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Mandatory link to https://arewewaylandyet.com https://arewewaylandyet.com Now that distributions mostly default to wayland and pipewire I feel that the linux d

Mandatory link to https://arewewaylandyet.com https://arewewaylandyet.com Now that distributions mostly default to wayland and pipewire I feel that the linux desktop is in a solid place.

ac130kz 4y ago
This, everyone claiming that "Wayland butchered everything" are just unwilling to accept that Wayland is already more than 10 years old
- dolni 4y ago
  Wayland is 10 years old, the importance of it as an X11 successor cannot be understated, and somehow it still has big problems.
  - ac130kz 4y ago
    Big problems are an inevitable part of any software really. Take X11 security issues, for example
- imiric 4y ago
  The fact it took more than 10 years for an alternative display server to be semi-usable is indicative of how much of an uphill battle it was and continues to be. Like another comment pointed out, requiring every single program to support Wayland is a tough pill to swallow. That AreWeWaylandYet site is cute, but the fact it lists individual apps is exactly the problem. If your workflow requires other apps, or if you'd just like to use something else, you're SOL. Switching to Wayland today means replacing most of the apps you're used to already. No wonder adoption is slow.
  - 5e92cb50239222b 4y ago
    > Switching to Wayland today means replacing most of the apps you're used to already. If you mean things like xdotool or a screenshotter, then sure. Otherwise, I can't imagine why you'd do this — at least I didn't have to replace anything (besides a couple of low-level things mentioned above). Old stuff continues to work via xwayland and I only ever notice it because I added a special marker to xwayland windows (to remove xwayland from my system when I notice that it's not used anymore by anything). > requiring every single program to support Wayland compositors do not require "every" application to support them. Most old applications continue to work fine through xwayland (for me it's mostly JetBrains' IDEs — you don't notice it's not a fully "native" application unless you look for it), and everything using toolkits like Qt should just work.
    - imiric 4y ago
      > Most old applications continue to work fine through xwayland That's good to know and I stand corrected. I would still have to switch away from my window manager (bspwm) and hotkey program (sxhkd), which are inevitably tied to X11. While alternatives do exist for Wayland, it would be a substantial change of workflow of my two most used programs.
  - kaba0 4y ago
    > The fact it took more than 10 years for an alternative display server to be semi-usable is indicative of how much of an uphill battle it was and continues to be. That’s more of a social phenomenon not a technical one (bazaar vs cathedral) > Switching to Wayland today means replacing most of the apps you're used to already. No wonder adoption is slow. That’s just plain false. Most application uses a framework and basically all of them has seamless support for multiple render targets, including wayland.

Mandatory link to https://arewewaylandyet.com https://arewewaylandyet.com Now that distributions mostly default to wayland and pipewire I feel that the linux desktop is in a solid place.

ac130kz 4y ago

This, everyone claiming that "Wayland butchered everything" are just unwilling to accept that Wayland is already more than 10 years old

dolni 4y ago
Wayland is 10 years old, the importance of it as an X11 successor cannot be understated, and somehow it still has big problems.
- ac130kz 4y ago
  Big problems are an inevitable part of any software really. Take X11 security issues, for example
imiric 4y ago
The fact it took more than 10 years for an alternative display server to be semi-usable is indicative of how much of an uphill battle it was and continues to be. Like another comment pointed out, requiring every single program to support Wayland is a tough pill to swallow. That AreWeWaylandYet site is cute, but the fact it lists individual apps is exactly the problem. If your workflow requires other apps, or if you'd just like to use something else, you're SOL. Switching to Wayland today means replacing most of the apps you're used to already. No wonder adoption is slow.
- 5e92cb50239222b 4y ago
  > Switching to Wayland today means replacing most of the apps you're used to already. If you mean things like xdotool or a screenshotter, then sure. Otherwise, I can't imagine why you'd do this — at least I didn't have to replace anything (besides a couple of low-level things mentioned above). Old stuff continues to work via xwayland and I only ever notice it because I added a special marker to xwayland windows (to remove xwayland from my system when I notice that it's not used anymore by anything). > requiring every single program to support Wayland compositors do not require "every" application to support them. Most old applications continue to work fine through xwayland (for me it's mostly JetBrains' IDEs — you don't notice it's not a fully "native" application unless you look for it), and everything using toolkits like Qt should just work.
  - imiric 4y ago
    > Most old applications continue to work fine through xwayland That's good to know and I stand corrected. I would still have to switch away from my window manager (bspwm) and hotkey program (sxhkd), which are inevitably tied to X11. While alternatives do exist for Wayland, it would be a substantial change of workflow of my two most used programs.
- kaba0 4y ago
  > The fact it took more than 10 years for an alternative display server to be semi-usable is indicative of how much of an uphill battle it was and continues to be. That’s more of a social phenomenon not a technical one (bazaar vs cathedral) > Switching to Wayland today means replacing most of the apps you're used to already. No wonder adoption is slow. That’s just plain false. Most application uses a framework and basically all of them has seamless support for multiple render targets, including wayland.