4 ms·

That study has a lot of problems, and several subsequent problems pointed out the holes. Here's a good summary of subsequent research that debunked it. https:/

That study has a lot of problems, and several subsequent problems pointed out the holes. Here's a good summary of subsequent research that debunked it. https://www.vox.com/2016/5/9/11502464/gilens-page-oligarchy-study https://www.vox.com/2016/5/9/11502464/gilens-page-oligarchy-... Even if the study were true it shows that when economic elites (150k+) disagree with the middle class they get there way more often. (Btw it showed that the middle class and the rich agreed like 80-90% of the time on policy, and when they disagreed it wasn't by very many percentage points) But a much more likely scenario than corruption is senators/representatives/presidents are all members of the economic elite, and all their friends are members of the elite and so it's no surprise they share the same opinions as their friends/wives/family members and socio-economic class.

xbar 4y ago
Why is that at all more likely?
- JamesBarney 4y ago
  Do you think it's unlikely that people share the same opinions as their family/friends/colleagues? Or do you think it's very likely that most federal politicians are extremely corrupt and not getting caught?
dr_dshiv 4y ago
How much are politicians paid —and how does their salary affect corruption? It might not be a popular opinion, but perhaps we should double the wages of US Representatives (they currently make $175k—not a lot in Washington DC). Is paying US representatives $350k worth the money? First, a bigger financial cushion for representatives might reduce financial corruption. Second, a bigger salary might attract more talented leaders. Potentially, paying higher salaries would increase the quality of US governance. God, imagine if we could just pay for increased quality in government leaders! TIL that in 1789, the US president made $25k—- worth $800k in 2022. But today, the US president makes $400k. Why try to save money on presidents and politicians?
- JamesBarney 4y ago
  I think we should pay them more. I just think getting better candidates would be much more influential than the reduction in corruption. Most corruption isn't someone dropping off a bag of money. It's an organization donating a bunch of money so they can put somebody intelligent charming and attractive in front of the senator who is going to have a really good argument why certain provisions are good for their constituents.
  - undersuit 4y ago
    I think we should pay all of our politicians more. Some state politicians are essentially volunteer positions. How are we supposed to get younger candidates into politics if you need to be not reliant on an external job that may not approve of your political activities?
    - tremon 4y ago
      It's essentially a remnant of aristocracy: you can only have a say in society if you have time to spare.
- dylan604 4y ago
  No modern politician survives solely on their gov't salary. Typically, politicians have money before starting out. Then, once in, they get all of those juicy "ins" that opens the doors to making more money.
- FpUser 4y ago
  >"It might not be a popular opinion, but perhaps we should double the wages of US Representatives" How about this: we can have some criteria like state of health, education, buying ability etc and call it well being index. If it increases politicians get a bonus. If it decreases they pay fine.
  - tremon 4y ago
    On what time scale? Government policies have effects that exceed term limits. If you want to reduce government to the same myopic view of CEOs, i.e. politicians that optimize for the next quarter only, this is how you would achieve it.

xbar 4y ago

Why is that at all more likely?

JamesBarney 4y ago
Do you think it's unlikely that people share the same opinions as their family/friends/colleagues? Or do you think it's very likely that most federal politicians are extremely corrupt and not getting caught?

dr_dshiv 4y ago

How much are politicians paid —and how does their salary affect corruption? It might not be a popular opinion, but perhaps we should double the wages of US Representatives (they currently make $175k—not a lot in Washington DC). Is paying US representatives $350k worth the money? First, a bigger financial cushion for representatives might reduce financial corruption. Second, a bigger salary might attract more talented leaders. Potentially, paying higher salaries would increase the quality of US governance. God, imagine if we could just pay for increased quality in government leaders! TIL that in 1789, the US president made $25k—- worth $800k in 2022. But today, the US president makes $400k. Why try to save money on presidents and politicians?

JamesBarney 4y ago
I think we should pay them more. I just think getting better candidates would be much more influential than the reduction in corruption. Most corruption isn't someone dropping off a bag of money. It's an organization donating a bunch of money so they can put somebody intelligent charming and attractive in front of the senator who is going to have a really good argument why certain provisions are good for their constituents.
- undersuit 4y ago
  I think we should pay all of our politicians more. Some state politicians are essentially volunteer positions. How are we supposed to get younger candidates into politics if you need to be not reliant on an external job that may not approve of your political activities?
  - tremon 4y ago
    It's essentially a remnant of aristocracy: you can only have a say in society if you have time to spare.
dylan604 4y ago
No modern politician survives solely on their gov't salary. Typically, politicians have money before starting out. Then, once in, they get all of those juicy "ins" that opens the doors to making more money.
FpUser 4y ago
>"It might not be a popular opinion, but perhaps we should double the wages of US Representatives" How about this: we can have some criteria like state of health, education, buying ability etc and call it well being index. If it increases politicians get a bonus. If it decreases they pay fine.
- tremon 4y ago
  On what time scale? Government policies have effects that exceed term limits. If you want to reduce government to the same myopic view of CEOs, i.e. politicians that optimize for the next quarter only, this is how you would achieve it.