5 ms·

You have to be in awe of the level of deception necessary to generate $115M in revenue on a site with 84% male users, and only 1% of female users at all active.

You have to be in awe of the level of deception necessary to generate $115M in revenue on a site with 84% male users, and only 1% of female users at all active. This gives crypto a run for its money. I guess it's easier to justify to oneself scamming people acting immorally. Or there's no recourse for people who get milked by the company. Who is going to contest charges linked to cheating?

JetAlone 4y ago
Do you know what percentage of the male user base was active?
- 8f2ab37a-ed6c 4y ago
  I don't believe the article mentions it, but apparently plenty enough to generate that kind of top line.
  - JetAlone 4y ago
    That's believable. It's not like most people would be terribly motivated creating an artificially inflated supply of millions of fake dicks online... ...The only group I could imagine being motivated to do it would be a spouse's union, paying a water army to DDOS "watering holes" for affairs with honeypots, which report anyone caught attempting to cheat to a collective database for identification and confrontation. But I think this would be a waste of resources in today's world - the high profile breach was probably enough to prevent anything as big as Ashley Madison from rising to prominence for a long time yet. And those motivated enough to have an affair would adjust to seek another path. It could definitely have a negative further overall effect on marital trust.
    - throwaway0a5e 4y ago
      People just use normal dating sites these days.
  - aj7 4y ago
    One-timers who got scammed. I mean there were basing women at all. (They don’t say how many of the “1%” were scam accounts or sex workers.)
throwawaylinux 4y ago
As the great poet Ice-T once postulated, pimpin' ain't easy.
- mistermann 4y ago
  According to this it was Big Daddy Kane? https://m.facebook.com/ComedyCentral/videos/i-know-black-people-chappelles-show/2041316669499868/ https://m.facebook.com/ComedyCentral/videos/i-know-black-peo...
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
sofixa 4y ago
Did Ashley Madison allow for gay (man with man) matching? If so, the 84% and the revenue don't sound so out of proportion.
- Sharlin 4y ago
  Gay/bi men are almost certainly underrepresented on primarily-hetero dating sites, or at the very least are not overrepresented. I'm pretty sure the vast majority of the 84% were heterosexual.
  - RajT88 4y ago
    One of many analyses of the data dump: https://blog.binaryedge.io/2015/08/31/ashley-madison-a-conclusive-analysis/ https://blog.binaryedge.io/2015/08/31/ashley-madison-a-concl...
Spooky23 4y ago
It’s a site based on deception from the get go. I don’t know much about the site or owners, but I wouldn’t assume that it wasn’t another sort of business including a pure scam.
compsciphd 4y ago
I have a gut feeling that there are many fake accounts on other dating sites as well. One thing I've noticed with tinder in Israel. you will see profiles of presumambly "jewish" women (i.e. jewish names / hebrew writing) where it says their university is al quds university or al aqsa university. While its conceptually possible that a jewish woman might have attended them, I find it somewhat implausible (especially in number and combined with the style of pictures). Its as if someone just created profiles randomly that might fit the general geographic area. The primary Q I would have is if this is generated by Tinder itself or by external scammers who don't know better.
- eru 4y ago
  > The primary Q I would have is if this is generated by Tinder itself or by external scammers who don't know better. I would strongly suspect the latter. The former could get them sued for securities fraud in the US (because everything is securities fraud in the US). It's much easier to justify a slip up in your spam / scam prevention than to justify actively scamming your users yourself. The former keeps your hands clean in front of a judge.
  - paulryanrogers 4y ago
    Interesting strategy and certainly [legally] safer than Match paying women to string lonely men along.
    - eru 4y ago
      I saw some of this strategy myself (in much more benign form): In any job, when we are doing any monitoring of any process (technical or business process), and the numbers look bad we investigate until we either find and fix the root cause which might be a genuine problem or a problem with the monitoring. If the numbers look dandy and the system ain't obviously on fire, we don't spend sleepless nights looking for the possibility that we are having both an underlying problem and a problem with the measurement at the same time. You can see that given these incentives, and enough random variations, the system can drift over time, without anyone acting in bad faith or fraudulently.
bumby 4y ago
The idea that people would be too shamed to sue was also part of the scheme for other grifts, but it didn’t always work: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/wbna6973990 https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/wbna6973990

JetAlone 4y ago

Do you know what percentage of the male user base was active?

8f2ab37a-ed6c 4y ago
I don't believe the article mentions it, but apparently plenty enough to generate that kind of top line.
- JetAlone 4y ago
  That's believable. It's not like most people would be terribly motivated creating an artificially inflated supply of millions of fake dicks online... ...The only group I could imagine being motivated to do it would be a spouse's union, paying a water army to DDOS "watering holes" for affairs with honeypots, which report anyone caught attempting to cheat to a collective database for identification and confrontation. But I think this would be a waste of resources in today's world - the high profile breach was probably enough to prevent anything as big as Ashley Madison from rising to prominence for a long time yet. And those motivated enough to have an affair would adjust to seek another path. It could definitely have a negative further overall effect on marital trust.
  - throwaway0a5e 4y ago
    People just use normal dating sites these days.
- aj7 4y ago
  One-timers who got scammed. I mean there were basing women at all. (They don’t say how many of the “1%” were scam accounts or sex workers.)

throwawaylinux 4y ago

As the great poet Ice-T once postulated, pimpin' ain't easy.

mistermann 4y ago
According to this it was Big Daddy Kane? https://m.facebook.com/ComedyCentral/videos/i-know-black-people-chappelles-show/2041316669499868/ https://m.facebook.com/ComedyCentral/videos/i-know-black-peo...
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

sofixa 4y ago

Did Ashley Madison allow for gay (man with man) matching? If so, the 84% and the revenue don't sound so out of proportion.

Sharlin 4y ago
Gay/bi men are almost certainly underrepresented on primarily-hetero dating sites, or at the very least are not overrepresented. I'm pretty sure the vast majority of the 84% were heterosexual.
- RajT88 4y ago
  One of many analyses of the data dump: https://blog.binaryedge.io/2015/08/31/ashley-madison-a-conclusive-analysis/ https://blog.binaryedge.io/2015/08/31/ashley-madison-a-concl...

Spooky23 4y ago

It’s a site based on deception from the get go. I don’t know much about the site or owners, but I wouldn’t assume that it wasn’t another sort of business including a pure scam.

compsciphd 4y ago

I have a gut feeling that there are many fake accounts on other dating sites as well. One thing I've noticed with tinder in Israel. you will see profiles of presumambly "jewish" women (i.e. jewish names / hebrew writing) where it says their university is al quds university or al aqsa university. While its conceptually possible that a jewish woman might have attended them, I find it somewhat implausible (especially in number and combined with the style of pictures). Its as if someone just created profiles randomly that might fit the general geographic area. The primary Q I would have is if this is generated by Tinder itself or by external scammers who don't know better.

eru 4y ago
> The primary Q I would have is if this is generated by Tinder itself or by external scammers who don't know better. I would strongly suspect the latter. The former could get them sued for securities fraud in the US (because everything is securities fraud in the US). It's much easier to justify a slip up in your spam / scam prevention than to justify actively scamming your users yourself. The former keeps your hands clean in front of a judge.
- paulryanrogers 4y ago
  Interesting strategy and certainly [legally] safer than Match paying women to string lonely men along.
  - eru 4y ago
    I saw some of this strategy myself (in much more benign form): In any job, when we are doing any monitoring of any process (technical or business process), and the numbers look bad we investigate until we either find and fix the root cause which might be a genuine problem or a problem with the monitoring. If the numbers look dandy and the system ain't obviously on fire, we don't spend sleepless nights looking for the possibility that we are having both an underlying problem and a problem with the measurement at the same time. You can see that given these incentives, and enough random variations, the system can drift over time, without anyone acting in bad faith or fraudulently.

bumby 4y ago

The idea that people would be too shamed to sue was also part of the scheme for other grifts, but it didn’t always work: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/wbna6973990 https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/wbna6973990