an actual alternative. Not that they would be saints either.
- yabatopia 4y ago
  Well, you still have the option to get up, march the streets and demand for better representation. Democracy is an active, ongoing process, it doesn't stop at the election booth. You deserve better than unelected leaders (unelected as by the people, not by a few selected Tory party members).
  - yrgulation 4y ago
    Agreed, but i cant march every time someone has a different opinion than mine. People chose tories last election and now they are enjoying a shitshow of their own making. In the uk people dont vote directly for a prime minister, and now the democratically elected party is sorting (i hope demising) themselves internally. Nothing wrong with it. The issue tho is the candidates are rubbish. But sunak is a total no go. I am shocked he even made it this far.
zimpenfish 4y ago
> the political system would install someone so populist and devoid of substance in such a position of power Unfortunately, the upper echelons of the Tory Party - and thus every candidate putting themselves forward to be PM - is filled with these vacuous puppets largely guided by the ERG[1] because they've somehow managed to capture the party, much like the Tea Party took over the GOP. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Research_Group https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Research_Group
Jaruzel 4y ago
> Due to the timing of party politics and General Elections, she'll have been elected by the Conservative party, not by the actual UK electorate. The UK electorate does not elect a Leader, it elects a Party. Currently, the elected party is the Conservatives, and that does not change even if the party leader (and as they are the party in power, the de facto Prime Minister) of the Conservatives change. There is no requirement for a General Election, as the elected party isn't changing. I DO have issue with the process to whittle the clutch of candidates for the role down to two, as that process is restricted to tory MPs only who as we always observe, do endless back room deals to secure their own places in the new regime. I feel that this should have been a standard popularity election with all hopefuls listed on the ballot and the entire tory party membership voting.
- Macha 4y ago
  The UK electorate does not elect a party either, it elects a bunch of local MPs, and the MPs in term elect a leader. While many voters of course vote for the MP who represents the party who is headed by their desired leader, MPs defecting could just as easily flip the government to another party without consulting the electorate, as they can replace the PM with another from the same party.
  - vmilner 4y ago
    They almost certainly won’t vote for a single party next time - Minority Labour supported by SNP seems almost inevitable now.
    - Jaruzel 4y ago
      Without going down a political rabbit hole on this, I'm afraid I concurr here, a Labour led coalition is the most likely outcome.
  - Jaruzel 4y ago
    You are of course correct. I was simply trying to highlight clumsily that we don't have a presidential type leadership here in the UK.

yrgulation 4y ago

Well its either her or rishi sunak. Unfortunately she’s the only option.

dijit 4y ago
Evidently she’s not the only option as there is another option, like you said. Unless you’re espousing an opinion?
- yrgulation 4y ago
  The other is a non option.
  - dijit 4y ago
    Rishi was favourite to win at the beginning and has made it to the final voting. So, not really. Until the cards are drawn, both are quite literally options. The entire Conservative party are "non-options" from my perspective, but they're the government, so they were someones choice.
    - yrgulation 4y ago
      He may have been among certain circles but no he wasnt popular at any stage. Hes infamously corrupt and incompetent. The daily mail promotes him giving the impression he is popular but thats far from the truth.
      - dijit 4y ago
        You could be speaking about Boris Johnson. He managed to be prime minister.
        yrgulation 4y ago
        Boris is horrible as are most tories. Out of curiosity, what are the reasons to support risi? No need to answer if you feel it is too personal a question, but I am open to hearing arguments in his favor. I am pretty sick of polarization and cultist following of "leaders". I think polarization is the cancer that erodes western democracies. So my question is, what has he done OK and what will he do OK.
        dijit 4y ago
        I don’t support either of them. I consider them to be equivalently bad. But Wetherspoons used to have a “Rishi’s Dishes” deal thing, and that’s quite a lot of brand recognition from a very conservative voter base.
        yrgulation 4y ago
        Gotcha - indeed he's had good PR. I do like that the cons are even considering an ethnic minority as front runner. That's a good sign the UK remains committed to diversity, and by far the most in europe. Shame it had to be him though. Either way I hope labour get their act together and come up with something better than last time to provide an actual alternative. Not that they would be saints either.
yabatopia 4y ago
Well, you still have the option to get up, march the streets and demand for better representation. Democracy is an active, ongoing process, it doesn't stop at the election booth. You deserve better than unelected leaders (unelected as by the people, not by a few selected Tory party members).
- yrgulation 4y ago
  Agreed, but i cant march every time someone has a different opinion than mine. People chose tories last election and now they are enjoying a shitshow of their own making. In the uk people dont vote directly for a prime minister, and now the democratically elected party is sorting (i hope demising) themselves internally. Nothing wrong with it. The issue tho is the candidates are rubbish. But sunak is a total no go. I am shocked he even made it this far.

zimpenfish 4y ago

> the political system would install someone so populist and devoid of substance in such a position of power Unfortunately, the upper echelons of the Tory Party - and thus every candidate putting themselves forward to be PM - is filled with these vacuous puppets largely guided by the ERG[1] because they've somehow managed to capture the party, much like the Tea Party took over the GOP. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Research_Group https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Research_Group

Jaruzel 4y ago

> Due to the timing of party politics and General Elections, she'll have been elected by the Conservative party, not by the actual UK electorate. The UK electorate does not elect a Leader, it elects a Party. Currently, the elected party is the Conservatives, and that does not change even if the party leader (and as they are the party in power, the de facto Prime Minister) of the Conservatives change. There is no requirement for a General Election, as the elected party isn't changing. I DO have issue with the process to whittle the clutch of candidates for the role down to two, as that process is restricted to tory MPs only who as we always observe, do endless back room deals to secure their own places in the new regime. I feel that this should have been a standard popularity election with all hopefuls listed on the ballot and the entire tory party membership voting.

Macha 4y ago
The UK electorate does not elect a party either, it elects a bunch of local MPs, and the MPs in term elect a leader. While many voters of course vote for the MP who represents the party who is headed by their desired leader, MPs defecting could just as easily flip the government to another party without consulting the electorate, as they can replace the PM with another from the same party.
- vmilner 4y ago
  They almost certainly won’t vote for a single party next time - Minority Labour supported by SNP seems almost inevitable now.
  - Jaruzel 4y ago
    Without going down a political rabbit hole on this, I'm afraid I concurr here, a Labour led coalition is the most likely outcome.
- Jaruzel 4y ago
  You are of course correct. I was simply trying to highlight clumsily that we don't have a presidential type leadership here in the UK.