4 ms·

If that "delusion" were really so maladaptive it would have been outcompeted by now.

jstanley 4y ago
Has it not been?
photochemsyn 4y ago
The concept of (religious fanatics + nuclear weapons) has greatly undermined the old 'utilitarian' argument about the social benefits of religion. For those who haven't heard it, that argument is something like 'yes, religious texts are just fairy tales, but religious belief leads to social cohesion and confers survival advantages on a society, so we should promote it, even though we don't believe in it ourselves.' Another somewhat more cynical take on the utilitarian argument is that religious believers are conditioned to accept rule by a small elite (aka the feudal aristocracy) and can be more easily manipulated by propaganda.
- bbarn 4y ago
  I buy that argument. I am a 44 year old atheist and even in my life I've seen the difference in society from when being a Christian in the US was just something most people did, to now where we're all much more secular. Religion's negatives get a lot more press than it's positives.
  - hiptobecubic 4y ago
    Promoting cults is all well and good until your neighbor is in the wrong cult and then suddenly it's a disaster. My experience has been that "is religious" is not at all a good predictor of whether someone is going to be a "good citizen." Instead it's "lives in a community with low socioeconomic diversity," where that last one is not "pakistani vs british" but way more specific, like "center-right environmentalist in the middle third of income."
diordiderot 4y ago
Eh time hasn't stopped yet and there's a lot more 'competing' to be done
dqpb 4y ago
It's probably hard to measure, because there are many reasons to act like you have the delusion, even if you don't. For example, to avoid physical danger, to avoid social ostracization, to benefit from the social network, to gain power and influence, etc. The delusion (or at least it's theatrics) is part of a bigger social package. It's a bit like product bundling, or subprime mortgage securitization, or suspiciously large wooden gifts. The good parts are good, and the bad parts benefit from the aggregate value function.

Has it not been?

The concept of (religious fanatics + nuclear weapons) has greatly undermined the old 'utilitarian' argument about the social benefits of religion. For those who haven't heard it, that argument is something like 'yes, religious texts are just fairy tales, but religious belief leads to social cohesion and confers survival advantages on a society, so we should promote it, even though we don't believe in it ourselves.' Another somewhat more cynical take on the utilitarian argument is that religious believers are conditioned to accept rule by a small elite (aka the feudal aristocracy) and can be more easily manipulated by propaganda.

bbarn 4y ago
I buy that argument. I am a 44 year old atheist and even in my life I've seen the difference in society from when being a Christian in the US was just something most people did, to now where we're all much more secular. Religion's negatives get a lot more press than it's positives.
- hiptobecubic 4y ago
  Promoting cults is all well and good until your neighbor is in the wrong cult and then suddenly it's a disaster. My experience has been that "is religious" is not at all a good predictor of whether someone is going to be a "good citizen." Instead it's "lives in a community with low socioeconomic diversity," where that last one is not "pakistani vs british" but way more specific, like "center-right environmentalist in the middle third of income."

diordiderot 4y ago

Eh time hasn't stopped yet and there's a lot more 'competing' to be done

dqpb 4y ago

It's probably hard to measure, because there are many reasons to act like you have the delusion, even if you don't. For example, to avoid physical danger, to avoid social ostracization, to benefit from the social network, to gain power and influence, etc. The delusion (or at least it's theatrics) is part of a bigger social package. It's a bit like product bundling, or subprime mortgage securitization, or suspiciously large wooden gifts. The good parts are good, and the bad parts benefit from the aggregate value function.