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Does this threat make the retired German Gepard air defence tank "modern" again? Alternatively, could one mount something like Phalanx CIWS on a truck? I suppos

by dukoid 4y ago

Does this threat make the retired German Gepard air defence tank "modern" again? Alternatively, could one mount something like Phalanx CIWS on a truck? I suppose one wouldn't want to use (expensive) missiles (stinger?) against small drones? BTW: Why is the ammunition for these systems still on chains -- opposed to "just" shovelling it into some kind of funnel?

vladTheInhaler 4y ago
Apparently it has been done: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phalanx_CIWS#Centurion_C-RAM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phalanx_CIWS#Centurion_C-RAM
ISL 4y ago
Funnels can plug/jam, chains rarely fail. Chainguns generally depend upon an external drive to pull ammunition through a gun -- whether a round in the chamber has fired or not, it will be extracted and a new one put in its place. As I understand it, this is the primary difference between chainguns and belt-fed guns (which use part of the energy expended by the cartridge to cycle the weapon and feed the belt) -- reliability. Edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chain_gun https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chain_gun
- dogma1138 4y ago
  The chain in a chain-gun refers to the motor drive not a chain that hold the cartridges, it just an auto cannon that has its action being operated a motor drive basically it’s a very fast repeating rifle. It doesn’t have much to do with how the ammo is loaded. Also most auto cannons today even the high fire rate ones that are used for CIWS and AA aren’t chain guns.
- adolph 4y ago
  The chain in an externally powered weapon is distinct from the belt [0] (which can be all metal) which is used to feed the ammunition. Its confusing since the sections of a disintegrating belt are referred to as "links." 0. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belt_(firearms) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belt_(firearms) 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M242_Bushmaster https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M242_Bushmaster
323 4y ago
Lasers are supposedly the next big close range drone killers, less than $100 per shot, and infinite rounds (as long as you have fuel obviously).
- zmgsabst 4y ago
  There may be a question for swarms though: An air burst round doesn’t require the system stay pointed as a single target, whereas a laser needs a few seconds on target. At speed-of-sound, a munition moves at about 0.2 miles per second, or about a mile in the engagement time. Which caps the number of targets it can intercept to a handful.
  - happyopossum 4y ago
    > At speed-of-sound, a munition moves at about 0.2 miles per second That's cute - but we aren't firing airguns at these things. A CIWS (the R2D2 looking missile defense cannons) fires its rounds with a velocity of around 3600ft/s, or 3.5x what you seem to be thinking.
    - zmgsabst 4y ago
      I was guesstimating on the low side, for incoming munitions. Faster munitions means that the laser can intercept proportionally fewer targets — which is why it’s a question of if lasers can fend off swarms the way gun based solutions can.

by dukoid 4y ago

vladTheInhaler 4y ago

Apparently it has been done: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phalanx_CIWS#Centurion_C-RAM https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phalanx_CIWS#Centurion_C-RAM

ISL 4y ago

Funnels can plug/jam, chains rarely fail. Chainguns generally depend upon an external drive to pull ammunition through a gun -- whether a round in the chamber has fired or not, it will be extracted and a new one put in its place. As I understand it, this is the primary difference between chainguns and belt-fed guns (which use part of the energy expended by the cartridge to cycle the weapon and feed the belt) -- reliability. Edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chain_gun https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chain_gun

dogma1138 4y ago
The chain in a chain-gun refers to the motor drive not a chain that hold the cartridges, it just an auto cannon that has its action being operated a motor drive basically it’s a very fast repeating rifle. It doesn’t have much to do with how the ammo is loaded. Also most auto cannons today even the high fire rate ones that are used for CIWS and AA aren’t chain guns.
adolph 4y ago
The chain in an externally powered weapon is distinct from the belt [0] (which can be all metal) which is used to feed the ammunition. Its confusing since the sections of a disintegrating belt are referred to as "links." 0. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belt_(firearms) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belt_(firearms) 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M242_Bushmaster https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M242_Bushmaster

323 4y ago

Lasers are supposedly the next big close range drone killers, less than $100 per shot, and infinite rounds (as long as you have fuel obviously).

zmgsabst 4y ago
There may be a question for swarms though: An air burst round doesn’t require the system stay pointed as a single target, whereas a laser needs a few seconds on target. At speed-of-sound, a munition moves at about 0.2 miles per second, or about a mile in the engagement time. Which caps the number of targets it can intercept to a handful.
- happyopossum 4y ago
  > At speed-of-sound, a munition moves at about 0.2 miles per second That's cute - but we aren't firing airguns at these things. A CIWS (the R2D2 looking missile defense cannons) fires its rounds with a velocity of around 3600ft/s, or 3.5x what you seem to be thinking.
  - zmgsabst 4y ago
    I was guesstimating on the low side, for incoming munitions. Faster munitions means that the laser can intercept proportionally fewer targets — which is why it’s a question of if lasers can fend off swarms the way gun based solutions can.