4 ms·

Medical diagnosis are man made labels created by committee. If I say having blond hair is a medical condition then I can absolutely do a falsifiable test of wh

Medical diagnosis are man made labels created by committee. If I say having blond hair is a medical condition then I can absolutely do a falsifiable test of whether you have blond hair. So the issue isn't so much falsifiability per see but instead the whether you trust the judgement of people who decide what is "normal" or "not normal".

mtlmtlmtlmtl 4y ago
Diagnoses are defined through research. The committee part is just about updating diagnostic manuals to reflect current consensus. New diagnoses need to be proven to be distinct entities(i.e not redundant) and clinically meaningful. And they specifically need to have a diagnostic test. Having blond hair has a diagnostic test, sure, but that diagnostic test does not in itself constitute a distinct, clinically useful diagnosis. Of course hair colour can change due to medical conditions, but then the hair colour would obviously be just one symptom of some set of conditions that may have caused it.
- anotherman554 4y ago
  I do not agree. You can research how much of the population has blond hair, and how much this diverges from the "typical" hair color. But the decision to define or not define blond hair as a medical condition is a value call because the definition of a medical condition is ultimately that which people call a medical condition. And whether something is clinically useful isn't the standard for defining a condition, because ability to successfully treat a disease isn't a standard in deciding whether something is a disease and because therapy isn't limited to people who have diseases. (Unless professionals are now calling marital problems a disease?)
  - mtlmtlmtlmtl 4y ago
    You can agree or disagree, but the fact is that diagnoses almost always include a mandatory requirement that the condition has a significant negative impact on the patient's life. It's not merely a value judgment, and it's definitely not an arbitray judgement. The AMA or the CDC can't just decide that blod hair is now a medical disorder for no other reason than it would be helpful to your strawman. Clearly a lot of research and deliberation goes into these decisions. That's why new revisions of the DSM literally take years to complete.
    - anotherman554 4y ago
      "...a mandatory requirement that the condition has a significant negative impact on the patient's life." Lot's of things have negative impacts that aren't considered medical conditions, on the other hand Elan Musk says he has Aspergers. Nobody seems to doubt it. This shows that someone can climb to the top of the social world but still be told they have a disease supposedly associated with "significant negative impact" on social skills.
      - mbg721 4y ago
        The mental health world is measuring different things from the business world. I mean, Hitler was Chancellor of an advanced European nation, that must make him fine, right?
      - watwut 4y ago
        > This shows that someone can climb to the top of the social world but still be told they have a disease supposedly associated with "significant negative impact" on social skills. Narcissists, sociopaths regularly climb up while being impaired and causing damage everyone around. People with OCD or hypochondriac too. Bipolar people the same. That does not make those non existent either.
        anotherman554 4y ago
        I don't see how your mention of OCD, bipolar disorder, narcissisms or sociopathy is relevant to someone with a supposed social skill disorder being really good at navigating and conquering the social world. To me the claim that Musk has Aspergers is like being told an Olympic marathon runner has a leg disability.
        watwut 4y ago
        Asperger is by definition mild variant. It is not equivalent leg disability. Plus, lack of empathy can be advantage in business - you care less about impact on others. Asperger is not something that excludes you from success. OCD and being bipolar have much graver consequences on your life and success.

mtlmtlmtlmtl 4y ago

Diagnoses are defined through research. The committee part is just about updating diagnostic manuals to reflect current consensus. New diagnoses need to be proven to be distinct entities(i.e not redundant) and clinically meaningful. And they specifically need to have a diagnostic test. Having blond hair has a diagnostic test, sure, but that diagnostic test does not in itself constitute a distinct, clinically useful diagnosis. Of course hair colour can change due to medical conditions, but then the hair colour would obviously be just one symptom of some set of conditions that may have caused it.

anotherman554 4y ago
I do not agree. You can research how much of the population has blond hair, and how much this diverges from the "typical" hair color. But the decision to define or not define blond hair as a medical condition is a value call because the definition of a medical condition is ultimately that which people call a medical condition. And whether something is clinically useful isn't the standard for defining a condition, because ability to successfully treat a disease isn't a standard in deciding whether something is a disease and because therapy isn't limited to people who have diseases. (Unless professionals are now calling marital problems a disease?)
- mtlmtlmtlmtl 4y ago
  You can agree or disagree, but the fact is that diagnoses almost always include a mandatory requirement that the condition has a significant negative impact on the patient's life. It's not merely a value judgment, and it's definitely not an arbitray judgement. The AMA or the CDC can't just decide that blod hair is now a medical disorder for no other reason than it would be helpful to your strawman. Clearly a lot of research and deliberation goes into these decisions. That's why new revisions of the DSM literally take years to complete.
  - anotherman554 4y ago
    "...a mandatory requirement that the condition has a significant negative impact on the patient's life." Lot's of things have negative impacts that aren't considered medical conditions, on the other hand Elan Musk says he has Aspergers. Nobody seems to doubt it. This shows that someone can climb to the top of the social world but still be told they have a disease supposedly associated with "significant negative impact" on social skills.
    - mbg721 4y ago
      The mental health world is measuring different things from the business world. I mean, Hitler was Chancellor of an advanced European nation, that must make him fine, right?
    - watwut 4y ago
      > This shows that someone can climb to the top of the social world but still be told they have a disease supposedly associated with "significant negative impact" on social skills. Narcissists, sociopaths regularly climb up while being impaired and causing damage everyone around. People with OCD or hypochondriac too. Bipolar people the same. That does not make those non existent either.
      - anotherman554 4y ago
        I don't see how your mention of OCD, bipolar disorder, narcissisms or sociopathy is relevant to someone with a supposed social skill disorder being really good at navigating and conquering the social world. To me the claim that Musk has Aspergers is like being told an Olympic marathon runner has a leg disability.
        watwut 4y ago
        Asperger is by definition mild variant. It is not equivalent leg disability. Plus, lack of empathy can be advantage in business - you care less about impact on others. Asperger is not something that excludes you from success. OCD and being bipolar have much graver consequences on your life and success.