4 ms·

Are libraries profitable? I wish these could exist and didn’t need to turn a profit. These seems like spaces with significant public benefit, and I’d love to s

Are libraries profitable? I wish these could exist and didn’t need to turn a profit. These seems like spaces with significant public benefit, and I’d love to see public funding for these kinds of spaces (maybe even folding into the mission of public libraries)?

mdavis6890 4y ago
Can you imagine a service whereby the government provides table saw for use by the general public? I just do not think the government is equipped to manage this kind of risk.
- qbasic_forever 4y ago
  Plenty of community colleges are run from state funding and have all kinds of adult education shop classes. You can learn to weld, do carpentry, etc.
  - PaulDavisThe1st 4y ago
    Providing an education is utterly different from providing access to the tools to use more or less anytime you need them. Both are valuable, but they are quite distinct.
  - monkmartinez 4y ago
    > "Plenty of community colleges are run from state funding and have all kinds of adult education shop classes. You can learn to weld, do carpentry, etc." Once you are done learning the basics which takes about a week, you still have to participate in class and do "class" projects. These classes are not convenient to begin with and access to the shop ends when the class is over. You could buy a small contractors table saw or cheap flux core welder for the price of one class in my area. Not worth the price of admission imo.
- CamelCaseName 4y ago
  This kind of comes close, with sewing machines, a heat press, and a fabric cutter. https://www.torontopubliclibrary.ca/using-the-library/computer-services/innovation-spaces/fabrication-studio.jsp https://www.torontopubliclibrary.ca/using-the-library/comput...
- AdamJacobMuller 4y ago
  On the other hand, due to sovereign immunity, the government is uniquely positioned to completely ignore the (legal) risk associated with this kind of scheme. I don't think our government (at basically any level) is capable of actually doing something this useful anymore though.
  - redtexture 4y ago
    Speaking at a local level of a library board, school board, planning board, and working with a conservation commission, or a health commision, or municipal council on aging or even public works and roads department... ...funding and implementing operations of a municipal school system, making a community space for learning and meeting (libraries), and other outcomes that go with education, or revising zoning, reviewing proposals for building and housing development, protecting wetlands and land (conservation commission), or guiding proper installation of septic systems, placemment of wells, inspection of food production, or for elders providing community resources from meals on wheels, to social workers, and another kind of community space and service (council on aging), or maintaining roads and streets (and in winter causing them to be plowed for snow)... ...your views on capability and actual work of government are nihilist compared to what they actually do accomplish towards making municipalities personally growthful (educationally), safe, and acceptable even vibrant locales to live in.
- ncallaway 4y ago
  Yes, it seems pretty straightforward, and would work the same way it works with a maker space. We trust the general public to operate a table saw unsupervised, so I think it would be completely imaginable for the government to offer a supervised space and equipment (and safety training). It’s absolutely not hard for me to imagine that at all.
- zetazzed 4y ago
  In Berkeley, the public library will lend you a table saw, circular saw, power drill etc. The inventory is right there in the online catalog: https://catalog.berkeleypubliclibrary.org/?section=home https://catalog.berkeleypubliclibrary.org/?section=home Maker-oriented kids can also go to the city-run Adventure Playground (https://berkeleyca.gov/community-recreation/parks-recreation/facilities/adventure-playground https://berkeleyca.gov/community-recreation/parks-recreation...) and hammer or saw away to build their own play structures (though they just have hand tools, no power tools that I've seen).
  - djbusby 4y ago
    Wow! Adventure Playground is still around! I went there in the 80s! <3
- culi 4y ago
  Library of Things are becoming more and more common. The library in Orange County recently started one. Though I doubt they have table saws (yet)
- spaetzleesser 4y ago
  I am sure there are ways to deal with this. Home Depot sells table saws to the general public and somehow manages the risk. I don’t see why a library couldn’t provide table saws.
quijoteuniv 4y ago
In Norway libraries lend tools, 3d printers and even cargo e-bikes…
- reaperducer 4y ago
  New Jersey, too. My father added a deck onto his home using power tools he checked out of the library. In a city where I lived recently, you could check out wifi hotspots for a month at a time, with free service.
  - gravypod 4y ago
    Which county? I would love to try that out.
    - reaperducer 4y ago
      Sussex.
- giraffe_lady 4y ago
  There's one of these near me in the US. It's run by anarchists, on donations, but is used and beloved by the multi cultural working class neighborhood.
sircastor 4y ago
Our local library has a maker space attached to it, though it’s pretty mundane. I’m glad for its existence, and I’m hoping it will heroes into something spectacular.
desindol 4y ago
In germany some libraries started to have makerspaces attached to them with good tooling (3D printers,cnc etc) and they host repair cafes weekly but without the voluntary help of a lot of CCC folks it wouldn’t happen . Still I am glad the state is sponsoring the environment for it.
- pbronez 4y ago
  Yup, got some of this in the USA too.
throwaway6734 4y ago
Sadly I think libraries are a product of a past time
- pessimizer 4y ago
  Along with a lot of other public services.
giraffe_lady 4y ago
Would libraries be allowed now if they weren't already an established tradition? I may be cynical but this seems like a pretty clear "no" at least in the US.

mdavis6890 4y ago

Can you imagine a service whereby the government provides table saw for use by the general public? I just do not think the government is equipped to manage this kind of risk.

qbasic_forever 4y ago
Plenty of community colleges are run from state funding and have all kinds of adult education shop classes. You can learn to weld, do carpentry, etc.
- PaulDavisThe1st 4y ago
  Providing an education is utterly different from providing access to the tools to use more or less anytime you need them. Both are valuable, but they are quite distinct.
- monkmartinez 4y ago
  > "Plenty of community colleges are run from state funding and have all kinds of adult education shop classes. You can learn to weld, do carpentry, etc." Once you are done learning the basics which takes about a week, you still have to participate in class and do "class" projects. These classes are not convenient to begin with and access to the shop ends when the class is over. You could buy a small contractors table saw or cheap flux core welder for the price of one class in my area. Not worth the price of admission imo.
CamelCaseName 4y ago
This kind of comes close, with sewing machines, a heat press, and a fabric cutter. https://www.torontopubliclibrary.ca/using-the-library/computer-services/innovation-spaces/fabrication-studio.jsp https://www.torontopubliclibrary.ca/using-the-library/comput...
AdamJacobMuller 4y ago
On the other hand, due to sovereign immunity, the government is uniquely positioned to completely ignore the (legal) risk associated with this kind of scheme. I don't think our government (at basically any level) is capable of actually doing something this useful anymore though.
- redtexture 4y ago
  Speaking at a local level of a library board, school board, planning board, and working with a conservation commission, or a health commision, or municipal council on aging or even public works and roads department... ...funding and implementing operations of a municipal school system, making a community space for learning and meeting (libraries), and other outcomes that go with education, or revising zoning, reviewing proposals for building and housing development, protecting wetlands and land (conservation commission), or guiding proper installation of septic systems, placemment of wells, inspection of food production, or for elders providing community resources from meals on wheels, to social workers, and another kind of community space and service (council on aging), or maintaining roads and streets (and in winter causing them to be plowed for snow)... ...your views on capability and actual work of government are nihilist compared to what they actually do accomplish towards making municipalities personally growthful (educationally), safe, and acceptable even vibrant locales to live in.
ncallaway 4y ago
Yes, it seems pretty straightforward, and would work the same way it works with a maker space. We trust the general public to operate a table saw unsupervised, so I think it would be completely imaginable for the government to offer a supervised space and equipment (and safety training). It’s absolutely not hard for me to imagine that at all.
zetazzed 4y ago
In Berkeley, the public library will lend you a table saw, circular saw, power drill etc. The inventory is right there in the online catalog: https://catalog.berkeleypubliclibrary.org/?section=home https://catalog.berkeleypubliclibrary.org/?section=home Maker-oriented kids can also go to the city-run Adventure Playground (https://berkeleyca.gov/community-recreation/parks-recreation/facilities/adventure-playground https://berkeleyca.gov/community-recreation/parks-recreation...) and hammer or saw away to build their own play structures (though they just have hand tools, no power tools that I've seen).
- djbusby 4y ago
  Wow! Adventure Playground is still around! I went there in the 80s! <3
culi 4y ago
Library of Things are becoming more and more common. The library in Orange County recently started one. Though I doubt they have table saws (yet)
spaetzleesser 4y ago
I am sure there are ways to deal with this. Home Depot sells table saws to the general public and somehow manages the risk. I don’t see why a library couldn’t provide table saws.

quijoteuniv 4y ago

In Norway libraries lend tools, 3d printers and even cargo e-bikes…

reaperducer 4y ago
New Jersey, too. My father added a deck onto his home using power tools he checked out of the library. In a city where I lived recently, you could check out wifi hotspots for a month at a time, with free service.
- gravypod 4y ago
  Which county? I would love to try that out.
  - reaperducer 4y ago
    Sussex.
giraffe_lady 4y ago
There's one of these near me in the US. It's run by anarchists, on donations, but is used and beloved by the multi cultural working class neighborhood.

sircastor 4y ago

Our local library has a maker space attached to it, though it’s pretty mundane. I’m glad for its existence, and I’m hoping it will heroes into something spectacular.

desindol 4y ago

In germany some libraries started to have makerspaces attached to them with good tooling (3D printers,cnc etc) and they host repair cafes weekly but without the voluntary help of a lot of CCC folks it wouldn’t happen . Still I am glad the state is sponsoring the environment for it.

pbronez 4y ago
Yup, got some of this in the USA too.

throwaway6734 4y ago

Sadly I think libraries are a product of a past time

pessimizer 4y ago
Along with a lot of other public services.

giraffe_lady 4y ago

Would libraries be allowed now if they weren't already an established tradition? I may be cynical but this seems like a pretty clear "no" at least in the US.