4 ms·

Singapore's repression isn't exactly a secret, and if freedom is not a purpose to use your wealth for, then I don't see the point of wealth. Counterculture is

• deltree7 4y ago
  • projectazorian 4y ago
    A lot of Singaporeans are unhappy with things, especially in the younger generations. If you've spent any length of time there and talked to people it's not hard to pick up on. There's a reason the government has turned up the level of repression over the past decade.
    • deltree7 4y ago
      A lot of younger Americans, Finnish, Swedish, Danish, Japanese are pretty unhappy too. Have you talked to them?
  • blurbleblurble 4y ago
    I once knew a penpal who grew up in Singapore. They shared with me how frustrating the repressive cultural norms and strict speech / sexuality laws were. It interfered with basic social trust... Like they couldn't be sure if their friends were gonna out them intentionally or unintentionally for something. I got the feeling they felt safe to vent to me and took the chance to do so. None of this is to say the US doesn't have its own issues with authoritarianism and repressive cultural norms. Seems like a pretty global thing right now actually.
    • notahacker 4y ago
      I think one also has to be wary about conflating fear of the government and fear of reaction from their family in a socially conservative society (and Singapore is, whilst certainly less conservative than much of Asia and rarely overt in its homophobia like large minorities in much of the West, a country where more than half the population disapprove of homosexuality). I certainly heard no shortage of worries about outing from people growing up in certain parts of the USA. The Singaporean government's position is illiberal and weirdly contorted on homosexuality (the longstanding and repeatedly reaffirmed policy has been don't remove or enforce the old colonial ban on it, and permit pride events in specific areas) but ironically the reason it hasn't liberalised it yet is because it's afraid of public backlash rather than out of desire to impose behavioural rules on the population.
  • bergenty 4y ago
    It’s repressive if you’re an explicit LGBT person. But to be very honest, I’m okay with the strict (public) conformity. I like the idea of a common cohesive culture and don’t like the LGBT movement in America at all (though I’m totally for people to do whatever in private). As humans, it helps to have a “correct path” that everyone in society agrees upon as long as it’s not exclusive of people that cannot change their “condition”.
• bnralt 4y ago
  Singapore isn't noticeably more repressive than other countries in South East Asia. All things considered, I'd say it probably leans on the more open side, but these things are hard to judge. If people want to avoid South East Asia altogether because it's systems are too different, they're welcome to. But I don't think it makes sense to expect everyone to write off the entire region. As for culture, Gibson is dismissive of their music and gets bothered that people in music stores don't recognize the Japanese punk band he likes. Rather than being open to the local music (which I personally have enjoyed), he's bothered that the people he meets aren't following along with the same global cosmopolitan trends he's accustomed to.
  • pessimizer 4y ago
    Repression is a set of vicious laws that strictly punish people who step out of line, not a vibe. It's alright to enjoy a repressive culture, but odds are it because the laws are directed at people who are not you, to keep them from bothering you. That's why a good sign of repression is presidents-for-life and political dynasties. You didn't need the laws unless you had a population who wanted to do the things.
    • rayiner 4y ago
      The laws exist to keep the minority of counter culture people from disrupting the orderly society enjoyed by the majority. Elevating the “rights” of the minority over the comfort of the majority is not a universal value.
      • pasabagi 4y ago
        Eh, if you look at the history of the current state of Singapore, it's quite obvious that the repression was in no means put in place for any kind of high-minded weighing of the needs of the many against the few. It was put in place by the regime of Lee Kuan Kew, which was every bit as morally bankrupt and shamelessly brutal as the man himself.
      • brnt 4y ago
        Protecting minorities from the majority is precisely what democracy is about. Might is not right!
• rayiner 4y ago
  This is a very western viewpoint! For most Asian societies, “freedom” is a means to an end, not an end in itself. Some level of counterculture is inevitable and must be tolerated. But folks in Tokyo, for example, wouldn’t be happier if their society were more like NYC!
  • brnt 4y ago
    Human rights are not Western, they are universal. Don't eat the propaganda so willingly.
    • rayiner 4y ago
      The notion that folks in NYC have figured out some “universal” truth that folks in Japan haven’t is the propaganda.
      • brnt 4y ago
        Nothing says "I'm a westerner" more than speaking about "Asia". Never been to NYC btw.
        • rayiner 4y ago
          I’m Bangladeshi (but born in Thailand and raised in the US) so I’m not unfamiliar with the general contours of “Asian” cultures. While south Asians, East Asians, and Southeast Asians, in particular are vastly different culturally (as well as massive cultural differences within each of those groups), it’s fair to characterize Asian cultures as placing far less emphasis on individual “freedom” than western ones. Until 2019 Tokyo schools required all students to have black hair—including dyeing hair for students who don’t have black hair naturally. In America people would consider that a violation of “universal human rights.” Bangladeshis aren’t quite so conformist, but my parents would flip out if I did anything to my appearance that would stand out in public.
          • soraminazuki 4y ago
• m1gu3l 4y ago
  > if freedom is not a purpose to use your wealth for, then I don't see the point of wealth. Perhaps you are not creative or evil enough for exploring alternatives.