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I tried the app too and experienced exactly the same thing. I’m surprised the app is getting as much positive reception on here as it is. Sure it is cute and “g

I tried the app too and experienced exactly the same thing. I’m surprised the app is getting as much positive reception on here as it is. Sure it is cute and “gamey”, but I don’t particularly think it’s even useful. I’d rather have the knowledge graph displayed to me in a way I can easily find information or navigate it. Why would I EVER want to use this to learn something new when I could just read the information and ingest it. To be fair I feel the same way about duolingo but the knowledge graph is so deep and dense there that i wouldn’t be able to consume information in a couple of sittings. With recipes, I am pretty sure I could “learn” everything I wanted to learn about eggs or tomatoes or bread in just one evening. There’s probably real life experience that would add to that knowledge but that’s not something I would get from this app anyway.

mizzao 4y ago
As the knowledge graph gets bigger, we're definitely going to have to find better ways to present it. The challenge is that most people don't want to see the whole knowledge graph, they want an extremely simple experience. Do you think your perspective represents something that would appeal to the mass market? Here's the technical approach we're taking with the goal of taking a very hairy knowledge graph and turning it into a remarkably simple, even magical, user experience: https://parsnip.substack.com/p/a-new-hope https://parsnip.substack.com/p/a-new-hope
- blindseer 4y ago
  I think the knowledge graph in this case is mostly derived from first principles, e.g. understand roasting, searing, broiling etc and you can apply that to any vegetable or meat. Ideally one would be able to learn language with the same kind of etymological study, however I put it to you that is FAR more complex and boring and doesn't have more fact / science based rules than cooking does. Also, cooking is a very personal / familial / cultural experience. Recipes can be passed down a single family, whereas language is much more broad. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the knowledge graph for cooking is smaller and more personal, and is better served as a personalized note taking system as opposed to a gamified interface to a public database. For example, if I would prefer recipes with eggs and potatoes as opposed to recipes with spinach and mushrooms, I should be able to cater my knowledge graph to learning more about recipes that use those ingredients (ideally with some balance in nutrients).
  - mizzao 4y ago
    I think you're predicting some interesting future technical problems with Parsnip, which is to build a personalized user-specific knowledge graph that is simultaneously overlaid across generalized common knowledge elements. One thing at a time, though! This is just an MVP.
- lief79 4y ago
  People have different learning styles. If you can come up with a gentle introduction, while still allowing deep dives in the specific areas, you'll boost your potential customer/referral base. HN is going to tend to attract more of the individuals who prefer the deep dives. As always, the trick is finding that first customer base, and figuring out how you can grow with them to keep them, and get them to spread the word.
  - mizzao 4y ago
    Bingo! Here's some of that first customer base: https://www.reddit.com/r/cookingforbeginners/comments/vbgqq6/parsnip_duolingo_for_cooking_is_in_the_wild_help/ https://www.reddit.com/r/cookingforbeginners/comments/vbgqq6...
jfindley 4y ago
There's actually a huge amount to learn about cooking with eggs. I don't think this app is going to teach anyone much that's meaningful in its current state, but if you change your mind and want to really learn about the glorious complexity of cooking with eggs I'd recommend the book Ruhlman's Twenty as a great starting point. That book does what this app says it does (but doesn't), and teaches you why things are done the way they are. It also occasionally has a recipe. To the authors of the app, some suggestions. Firstly get rid of the quizzes. You don't need them. Get users to actually cook something, and then follow up with "this is what you should have got", and "if you ended up with X this is what you did wrong". Secondly this app is trying to teach all the wrong things (and getting many of them wrong too!). You should be doing things like teaching people what oil to use for what task, depending on smoke point, taste, nutrition etc rather than having opinions about how many people own a wok. Read the book I mention above - it'll give you a much better template for doing this well.

mizzao 4y ago

As the knowledge graph gets bigger, we're definitely going to have to find better ways to present it. The challenge is that most people don't want to see the whole knowledge graph, they want an extremely simple experience. Do you think your perspective represents something that would appeal to the mass market? Here's the technical approach we're taking with the goal of taking a very hairy knowledge graph and turning it into a remarkably simple, even magical, user experience: https://parsnip.substack.com/p/a-new-hope https://parsnip.substack.com/p/a-new-hope

blindseer 4y ago
I think the knowledge graph in this case is mostly derived from first principles, e.g. understand roasting, searing, broiling etc and you can apply that to any vegetable or meat. Ideally one would be able to learn language with the same kind of etymological study, however I put it to you that is FAR more complex and boring and doesn't have more fact / science based rules than cooking does. Also, cooking is a very personal / familial / cultural experience. Recipes can be passed down a single family, whereas language is much more broad. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the knowledge graph for cooking is smaller and more personal, and is better served as a personalized note taking system as opposed to a gamified interface to a public database. For example, if I would prefer recipes with eggs and potatoes as opposed to recipes with spinach and mushrooms, I should be able to cater my knowledge graph to learning more about recipes that use those ingredients (ideally with some balance in nutrients).
- mizzao 4y ago
  I think you're predicting some interesting future technical problems with Parsnip, which is to build a personalized user-specific knowledge graph that is simultaneously overlaid across generalized common knowledge elements. One thing at a time, though! This is just an MVP.
lief79 4y ago
People have different learning styles. If you can come up with a gentle introduction, while still allowing deep dives in the specific areas, you'll boost your potential customer/referral base. HN is going to tend to attract more of the individuals who prefer the deep dives. As always, the trick is finding that first customer base, and figuring out how you can grow with them to keep them, and get them to spread the word.
- mizzao 4y ago
  Bingo! Here's some of that first customer base: https://www.reddit.com/r/cookingforbeginners/comments/vbgqq6/parsnip_duolingo_for_cooking_is_in_the_wild_help/ https://www.reddit.com/r/cookingforbeginners/comments/vbgqq6...

jfindley 4y ago

There's actually a huge amount to learn about cooking with eggs. I don't think this app is going to teach anyone much that's meaningful in its current state, but if you change your mind and want to really learn about the glorious complexity of cooking with eggs I'd recommend the book Ruhlman's Twenty as a great starting point. That book does what this app says it does (but doesn't), and teaches you why things are done the way they are. It also occasionally has a recipe. To the authors of the app, some suggestions. Firstly get rid of the quizzes. You don't need them. Get users to actually cook something, and then follow up with "this is what you should have got", and "if you ended up with X this is what you did wrong". Secondly this app is trying to teach all the wrong things (and getting many of them wrong too!). You should be doing things like teaching people what oil to use for what task, depending on smoke point, taste, nutrition etc rather than having opinions about how many people own a wok. Read the book I mention above - it'll give you a much better template for doing this well.