5 ms·

Everybody complains that the potholes are worse than ever. Not sure if it's actually true or they've always had the same complaint, but I've definitely adapted

by mbg721 4y ago

Everybody complains that the potholes are worse than ever. Not sure if it's actually true or they've always had the same complaint, but I've definitely adapted my driving pattern to get around the ones that I know.

citilife 4y ago
Half the world doesn't have pavement... And potholes are almost always created due to extreme weather (very hot -> very cold -> repeat). My parents recall potholes so bad it'd destroy your car in the 80s. Concrete and the ability to fill potholes have improved over time. There's little reason to assume it's any worse than before, except some roads need replacement... but if you don't replace it (or prior to building the road) it was clearly worse.
- LargeWu 4y ago
  In regions with colder winters, it's typically a function of freeze/thaw cycles. Water gets inside cracks, freezes, and the expansion breaks up the pavement. Then it thaws and softens, and traffic knocks bits loose. Then more water gets in the now bigger cracks, it freezes again and the cycle repeats, but a little worse this time. Then again and again.
- mbg721 4y ago
  Saying "Half the world doesn't have pavement" is like saying "Eat your broccoli, because some children halfway around the world are starving." It doesn't change the fact that we used to be able to do routine maintenance that covered this, and now we don't.
  - citilife 4y ago
    Did you read the rest of the comment? It's not clear it's worse than before. > It doesn't change the fact that we used to be able to do routine maintenance that covered this, and now we don't. When you first build a road you don't need to do said maintenance. So as we expand the number of roads and convert them from gravel to concrete, you'll have more potholes. It's not clear it's any worse per-mile of concrete road than before. But even if it was "worse" we have significantly more road than say 30 years ago.
    - mbg721 4y ago
      Maybe I'm zeroing in on a much shorter term; the potholes, winter reflectors, and other various road items are clearly worse than say, five years ago. 30 years, maybe not; expectations in the world of phone booths were way different.
sophacles 4y ago
I've lived in Illinois my whole life (Im in my 40s). I've heard how the potholes are terrible and getting worse as long as I can remember. They aren't particularly bad, nor do they seem to be getting worse. Observations I've made: * Snow plows have 2 functions: moving snow and making potholes. The frequency of pothole complaints starts climbing in November and peaks around April (when construction season gets started). * "that pothole has been there 20 years" typically actually means "that pothole is near where a different one was located at some point in the last couple decades", or "that's a spot where the plows often can tear up the road" * The people who often complain about potholes on some stretch of road tend to suddenly be the people who complain about how re-doing that stretch of road is a waste of money because "it was just fine before". * 10 years after a re-pave when some street gets it's first new pothole - "ugh they just redid this road and it's already got potholes? typical $city_name"
- Ekaros 4y ago
  I wonder if this is more correlation than causation. The pot holes are result of freezing/thawing cycle. And this happens when there is need for snow plows. Though snow plows certainly can make them worse.
  - sophacles 4y ago
    The freeze/thaw cycles put cracks in the road. The snowplows (basically a fast bulldozer) excavate those into potholes (when the blade catches the crack, it tears up a chunk of asphalt with it, starting a feedback loop because theres more space for freezing to exert force causing more cracks...).

by mbg721 4y ago

citilife 4y ago

Half the world doesn't have pavement... And potholes are almost always created due to extreme weather (very hot -> very cold -> repeat). My parents recall potholes so bad it'd destroy your car in the 80s. Concrete and the ability to fill potholes have improved over time. There's little reason to assume it's any worse than before, except some roads need replacement... but if you don't replace it (or prior to building the road) it was clearly worse.

LargeWu 4y ago
In regions with colder winters, it's typically a function of freeze/thaw cycles. Water gets inside cracks, freezes, and the expansion breaks up the pavement. Then it thaws and softens, and traffic knocks bits loose. Then more water gets in the now bigger cracks, it freezes again and the cycle repeats, but a little worse this time. Then again and again.
mbg721 4y ago
Saying "Half the world doesn't have pavement" is like saying "Eat your broccoli, because some children halfway around the world are starving." It doesn't change the fact that we used to be able to do routine maintenance that covered this, and now we don't.
- citilife 4y ago
  Did you read the rest of the comment? It's not clear it's worse than before. > It doesn't change the fact that we used to be able to do routine maintenance that covered this, and now we don't. When you first build a road you don't need to do said maintenance. So as we expand the number of roads and convert them from gravel to concrete, you'll have more potholes. It's not clear it's any worse per-mile of concrete road than before. But even if it was "worse" we have significantly more road than say 30 years ago.
  - mbg721 4y ago
    Maybe I'm zeroing in on a much shorter term; the potholes, winter reflectors, and other various road items are clearly worse than say, five years ago. 30 years, maybe not; expectations in the world of phone booths were way different.

sophacles 4y ago

I've lived in Illinois my whole life (Im in my 40s). I've heard how the potholes are terrible and getting worse as long as I can remember. They aren't particularly bad, nor do they seem to be getting worse. Observations I've made: * Snow plows have 2 functions: moving snow and making potholes. The frequency of pothole complaints starts climbing in November and peaks around April (when construction season gets started). * "that pothole has been there 20 years" typically actually means "that pothole is near where a different one was located at some point in the last couple decades", or "that's a spot where the plows often can tear up the road" * The people who often complain about potholes on some stretch of road tend to suddenly be the people who complain about how re-doing that stretch of road is a waste of money because "it was just fine before". * 10 years after a re-pave when some street gets it's first new pothole - "ugh they just redid this road and it's already got potholes? typical $city_name"

Ekaros 4y ago
I wonder if this is more correlation than causation. The pot holes are result of freezing/thawing cycle. And this happens when there is need for snow plows. Though snow plows certainly can make them worse.
- sophacles 4y ago
  The freeze/thaw cycles put cracks in the road. The snowplows (basically a fast bulldozer) excavate those into potholes (when the blade catches the crack, it tears up a chunk of asphalt with it, starting a feedback loop because theres more space for freezing to exert force causing more cracks...).