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> The only real benefit of public transit is you can read during the commute. I think there is more to it than this. When driving, your nervous system is conti

• Skunkleton 4y ago
  > 1.5 hours of sitting peacefully on public transit is dramatic Sitting peacefully isn’t really possible on a lot of public transit, especially during rush hours.
  • toxik 4y ago
    To me, that sounds like your public transportation can’t handle peak demand properly. I think that’s actually solvable by building more transportation and scheduling more trains, busses, etc. There will of course always be a trade off between peak capacity and spending, but this isn’t any less true for cars.
    • j7ake 4y ago
      Which cities handle peak demand such that everybody gets a seat on the metro or bus?
  • _whiteCaps_ 4y ago
    Commuting from certain suburbs into downtown Vancouver is great - a real train with many sections having tables and power outlets. Pretty much everyone gets a seat. But if you're in other areas, getting into Vancouver is like you described. There's options for more light rail around here but no political will to get it done.
• coffee_beqn 4y ago
  Even that is assuming the public transit has enough capacity and safety. I remember the Seattle E-line before the pandemic for example. Packed in like sardines so you have to stand and maybe be able to hold on to something. Almost always someone at least yelling incoherently or starting a fight with an unlucky passenger. It was certainly not a relaxing reading nook. Not to mention having to often wait for 2 or more buses to fit inside at all. In many EU countries public transit is excellent even in the suburbs/exurbs. But it’s an order of magnitude difference in funding that I don’t see the US really ever doing.
  • kijin 4y ago
    Totally agreed. I would much rather sit in stop-and-go traffic for an hour than stand in a crowded bus or subway for the same hour. Especially with all the sensors and smart safety features that modern cars come with, I don't feel that driving is any more stressful than having to balance myself on a constantly shaking bus while holding onto a crappy rubber handle, for example. A reserved seat in an actual train, though, would be a different story.
• briandear 4y ago
  I ride motorcycles and that intense focus for me is meditative. I feel more engaged and alert after a 30 minute motorcycle ride than I do riding an Uber. The motorcycle riding has a similar counterintuitive effect (for me) as Ritalin. (Ritalin is a stimulant used to treat ADHD.) When I ride public transport or have a driver — I feel relatively more lethargic than when I ride the motorcycle (and to a lesser extend driving a car.) > it is to massively double down on improving public transit Why? Private transport represents freedom, public transit represents control. Furthermore, getting public transit to a level of perfect will cost tens of billions of dollars and for what benefit? To have cities and towns shut down each time there is a transit strike, a superstorm, or the government decides we should stay home? Cars, motorcycles, bicycles, scooters — those work. Let’s make that better. I definitely don’t like spending my time sitting next to strangers of an indeterminate mental status in a temperature that isn’t of my own choosing going to a destination that isn’t necessarily the precise place I want to go. I want to interact with strangers as little as possible. Raise the fares to $20 (and enforce it) and perhaps I’d consider riding public transit. But after my experiences with the BART and piss-soaked, rat infested NYC subway stations, no thank you. If I want thrills hanging out with a bunch of psychotics waiting for an excuse to push you onto the tracks, I’d rather BASE jump the Met Life building instead. For a young single person carrying nothing more than their Manhattan Portage satchel to some hipster haunt in Brooklyn, public transport can be great. For people with stuff to carry, small kids, wheelchairs, or mobility issues, or tight schedules, not so much. Add the safety aspects to it and public transport becomes less attractive — unless of course they start allowing those with firearms permits to carry on public transport. But even then, not sure why people would want to give up point to point freedom for public options.
  • AlotOfReading 4y ago
    Imagine you're a person who occasionally needs to use a bathroom, or has anxiety about roads/traffic/driving, or claustrophobia from the idea of being stuck in traffic. I know people with all of these issues. Well-designed public transit like trains addresses them far better than personal vehicles. I'm also not sure what personal freedoms you think don't exist in Europe or Asia where such well-designed transit networks exist. You can still have a car, you just don't need to have one.
• wizofaus 4y ago
  I took a train for the first time in a while yesterday (normally I ride everywhere where feasible, though still end up driving more often than I'd like), and was struck by how peaceful and relaxing it was. I honestly didn't care how slow it might be - I had a book, and took pleasure in just watching the world scroll past. If all PT journeys could be like that one suspects they'd be a lot more popular. But service interruptions, poorly connected routes, infrequent services and random overcrowding are the main reality most PT users in many cities around the world have to deal with every day. I don't blame many for preferring to pay eye-watering petrol prices to sit in gridlock instead.
  • listenallyall 4y ago
    > I honestly didn't care how slow it might be which means your experience was not similar to a commuter's, at all
    • wizofaus 4y ago
      No - but if we could aim to make commuting by PT a similarly relaxing and comfortable experience then slowness mightn't be seen as such a bad thing.
      • bioemerl 4y ago
        You're cutting into people's family time with this.
        • wizofaus 4y ago
          Perhaps but it's hard to see how a little more enforced meditative "alone" time would make anyone a worse parent. (Further, where did I say I was suggesting PT should be slower than it is now?)
      • listenallyall 4y ago
        The point of a commuter train is to get to work. On time. Reliably. People freak the fuck out when they're going to be 5-10 minutes late due to any kind of service issue, because even if they know it wasn't their fault, their boss will assume it was (and most people who take public transit have bosses). You can outfit the trains with fine linens and couches instead of seats but being late to work in the morning will never be "relaxing" or "comfortable."
• Am4TIfIsER0ppos 4y ago
  You must live in Japan because you would never relax on the public transport around here, except for the bus before it gets to town and after it leaves.
  • j7ake 4y ago
    Even if you live in Japan you’re going to be spending an hour or so standing on the metro or bus.
• pandaman 4y ago
  Your nervous system is activated even more when walking: firing dozens of muscles for gait, even more for balance, reacting to sounds and movement around you, adjusting to different surfaces, wind, inclination, stairs, avoiding obstacles etc. Yet most people manage to take relaxing walks somehow.
  • atwood22 4y ago
    Driving a car is a life or death situation where you’re engaged in a complex dance with many other people. The cognitive load isn’t even close.
    • pandaman 4y ago
      So is walking down a street: not only can you become a victim of crime or mauled by an animal but a simple fall can kill you. People are different and as some are extremely stressed being outside, some are, too, stressed while driving. Most people manage both just fine though.
      • tmnvix 4y ago
        > not only can you become a victim of crime or mauled by an animal but a simple fall can kill you. Interesting that these are the dangers you bring attention to. Forefront of my mind are the large heavy objects hurtling around.
        • pandaman 4y ago
          I'd expect people to immediately start the "cars are too damn big!" routine if I brought up traffic and the guidelines advise against posting inflammatory content. The point I'm making is even a relaxing walk in a park is "a complex dance of life and death".
      • atwood22 4y ago
        I don't think you're being genuine. Even if walking down the street was filled with personal peril (it's not, at least not the persistent peril of driving), you're still discounting the fact that making a mistake while driving can kill other people. How can I accidentally kill someone when walking down the street and spacing out? While driving on the highway, basically any multi-second lapse in judgement can cause fatalities, not just of yourself but of many others. Operating a multi-ton machine at high speed is definitely more cognitively demanding.
• avalys 4y ago
  The micro-decisions you're referring to are trivial and no more of a cognitive load than deciding where to put your feet while walking. If you're an anxious or unskilled driver, sure, it's probably stressful. But most people reach a point where they are as comfortable driving a car as walking down the street. 30 minutes of driving in my private, climate-controlled car, with a comfortable and highly-adjustable seat, listening to music or podcasts of my choice? And the ability to carry whatever I want? I'd choose that over 30 minutes of sitting on bus or train - which is likely to have uncomfortable seating, too hot or too cold, loud, obnoxious, smelly, or mentally disturbed other people - with no ability to transport anything more than you are willing to carry. Even at par, I would rather have my car - let alone if public transport takes 3x longer. Last time I took BART into SF a guy sat down in the seat in front of me, opened up a plastic bag, and pulled out a needle and started injecting himself with something. I don't believe it was insulin. Uh...rather stick with my car, thanks.