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I think the idea would be that in a scenario where crypto becomes a currency, there wouldn't need to be an off-ramp (at least immediately, think war/revolution)

by ragnot 4y ago

I think the idea would be that in a scenario where crypto becomes a currency, there wouldn't need to be an off-ramp (at least immediately, think war/revolution). You would trade the crypto like "real" money.

toomuchtodo 4y ago
This requires price stability, which is at odds with the use of crypto as a speculative investment vehicle. People use fiat to transact because it is stable. It’s stable because a central bank is using tools available to bring about stability.
- T0Bi 4y ago
  There are decentralized stable coins such as Dai that survived massive crashes/volatility in the past and still remained on peg. Crypto ≠ Bitcoin.
  - toomuchtodo 4y ago
    Unless you have a nation state backing the currency, its speculative assets all the way down.
- ragnot 4y ago
  It's a hedge. Like anything other hedge it's not bulletproof. I'm blessed to live in a country that has sound monetary policy (you do too probably). But there are millions (if not billions) of people who don't. Crypto offers a way to avoid capital controls when governments fail. It's not the crypto itself, its just the most convenient way. See: https://restofworld.org/2021/the-cryptocurrency-dons-of-beirut/ https://restofworld.org/2021/the-cryptocurrency-dons-of-beir...
  - toomuchtodo 4y ago
    Sort of agree. Find ways to issue them digital wallets with fiat currency support. Venezuelans using Zelle to transact in dollars comes to mind. It’s a financial inclusion and digital identity story, high level. But if you’re violating nation state laws (AML/KYC/money laundering/capital controls), you’re not likely to avoid repercussions for that, state monopoly on force and all that jazz. https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2020/06/16/venezuela-is-a-testing-ground-for-digital-dollarization-and-zelle-doesnt-like-it/ https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2020/06/16/venezuela-is-a-t...
bitxbitxbitcoin 4y ago
There's another likely scenario (at least in my mind) where Bitcoin is a global reserve "currency" like gold used to be. In this instance, the on/off ramps that exist already would still likely be the ones around. That is to say, completely centralized instiutions that interface with completely centralized fiat currencies. Bitcoin isn't going to replace countries, countries will likely have fiat stablecoins which is exactly where our increasingly cashless societies are headed towards. tldr; either the crypto itself is traded like real money, or a l2 or even centralized unconnected layer is - either way on/off ramps that currently exist (p2p and centralized) continue to exist and thrive.
xadhominemx 4y ago
You still need an on-ramp inside of the authoritarian country you want to depart

by ragnot 4y ago

toomuchtodo 4y ago

This requires price stability, which is at odds with the use of crypto as a speculative investment vehicle. People use fiat to transact because it is stable. It’s stable because a central bank is using tools available to bring about stability.

T0Bi 4y ago
There are decentralized stable coins such as Dai that survived massive crashes/volatility in the past and still remained on peg. Crypto ≠ Bitcoin.
- toomuchtodo 4y ago
  Unless you have a nation state backing the currency, its speculative assets all the way down.
ragnot 4y ago
It's a hedge. Like anything other hedge it's not bulletproof. I'm blessed to live in a country that has sound monetary policy (you do too probably). But there are millions (if not billions) of people who don't. Crypto offers a way to avoid capital controls when governments fail. It's not the crypto itself, its just the most convenient way. See: https://restofworld.org/2021/the-cryptocurrency-dons-of-beirut/ https://restofworld.org/2021/the-cryptocurrency-dons-of-beir...
- toomuchtodo 4y ago
  Sort of agree. Find ways to issue them digital wallets with fiat currency support. Venezuelans using Zelle to transact in dollars comes to mind. It’s a financial inclusion and digital identity story, high level. But if you’re violating nation state laws (AML/KYC/money laundering/capital controls), you’re not likely to avoid repercussions for that, state monopoly on force and all that jazz. https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2020/06/16/venezuela-is-a-testing-ground-for-digital-dollarization-and-zelle-doesnt-like-it/ https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2020/06/16/venezuela-is-a-t...

bitxbitxbitcoin 4y ago

There's another likely scenario (at least in my mind) where Bitcoin is a global reserve "currency" like gold used to be. In this instance, the on/off ramps that exist already would still likely be the ones around. That is to say, completely centralized instiutions that interface with completely centralized fiat currencies. Bitcoin isn't going to replace countries, countries will likely have fiat stablecoins which is exactly where our increasingly cashless societies are headed towards. tldr; either the crypto itself is traded like real money, or a l2 or even centralized unconnected layer is - either way on/off ramps that currently exist (p2p and centralized) continue to exist and thrive.

xadhominemx 4y ago

You still need an on-ramp inside of the authoritarian country you want to depart