11 ms·

Mark Zuckerberg braces Meta employees for ‘intense period’

79 points by lladnar 4y ago

anigbrowl 4y ago
'Some of you may die, but it's a sacrifice I'm willing to make.'
chitowneats 4y ago
If you work for Meta in 2022 you are chasing the valuation. If it can go up that means it can also come down. I sincerely hope no one is breaking out the stradivarius for 300k+ per year SWEs participating in one of the most cynical endeavors I've ever seen.
- mathgladiator 4y ago
  I used to work there, and I didn't understand the pivot.
- mhoad 4y ago
  I feel like working at Meta in 2022 is such a professional and personal stain that is going to follow people around for a long time.
  - bennyelv 4y ago
    This is a point of view that I don't really understand (I don't work there). They have a high bar for hiring, they have interesting technology problems, engineers who work there are probably high quality. The fact that the company as a whole is in a challenging position doesn't change that. Why is that signal a stain?
    - 3np 4y ago
      Ethics. In a similar way to how I assume many (including me) would react to being an ex-senior at Terraform Labs. Having had an internship or a year or so in the past is one thing, well all come from somewhere, a recent multi-year tenure from a senior position is something else.
      - deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
      - 3np 4y ago
        BTW, just to add: If it came up during an interview, we might talk about it and what matters most might be what comes out of that question. It's not necessarily bad.
    - BoxOfRain 4y ago
      I think a lot of people look down on Meta in the same way they look down on Big Tobacco and (increasingly in the face of climate change) fossil fuel manufacturers. It's not that the individuals aren't very talented and the businesses very successful, it's that there's a lot of practices associated with those companies which are seen as unethical by the public at large.
      - captainbland 4y ago
        Realistically, working for a lot of the types of companies you mention seems to work out quite well for a lot of people. That "a lot of people" who look down on them are generally not the ones handing out jobs and such. It might matter more if the person in question is thinking of making a career change into politics or something.
      - ryandrake 4y ago
        That’s exactly how I explained to my elderly parents why I would never work for Facebook in its current form: “If I worked for Philip Morris or a loan shark for a living, would you be proud of me? Would you be excited to tell your friends?” That kind of flipped the switch for them.
pipeline_peak 4y ago
This man is seriously banking on Unreal Second Life to turn around the Exxon Valdez. I can’t tell if he’s lost the plot or this is just another layer to hide Facebooks dependence on user data. Considering the loss Meta took after the iOS privacy update, he realizes user data is no longer viable so he’s just cutting as much possible to keep things afloat.
- gsatic 4y ago
  Look at Google's results. They are just leaves in the wind. They dont make the wind anymore.
- holografix 4y ago
  No he realises he needs to control the distribution medium. Apple and Google can’t be allowed to dictate what Facebook does in their platforms. MZ needs to create an attractive platform of his own. For a brief moment he had one, Facebook was a platform, they managed to even get a killer app: FarmVille. Then the iPhone came around and ate their lunch. No one cared about developing for Facebook anymore, only iOS and Android. He will bet the company on a VR device that rivals the smartphone category. He has to.
  - wly_cdgr 4y ago
    ^^^ this. AR/VR is do or die for FB.
    - sprkwd 4y ago
      How long before they buy Unity?
      - astlouis44 4y ago
        They already considered it in the past, in fact Mark penned an email explaining why and how it would be beneficial to their broader ambitions to own more of the stack as a hedge for the future of computing. You can read more about it here: https://sriramk.com/memos/zuck-unity.pdf https://sriramk.com/memos/zuck-unity.pdf https://techcrunch.com/2019/02/13/facebook-mulled-multi-billion-dollar-acquisition-of-unity-book-claims/ https://techcrunch.com/2019/02/13/facebook-mulled-multi-bill... It will likely happen at some point, if not by Meta than it'll be another tech giant like Amazon, Google, Microsoft, or even Apple.
aahortwwy 4y ago
> Comments on Workplace, the company’s internal version of Facebook for employees, came flying in. “This is war-time, we need a war-time CEO,” one wrote. “Beast mode activated,” a second employee posted. > Others couldn’t believe what they’d just heard. “Did Mark just say there are a bunch of people at this company that don’t belong here[?]” a staffer asked. Another responded: “Who hired them?” Two sorts of responses, emotionally opposed, but both coming from people V. Rao might categorize as "clueless" in The Gervais Principle.
jsemrau 4y ago
Have never worked for them, but I am wondering how much Sheryl Sandberg has kept this place sane.
- holografix 4y ago
  Sheryl “lean in the good times but then lean the fuck out” Sandberg?
SilverBirch 4y ago
>Maher Saba, told managers that they needed to identify people on their team who “need support” by 5PM the following Monday and “exit people who are unable to get on track.” If your management team don't already know who needs help, and aren't already exiting people who are unable to get on track, then it's the management team who are the people who don't belong at the company. This always happens, senior leadership make dumb fucking decisions - like close to doubling the size of an already enormous company, or completely abandoning their cash cow core business. Then the shit hits the fan and suddenly Joe in engineering is a lousy slacker who shouldn't be here. >Zuckerberg has the unusual ability to weather tough periods that might sink other CEOs. Yeah, this unique talent is called "owning the majority of the voting shares". I'm quite certain at this point the market has priced in the non-zero possibility that Zuck will shovel all the money from the profitable parts of his business into a VR bonfire and that significantly affects the shares.
- barrenko 4y ago
  Yeah well, the pesky thing about management is that it's secondary function is to entrench itself.
  - nine_zeros 4y ago
    > Yeah well, the pesky thing about management is that it's secondary function is to entrench itself. I thought entrenchment is the primary function. A secondary is to feign care for reports.
jhoelzel 4y ago
I have a feeling that the metaverse is going to be completely unusable through over-engeneering. What kind of made second life great in the beginning was its roughness and that you could really discover stuff because everybody could basically do whatever they wanted. I have a lingering feeling that this is not going to be so simple this time around. That said, as long as I dont get a "holodeck" like in Star-Trek I don't think that I'll put on a headset for this.... If im honest with you I dont even want to put on a headset to have an immersive experience with current gen video games, so why would I do this....... to hang out?! Lastly the way people talk about the metaverse, I am pretty sure that every experience I can possibly have will be monetized to the max. So please wake me once there are pirated servers of the metaverse, leaving me to actually being able to experience a limitless world, not one where the limit is my credit card limit.
- kumarvvr 4y ago
  I would realllllly like to know what tge heck the "metaverse" actually is? I think Mark just put out some buzzwords to buy time.
  - valdiorn 4y ago
    Like Web 3.0, it is whatever you want it to be.
  - brushfoot 4y ago
    There's a lot of playing fast and loose with the definition right now, but the lowest common denominator is basically online virtual worlds with more Web3 and XR. Think Roblox + VR + blockchain. The consulting companies (Gartner, McKinsey) will tell you that something like Roblox is metaverse already but that Web3 and VR are integral to what it's becoming. I.e., it's tech that's already here, just in its infancy and not working in concert yet. The envisioned ideal combines it into an interoperable ecosystem where you're making global payments and moving virtual posessions from one platform to another. Games are often the example, but imagine 3D multiplayer environments for collaboratively architecting buildings, public transportation systems, computer chips, or software. You use voice and gestures to speak components into existence and shape flows. Other engineers are in the environment with you in real time. Tools are created to assist you, and you can transport them from one platform to another while retaining ownership. That's sort of the promise and what people are excited about. Where we are now is like looking at a clunky applet from the early days of the web and going, "This is Web 2.0. Someday all our apps will run in the browser." It maybe was Web 2.0 in an aspirational sense, but it hadn't really been realized yet. Same with the metaverse.
curiousgal 4y ago
I don't know why he seems to forget that part of why Facebook took off is its mass adoption in Third World populations (part of which immigrate and end up being monetizable) through initiatives like Facebook Zero. The barrier to entry to VR is a whopping month's salary for most people per headset, not to mention the bandwidth requirement. It's not gonna be as world changing as he thinks it is.
desindol 4y ago
It really looks like Facebook was build on luck and not merit.
unit_circle 4y ago
I could see it being wonderful to talk with someone face-to-face who lives far away, and I know this is a site for hackers, but what is so appealing about a "metaverse" vs a phone or video call? It sounds very unpleasant to me to be so connected. I struggle to control my consumption of content (user-generated or otherwise) and having a company that is fundamentally a UGC aggregator more deeply embedded in my life sounds awful. It also sounds like it would make me less active... One of the things in my life that brings me the most fulfillment and joy. The company is incentivized to keep your brain glued to their systems (and diverted from the real world) for as long as possible to increase earnings. I already feel that I am some animal product being held ever more tightly in my digital stall by my own human weaknesses. I don't doubt that the tech will survive in some form. It will be cool and useful someday. I'm glad that Meta is martyring itself to push things forward. But delivered by Meta, it sounds to me like an extension of the dystopian nightmare of algorithmically delivered UGC that's fraying the fabric of society in uncomfortable new ways and lowering our collective aptitude for the things that really matter. Or, asked more simply: Will I actually use the internet for what it's good for, or just keep browsing Hacker News?
- v-erne 4y ago
  >> Will I actually use the internet for what it's good for, or just keep browsing Hacker News? I find HN to be one of the best aspect of the internet. And I really do not know what actually internet is for - care to explain?
- atraac 4y ago
  > having a company that is fundamentally a UGC aggregator more deeply embedded in my life sounds awful I feel like it's not supposed to be aimed at people like you, me, or anyone else here for that matter. I feel like it's aimed towards younger and future generations that will grow up with VR ecosystems like that and get used to them, find uses for them that make it fun. Remember that most people don't care what company is behind a product, people still buy Nestle products after all they did. People don't care. Kids these days grow up with all those new apps, environments, they practically live in the internet, I can see how this would be appealing to them, having your own 'place' in some virtual world that you can do anything with, especially since reality is much more demanding, depressing and will probably become even worse with all the issues in front of us. Is it going to be owned by corporation X? Sure, 100%. Will people care if it allows them to disconnect from reality? I don't think so.
Originami 4y ago
Facebook is for old people.
- MrMan 4y ago
  ok boomer
lapcat 4y ago
"the company embarked on a massive hiring spree, growing its number of full-time employees by 62 percent, from 48,000 at the end of 2019 to more than 77,800" That pretty much says it all.
mFixman 4y ago
> Things got even worse a few days later when word spread across Workplace that the company wasn’t planning to hire any of its current interns at the end of their program. This is such a bad move that I'm going to assume that the source is The Verge misinterpreting a post on Blind. Big Tech internships are the best way to find raw talent to later train in the company. The internships themselves are mostly a net negative — I'm sure the 3 months of manager support I needed to launch a simple feature could have been used more productively — but being able to identify promising candidates with growth potential in a 3-month work interview is crucial for the growth in the company. Wasting all that internship time and later not giving offers to young interns who used their potential vacations to work hard in a career-defining moment is just an awful policy.
- JonChesterfield 4y ago
  Well, unless they were awful. Would definitely be possible to run an interview system for interns that solely passed ones you don't want to hire later.
flappyeagle 4y ago
Someone will succeed at XR (probably Apple). FB has enjoyed crazy monopoly software margins for so long, this culture shift will be next to impossible to pull off. Zuck is right in that there are huge numbers of employees there for who are unsuited for the ambiguous and tough slog of finding a new market. I would guess this number is greater than 80% of their workers.
- papito 4y ago
  Not to mention those software engineers picked up the worst habits. They would be a total drag on a small company, creating overcomplicated, unmaintainable systems, instead of solving the problem at hand. "What do you mean you don't have 50 microservices!? How is this even going to WORK?"
oneoff786 4y ago
The entire pitch of meta and frankly most big tech hardware companies is a monopolistic control over software distribution. This won’t work with the Digital Markets Act in Europe. It just makes it a losing proposition. I yearn for the day when Facebook releases a high end VR system only to see all of its consumer base switch over to a third party platform. That would be super funny.
yrgulation 4y ago
> Zuckerberg appeared visibly frustrated. “Um… all right,” he stammered. My comment history will prove that i am the first to shit on corporate twats. Also i am not much of a sucker for “fun” 12 hours days. But he’s got a point there. Company's switching to war mode. If all you care about is time off and perks then move on. Personally i like to demand and get paid but i also like to offer sweat when time comes. I mean you know money dont grow on trees and it goes both ways.
dsq 4y ago
Physical travel will probably be limited in future due to peak oil, climate change, and pandemic related policies (whether all true or not is left as an exercise for the reader). The next best thing to vacationing in Greece is metaversing in a virtual, uncrowded Greece with all dirt, viruses and greedy cab drivers scrubbed out. Better than staring at four walls during lockdown or no driving days.

79 points by lladnar 4y ago

'Some of you may die, but it's a sacrifice I'm willing to make.'

If you work for Meta in 2022 you are chasing the valuation. If it can go up that means it can also come down. I sincerely hope no one is breaking out the stradivarius for 300k+ per year SWEs participating in one of the most cynical endeavors I've ever seen.

mathgladiator 4y ago
I used to work there, and I didn't understand the pivot.
mhoad 4y ago
I feel like working at Meta in 2022 is such a professional and personal stain that is going to follow people around for a long time.
- bennyelv 4y ago
  This is a point of view that I don't really understand (I don't work there). They have a high bar for hiring, they have interesting technology problems, engineers who work there are probably high quality. The fact that the company as a whole is in a challenging position doesn't change that. Why is that signal a stain?
  - 3np 4y ago
    Ethics. In a similar way to how I assume many (including me) would react to being an ex-senior at Terraform Labs. Having had an internship or a year or so in the past is one thing, well all come from somewhere, a recent multi-year tenure from a senior position is something else.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - 3np 4y ago
      BTW, just to add: If it came up during an interview, we might talk about it and what matters most might be what comes out of that question. It's not necessarily bad.
  - BoxOfRain 4y ago
    I think a lot of people look down on Meta in the same way they look down on Big Tobacco and (increasingly in the face of climate change) fossil fuel manufacturers. It's not that the individuals aren't very talented and the businesses very successful, it's that there's a lot of practices associated with those companies which are seen as unethical by the public at large.
    - captainbland 4y ago
      Realistically, working for a lot of the types of companies you mention seems to work out quite well for a lot of people. That "a lot of people" who look down on them are generally not the ones handing out jobs and such. It might matter more if the person in question is thinking of making a career change into politics or something.
    - ryandrake 4y ago
      That’s exactly how I explained to my elderly parents why I would never work for Facebook in its current form: “If I worked for Philip Morris or a loan shark for a living, would you be proud of me? Would you be excited to tell your friends?” That kind of flipped the switch for them.

pipeline_peak 4y ago

This man is seriously banking on Unreal Second Life to turn around the Exxon Valdez. I can’t tell if he’s lost the plot or this is just another layer to hide Facebooks dependence on user data. Considering the loss Meta took after the iOS privacy update, he realizes user data is no longer viable so he’s just cutting as much possible to keep things afloat.

gsatic 4y ago
Look at Google's results. They are just leaves in the wind. They dont make the wind anymore.
holografix 4y ago
No he realises he needs to control the distribution medium. Apple and Google can’t be allowed to dictate what Facebook does in their platforms. MZ needs to create an attractive platform of his own. For a brief moment he had one, Facebook was a platform, they managed to even get a killer app: FarmVille. Then the iPhone came around and ate their lunch. No one cared about developing for Facebook anymore, only iOS and Android. He will bet the company on a VR device that rivals the smartphone category. He has to.
- wly_cdgr 4y ago
  ^^^ this. AR/VR is do or die for FB.
  - sprkwd 4y ago
    How long before they buy Unity?
    - astlouis44 4y ago
      They already considered it in the past, in fact Mark penned an email explaining why and how it would be beneficial to their broader ambitions to own more of the stack as a hedge for the future of computing. You can read more about it here: https://sriramk.com/memos/zuck-unity.pdf https://sriramk.com/memos/zuck-unity.pdf https://techcrunch.com/2019/02/13/facebook-mulled-multi-billion-dollar-acquisition-of-unity-book-claims/ https://techcrunch.com/2019/02/13/facebook-mulled-multi-bill... It will likely happen at some point, if not by Meta than it'll be another tech giant like Amazon, Google, Microsoft, or even Apple.

aahortwwy 4y ago

> Comments on Workplace, the company’s internal version of Facebook for employees, came flying in. “This is war-time, we need a war-time CEO,” one wrote. “Beast mode activated,” a second employee posted. > Others couldn’t believe what they’d just heard. “Did Mark just say there are a bunch of people at this company that don’t belong here[?]” a staffer asked. Another responded: “Who hired them?” Two sorts of responses, emotionally opposed, but both coming from people V. Rao might categorize as "clueless" in The Gervais Principle.

jsemrau 4y ago

Have never worked for them, but I am wondering how much Sheryl Sandberg has kept this place sane.

holografix 4y ago
Sheryl “lean in the good times but then lean the fuck out” Sandberg?

SilverBirch 4y ago

>Maher Saba, told managers that they needed to identify people on their team who “need support” by 5PM the following Monday and “exit people who are unable to get on track.” If your management team don't already know who needs help, and aren't already exiting people who are unable to get on track, then it's the management team who are the people who don't belong at the company. This always happens, senior leadership make dumb fucking decisions - like close to doubling the size of an already enormous company, or completely abandoning their cash cow core business. Then the shit hits the fan and suddenly Joe in engineering is a lousy slacker who shouldn't be here. >Zuckerberg has the unusual ability to weather tough periods that might sink other CEOs. Yeah, this unique talent is called "owning the majority of the voting shares". I'm quite certain at this point the market has priced in the non-zero possibility that Zuck will shovel all the money from the profitable parts of his business into a VR bonfire and that significantly affects the shares.

barrenko 4y ago
Yeah well, the pesky thing about management is that it's secondary function is to entrench itself.
- nine_zeros 4y ago
  > Yeah well, the pesky thing about management is that it's secondary function is to entrench itself. I thought entrenchment is the primary function. A secondary is to feign care for reports.

jhoelzel 4y ago

I have a feeling that the metaverse is going to be completely unusable through over-engeneering. What kind of made second life great in the beginning was its roughness and that you could really discover stuff because everybody could basically do whatever they wanted. I have a lingering feeling that this is not going to be so simple this time around. That said, as long as I dont get a "holodeck" like in Star-Trek I don't think that I'll put on a headset for this.... If im honest with you I dont even want to put on a headset to have an immersive experience with current gen video games, so why would I do this....... to hang out?! Lastly the way people talk about the metaverse, I am pretty sure that every experience I can possibly have will be monetized to the max. So please wake me once there are pirated servers of the metaverse, leaving me to actually being able to experience a limitless world, not one where the limit is my credit card limit.

kumarvvr 4y ago
I would realllllly like to know what tge heck the "metaverse" actually is? I think Mark just put out some buzzwords to buy time.
- valdiorn 4y ago
  Like Web 3.0, it is whatever you want it to be.
- brushfoot 4y ago
  There's a lot of playing fast and loose with the definition right now, but the lowest common denominator is basically online virtual worlds with more Web3 and XR. Think Roblox + VR + blockchain. The consulting companies (Gartner, McKinsey) will tell you that something like Roblox is metaverse already but that Web3 and VR are integral to what it's becoming. I.e., it's tech that's already here, just in its infancy and not working in concert yet. The envisioned ideal combines it into an interoperable ecosystem where you're making global payments and moving virtual posessions from one platform to another. Games are often the example, but imagine 3D multiplayer environments for collaboratively architecting buildings, public transportation systems, computer chips, or software. You use voice and gestures to speak components into existence and shape flows. Other engineers are in the environment with you in real time. Tools are created to assist you, and you can transport them from one platform to another while retaining ownership. That's sort of the promise and what people are excited about. Where we are now is like looking at a clunky applet from the early days of the web and going, "This is Web 2.0. Someday all our apps will run in the browser." It maybe was Web 2.0 in an aspirational sense, but it hadn't really been realized yet. Same with the metaverse.

curiousgal 4y ago

I don't know why he seems to forget that part of why Facebook took off is its mass adoption in Third World populations (part of which immigrate and end up being monetizable) through initiatives like Facebook Zero. The barrier to entry to VR is a whopping month's salary for most people per headset, not to mention the bandwidth requirement. It's not gonna be as world changing as he thinks it is.

desindol 4y ago

It really looks like Facebook was build on luck and not merit.

unit_circle 4y ago

I could see it being wonderful to talk with someone face-to-face who lives far away, and I know this is a site for hackers, but what is so appealing about a "metaverse" vs a phone or video call? It sounds very unpleasant to me to be so connected. I struggle to control my consumption of content (user-generated or otherwise) and having a company that is fundamentally a UGC aggregator more deeply embedded in my life sounds awful. It also sounds like it would make me less active... One of the things in my life that brings me the most fulfillment and joy. The company is incentivized to keep your brain glued to their systems (and diverted from the real world) for as long as possible to increase earnings. I already feel that I am some animal product being held ever more tightly in my digital stall by my own human weaknesses. I don't doubt that the tech will survive in some form. It will be cool and useful someday. I'm glad that Meta is martyring itself to push things forward. But delivered by Meta, it sounds to me like an extension of the dystopian nightmare of algorithmically delivered UGC that's fraying the fabric of society in uncomfortable new ways and lowering our collective aptitude for the things that really matter. Or, asked more simply: Will I actually use the internet for what it's good for, or just keep browsing Hacker News?

v-erne 4y ago
>> Will I actually use the internet for what it's good for, or just keep browsing Hacker News? I find HN to be one of the best aspect of the internet. And I really do not know what actually internet is for - care to explain?
atraac 4y ago
> having a company that is fundamentally a UGC aggregator more deeply embedded in my life sounds awful I feel like it's not supposed to be aimed at people like you, me, or anyone else here for that matter. I feel like it's aimed towards younger and future generations that will grow up with VR ecosystems like that and get used to them, find uses for them that make it fun. Remember that most people don't care what company is behind a product, people still buy Nestle products after all they did. People don't care. Kids these days grow up with all those new apps, environments, they practically live in the internet, I can see how this would be appealing to them, having your own 'place' in some virtual world that you can do anything with, especially since reality is much more demanding, depressing and will probably become even worse with all the issues in front of us. Is it going to be owned by corporation X? Sure, 100%. Will people care if it allows them to disconnect from reality? I don't think so.

Originami 4y ago

Facebook is for old people.

MrMan 4y ago
ok boomer

lapcat 4y ago

"the company embarked on a massive hiring spree, growing its number of full-time employees by 62 percent, from 48,000 at the end of 2019 to more than 77,800" That pretty much says it all.

mFixman 4y ago

> Things got even worse a few days later when word spread across Workplace that the company wasn’t planning to hire any of its current interns at the end of their program. This is such a bad move that I'm going to assume that the source is The Verge misinterpreting a post on Blind. Big Tech internships are the best way to find raw talent to later train in the company. The internships themselves are mostly a net negative — I'm sure the 3 months of manager support I needed to launch a simple feature could have been used more productively — but being able to identify promising candidates with growth potential in a 3-month work interview is crucial for the growth in the company. Wasting all that internship time and later not giving offers to young interns who used their potential vacations to work hard in a career-defining moment is just an awful policy.

JonChesterfield 4y ago
Well, unless they were awful. Would definitely be possible to run an interview system for interns that solely passed ones you don't want to hire later.

flappyeagle 4y ago

Someone will succeed at XR (probably Apple). FB has enjoyed crazy monopoly software margins for so long, this culture shift will be next to impossible to pull off. Zuck is right in that there are huge numbers of employees there for who are unsuited for the ambiguous and tough slog of finding a new market. I would guess this number is greater than 80% of their workers.

papito 4y ago
Not to mention those software engineers picked up the worst habits. They would be a total drag on a small company, creating overcomplicated, unmaintainable systems, instead of solving the problem at hand. "What do you mean you don't have 50 microservices!? How is this even going to WORK?"

oneoff786 4y ago

The entire pitch of meta and frankly most big tech hardware companies is a monopolistic control over software distribution. This won’t work with the Digital Markets Act in Europe. It just makes it a losing proposition. I yearn for the day when Facebook releases a high end VR system only to see all of its consumer base switch over to a third party platform. That would be super funny.

yrgulation 4y ago

> Zuckerberg appeared visibly frustrated. “Um… all right,” he stammered. My comment history will prove that i am the first to shit on corporate twats. Also i am not much of a sucker for “fun” 12 hours days. But he’s got a point there. Company's switching to war mode. If all you care about is time off and perks then move on. Personally i like to demand and get paid but i also like to offer sweat when time comes. I mean you know money dont grow on trees and it goes both ways.

dsq 4y ago

Physical travel will probably be limited in future due to peak oil, climate change, and pandemic related policies (whether all true or not is left as an exercise for the reader). The next best thing to vacationing in Greece is metaversing in a virtual, uncrowded Greece with all dirt, viruses and greedy cab drivers scrubbed out. Better than staring at four walls during lockdown or no driving days.