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> This is the myth of "chinese national humiliation" that is a common talking point of Chinese nationalists and is used to foment nationalist sentiment. Repeati

> This is the myth of "chinese national humiliation" that is a common talking point of Chinese nationalists and is used to foment nationalist sentiment. Repeating it doesn't make it real. The idea has existed way before the CCP was formed. See the May 4th movement. Just because you don't want to acknowledge it doesn't mean it's fake. Calling someone a "nationalist" just because you don't like the point, neither automatically makes that person a nationalist, nor does it invalidate the point. It's also interesting how people say "never forget" w.r.t. WW2 atrocities, but when it comes to atrocities done against China it quickly becomes "get over it". > you can't at all do that internationally. Not disagreeing with you. But please tell me why Starlink has uncontrolled reentry, and why there's not a similar amount of outrage against that. https://twitter.com/planet4589/status/1551434933285052416 https://twitter.com/planet4589/status/1551434933285052416 > Japan values the life of an individual at even higher levels than we do in the US. You mean Japanese aren't known to do things that they don't like at an individual level, but still do because they feel compelled to for the benefit of the group? What do you think the phenomenon of not being able to turn down a boss invitation to group drinking exactly is? Why do you think Japanese has fewer problems with masks? > BTW this technique of expanding their own values to all of Asia Woah, now where does this accusation come from? Do you have any sources backing up your claim that this is what they're doing?

mlindner 4y ago
> It's also interesting how people say "never forget" w.r.t. WW2 atrocities, but when it comes to atrocities done against China it quickly becomes "get over it". I don't say that personally, but you're completely misinterpreting the meaning of that. It's about making sure that any one (any country) doesn't repeat the atrocities done by specific countries in WW2. China's version of never forget is about a twisted sense of revenge about what was done to it, not about messaging to its own people to never repeat the things that were done to it. (In fact many in China seems to take the opinion that if something was done to China then it's okay for China to do it to others, which is completely opposite of the messaging you're comparing it to.) > But please tell me why Starlink has uncontrolled reentry, and why there's not a similar amount of outrage against that. Because Starlink is explicitly designed to be 100% demisable (burn up) in the atmosphere so it cannot harm anyone on the ground. Indeed despite there has been about 100 re-entries of Starlink satellites, and no debris have been found. That's why people don't complain about it to the same level. (Plenty of people still complain or invent reasons to complain, like that it's creating too much aluminum in the atmosphere, so it's not without it's complaints.) SpaceX has indeed had debris de-orbit and hit the ground, other than Starlink, and people have complained about that. They were also MUCH smaller than the Chinese stages however. You have to remember that these are some of the biggest single objects re-entering in human history. There have been only 3 objects that have been heavier to re-enter in an uncontrolled fashion. The bigger and heavier they are, the more debris are likely to survive to hit people or objects on the ground. > You mean Japanese aren't known to do things that they don't like at an individual level, but still do because they feel compelled to for the benefit of the group? What do you think the phenomenon of not being able to turn down a boss invitation to group drinking exactly is? Why do you think Japanese has fewer problems with masks? I explicitly was talking about the value that Japan places on an individual's life versus other countries. For example, to what extant a culture is willing to sacrifice an individual's life for the benefit of the greater good. > Woah, now where does this accusation come from? Do you have any sources backing up your claim that this is what they're doing? You were just doing it. You were extrapolating CCP values to all of Asia. That's why I mentioned it in ( ) as a side comment.
mlindner 4y ago
One further note. Here's a list of the largest uncontrolled re-entries. https://planet4589.org/space/articles/big_reentries.txt https://planet4589.org/space/articles/big_reentries.txt Look at the dates on them, other than the Chinese stages.

mlindner 4y ago

> It's also interesting how people say "never forget" w.r.t. WW2 atrocities, but when it comes to atrocities done against China it quickly becomes "get over it". I don't say that personally, but you're completely misinterpreting the meaning of that. It's about making sure that any one (any country) doesn't repeat the atrocities done by specific countries in WW2. China's version of never forget is about a twisted sense of revenge about what was done to it, not about messaging to its own people to never repeat the things that were done to it. (In fact many in China seems to take the opinion that if something was done to China then it's okay for China to do it to others, which is completely opposite of the messaging you're comparing it to.) > But please tell me why Starlink has uncontrolled reentry, and why there's not a similar amount of outrage against that. Because Starlink is explicitly designed to be 100% demisable (burn up) in the atmosphere so it cannot harm anyone on the ground. Indeed despite there has been about 100 re-entries of Starlink satellites, and no debris have been found. That's why people don't complain about it to the same level. (Plenty of people still complain or invent reasons to complain, like that it's creating too much aluminum in the atmosphere, so it's not without it's complaints.) SpaceX has indeed had debris de-orbit and hit the ground, other than Starlink, and people have complained about that. They were also MUCH smaller than the Chinese stages however. You have to remember that these are some of the biggest single objects re-entering in human history. There have been only 3 objects that have been heavier to re-enter in an uncontrolled fashion. The bigger and heavier they are, the more debris are likely to survive to hit people or objects on the ground. > You mean Japanese aren't known to do things that they don't like at an individual level, but still do because they feel compelled to for the benefit of the group? What do you think the phenomenon of not being able to turn down a boss invitation to group drinking exactly is? Why do you think Japanese has fewer problems with masks? I explicitly was talking about the value that Japan places on an individual's life versus other countries. For example, to what extant a culture is willing to sacrifice an individual's life for the benefit of the greater good. > Woah, now where does this accusation come from? Do you have any sources backing up your claim that this is what they're doing? You were just doing it. You were extrapolating CCP values to all of Asia. That's why I mentioned it in ( ) as a side comment.

mlindner 4y ago

One further note. Here's a list of the largest uncontrolled re-entries. https://planet4589.org/space/articles/big_reentries.txt https://planet4589.org/space/articles/big_reentries.txt Look at the dates on them, other than the Chinese stages.