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>As a NYC resident of 20 years I can assure you public transportation much much faster than a car in most cases. Surely you jest. Even in Manhattan this is rar

>As a NYC resident of 20 years I can assure you public transportation much much faster than a car in most cases. Surely you jest. Even in Manhattan this is rarely true. Outside of Manhattan it is practically never true. In some circumstances in Manhattan the subway can indeed be faster, but it’s really only true for traveling north/south along an express line during peak traffic. For instance I can get from 96th to Chambers in about 25 minutes on a subway if I’m lucky with my timing. That’s faster than a car during peak traffic, but slower than a car during any other time of day. But if I need to get from 96th to basically anywhere else that isn’t on the 1/2/3 there is no way the subway will ever win, much less by any significant margin. Even the idea that subway is “much much faster” defies basic logic. If that were universally true few people would ever take a ride share or taxi. And this ignores the almost comical problems and lack of reliability with the subway system in NYC. I cannot count the number of times I’ve had to give up, exit the subway station, and hail a cab. I imagine for many people it’s happened one too many times and they’ve exclusively switched to rideshare/taxi. For me personally I’ve switched to electric bike. I gave up on the subway earlier this year after one too many negative encounters with vagrants and criminals. A good question to ask is how visitors feel about the NYC subway system. When friends or family come to visit, what do they think about it? I don’t know about you, but for me it’s a healthy combo of amazement at the scale of the system, and amazement at how atrocious and disgusting it’s become.

jagger27 4y ago
As an outsider of New York it’s pretty bleak to compare the shininess and opulence of all the new billionaire’s row towers to the decay and grime of the subway. It doesn’t have to be like this.
- etc-hosts 4y ago
  It's because the state of New York controls funding for the NYC subway, instead of the city of NYC.
thecompilr 4y ago
I travel from JC, and I can get to almost any point in Manhattan faster by PATH+subway/walking than by car+parking.
woodruffw 4y ago
This doesn’t comport with my experience on the UWS: the subway was almost always faster for me, rush or not. The only exceptions were cross-town and way out on the 7, e.g. Flushing. My commute from Harlem (when I lived there) to the financial district was 25 minutes by train; a similar car commute would have been around 40 (and I would have needed to find parking). People take ride shares and taxis because of separate pressures, including very reasonable ones like needing to haul something bulky to a specific address or trying to get to their airport (I will freely acknowledge that the subway connections to LGA and JFK are pitiful).
- guardiangod 4y ago
  That's because you live in UWS (that's where I live too). I used to live in Jamaica and trying to get anywhere that's not Manhattan is a chore. For example going to Flushing would take twice as long because you have to get close to Manhatten before you can switch from F line to 7. Bus in this case works fine most of the time though. But you still need to walk to a bus station.
  - woodruffw 4y ago
    I grew up on the UWS (technically not, but it’s now called that because of neighborhood creep), but I currently live in Brooklyn. That’s a fair point — there are a couple of pathological routes in the subway system, and traveling between Jamaica and Flushing is definitely one of them. But yeah — IME the bus tends to cover those gaps relatively well; the MTA’s priority (for better or worse) is high-traffic routes, meaning routes between the outer boroughs and Manhattan.
  - Wowfunhappy 4y ago
    I mean, yes, I think it’s fairly well-known that the further out from Manhattan you are, the worse NYC public transit is. At the most extreme end, if you live in Statin Island you’re gonna have a bad time. Not coincidentally, many people there have cars. IMO, the key idea here is that public transit is slower in places that have bad public transit. To find examples of really good public transit, you have to look outside the United States.
a-dub 4y ago
the subway is fine. visitors are always taken aback by the general grittiness of new york. traffic in the city is unpredictable and cars often spend a lot of time sitting at lights. parking is a nightmare. post pandemic reliability has reduced, but it's still pretty stellar. vagrants and criminals are an internet mirage, like when you start a new job and everyone is just parroting shit they read on glassdoor.
- parkingrift 4y ago
  Last time my wife and I took a subway home from lower Manhattan we first dealt with a homeless man who entered the subway and tried to steal my wife's leftover food. Then we dealt with another homeless person who decided a subway car was the place to smoke a cigar. People calling this stuff an "internet mirage" are just delusional to the reality that is slowly destroying the subway system. Why do you think ridership is down to 55% of pre-covid levels?
Wowfunhappy 4y ago
> For instance I can get from 96th to Chambers in about 25 minutes on a subway if I’m lucky with my timing. That’s faster than a car during peak traffic, but slower than a car during any other time of day. Google Maps says both trips should take the same amount of time in the absolute dead of night. https://www.google.com/maps/dir/40.7154695,-74.0091386/40.7938758,-73.9720696/@40.7558192,-74.0274915,13z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m6!4m5!2m3!6e0!7e2!8j1659398340!3e0 https://www.google.com/maps/dir/40.7154695,-74.0091386/40.79... https://www.google.com/maps/dir/40.7154695,-74.0091386/40.7938758,-73.9720696/@40.7548299,-74.0256773,13z/am=t/data=!3m1!4b1!4m7!4m6!2m3!6e0!7e2!8j1659398340!3e3!5i1 https://www.google.com/maps/dir/40.7154695,-74.0091386/40.79... Admittedly, both ends of this trip are right by a subway station, but they're also both near the FDR Drive highway. And we're leaving out the time it takes to park your car, and it's the dead of night.
- parkingrift 4y ago
  There is a lot of luck bundled up with the Google Maps estimates. You may immediately hop on an express train... or you may wait 7 minutes. We're also discussing the absolute best case scenario for a subway where I just happen to need zero east/west travel at entry or exit. Basically, this is a hypothetical trip from 96th to Chambers where the subway has every conceivable advantage possible, and it's still a wash in most circumstances. >And we're leaving out the time it takes to park your car, and it's the dead of night. It would be silly to drive your own personal car within Manhattan, so my analysis is strictly comparing rideshare/taxi to subway.
  - Wowfunhappy 4y ago
    > You may immediately hop on an express train... or you may wait 7 minutes. If we really are talking about midnight, perhaps. But trains on this line typically arrive every two minutes during rush hour, or every four minutes in the middle of the day. > and it's still a wash in most circumstances. But it's not "most circumstances". During rush hour, this trip could easily take 40 minutes by car, as Google Maps acknowledges. You're of course correct that Google Maps isn't perfect. But I knew my own experience wasn't anything like the times you were quoting, so I was trying to find an authoritative source. I actually think Google Maps is over-estimating the subway time. I know I can get from my apartment on 135th street to Times Square in 26 minutes door-to-door. Around 20 of those minutes are actually sitting on the subway, and I think the train gets to 96th street at around the halfway point.
kareemsabri 4y ago
I don't have this experience at all. I have a car in NYC and am a daily subway rider. Regularly comparing estimated time via Google Maps (which doesn't even include parking) the subway is almost always faster, certainly during hours when there is congestion (which is obviously when most people tend to travel).

jagger27 4y ago

As an outsider of New York it’s pretty bleak to compare the shininess and opulence of all the new billionaire’s row towers to the decay and grime of the subway. It doesn’t have to be like this.

etc-hosts 4y ago
It's because the state of New York controls funding for the NYC subway, instead of the city of NYC.

thecompilr 4y ago

I travel from JC, and I can get to almost any point in Manhattan faster by PATH+subway/walking than by car+parking.

woodruffw 4y ago

This doesn’t comport with my experience on the UWS: the subway was almost always faster for me, rush or not. The only exceptions were cross-town and way out on the 7, e.g. Flushing. My commute from Harlem (when I lived there) to the financial district was 25 minutes by train; a similar car commute would have been around 40 (and I would have needed to find parking). People take ride shares and taxis because of separate pressures, including very reasonable ones like needing to haul something bulky to a specific address or trying to get to their airport (I will freely acknowledge that the subway connections to LGA and JFK are pitiful).

guardiangod 4y ago
That's because you live in UWS (that's where I live too). I used to live in Jamaica and trying to get anywhere that's not Manhattan is a chore. For example going to Flushing would take twice as long because you have to get close to Manhatten before you can switch from F line to 7. Bus in this case works fine most of the time though. But you still need to walk to a bus station.
- woodruffw 4y ago
  I grew up on the UWS (technically not, but it’s now called that because of neighborhood creep), but I currently live in Brooklyn. That’s a fair point — there are a couple of pathological routes in the subway system, and traveling between Jamaica and Flushing is definitely one of them. But yeah — IME the bus tends to cover those gaps relatively well; the MTA’s priority (for better or worse) is high-traffic routes, meaning routes between the outer boroughs and Manhattan.
- Wowfunhappy 4y ago
  I mean, yes, I think it’s fairly well-known that the further out from Manhattan you are, the worse NYC public transit is. At the most extreme end, if you live in Statin Island you’re gonna have a bad time. Not coincidentally, many people there have cars. IMO, the key idea here is that public transit is slower in places that have bad public transit. To find examples of really good public transit, you have to look outside the United States.

a-dub 4y ago

the subway is fine. visitors are always taken aback by the general grittiness of new york. traffic in the city is unpredictable and cars often spend a lot of time sitting at lights. parking is a nightmare. post pandemic reliability has reduced, but it's still pretty stellar. vagrants and criminals are an internet mirage, like when you start a new job and everyone is just parroting shit they read on glassdoor.

parkingrift 4y ago
Last time my wife and I took a subway home from lower Manhattan we first dealt with a homeless man who entered the subway and tried to steal my wife's leftover food. Then we dealt with another homeless person who decided a subway car was the place to smoke a cigar. People calling this stuff an "internet mirage" are just delusional to the reality that is slowly destroying the subway system. Why do you think ridership is down to 55% of pre-covid levels?

Wowfunhappy 4y ago

> For instance I can get from 96th to Chambers in about 25 minutes on a subway if I’m lucky with my timing. That’s faster than a car during peak traffic, but slower than a car during any other time of day. Google Maps says both trips should take the same amount of time in the absolute dead of night. https://www.google.com/maps/dir/40.7154695,-74.0091386/40.7938758,-73.9720696/@40.7558192,-74.0274915,13z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m6!4m5!2m3!6e0!7e2!8j1659398340!3e0 https://www.google.com/maps/dir/40.7154695,-74.0091386/40.79... https://www.google.com/maps/dir/40.7154695,-74.0091386/40.7938758,-73.9720696/@40.7548299,-74.0256773,13z/am=t/data=!3m1!4b1!4m7!4m6!2m3!6e0!7e2!8j1659398340!3e3!5i1 https://www.google.com/maps/dir/40.7154695,-74.0091386/40.79... Admittedly, both ends of this trip are right by a subway station, but they're also both near the FDR Drive highway. And we're leaving out the time it takes to park your car, and it's the dead of night.

parkingrift 4y ago
There is a lot of luck bundled up with the Google Maps estimates. You may immediately hop on an express train... or you may wait 7 minutes. We're also discussing the absolute best case scenario for a subway where I just happen to need zero east/west travel at entry or exit. Basically, this is a hypothetical trip from 96th to Chambers where the subway has every conceivable advantage possible, and it's still a wash in most circumstances. >And we're leaving out the time it takes to park your car, and it's the dead of night. It would be silly to drive your own personal car within Manhattan, so my analysis is strictly comparing rideshare/taxi to subway.
- Wowfunhappy 4y ago
  > You may immediately hop on an express train... or you may wait 7 minutes. If we really are talking about midnight, perhaps. But trains on this line typically arrive every two minutes during rush hour, or every four minutes in the middle of the day. > and it's still a wash in most circumstances. But it's not "most circumstances". During rush hour, this trip could easily take 40 minutes by car, as Google Maps acknowledges. You're of course correct that Google Maps isn't perfect. But I knew my own experience wasn't anything like the times you were quoting, so I was trying to find an authoritative source. I actually think Google Maps is over-estimating the subway time. I know I can get from my apartment on 135th street to Times Square in 26 minutes door-to-door. Around 20 of those minutes are actually sitting on the subway, and I think the train gets to 96th street at around the halfway point.

kareemsabri 4y ago

I don't have this experience at all. I have a car in NYC and am a daily subway rider. Regularly comparing estimated time via Google Maps (which doesn't even include parking) the subway is almost always faster, certainly during hours when there is congestion (which is obviously when most people tend to travel).