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Sounds awful, but it could be worse. At least the Facebook-managed McDonald's is trying to chase after what most people seem to want. A Google-managed McDonald'

Sounds awful, but it could be worse. At least the Facebook-managed McDonald's is trying to chase after what most people seem to want. A Google-managed McDonald's would just shut down, even though everyone loves McDonald's, because somebody at Google figured starting a new fast food chain is the best path to a promotion.

mysterydip 4y ago
I don't think it's what people want, per se. I think it's what some metrics say people want. Might be good for "engagement", but bad for retention in the long term. People were on facebook for the features facebook had.
- grog454 4y ago
  > People were on facebook for the features facebook had. People were on Facebook for the people that were on Facebook.
  - TheSpiceIsLife 4y ago
    One of the features of Facebook was the people who were on Facebook.
    - andsoitis 4y ago
      Where have they "gone"?
      - TheSpiceIsLife 4y ago
        They were on Facebook. They still are, but they were too.
  - owlninja 4y ago
    Anecdotally I quit Facebook in 2016 but of my friends and family that still use it, I would say most simply use it for marketplace. They may still view the updates that people still post to see what's going on but it doesn't seem to be near as about keeping in touch (I'm in the US).
    - yieldcrv 4y ago
      Marketplace and the groups for goods or meeting up are full scammers and time wasters People are under the illusion of some fleeting chance of working as advertised
      - SoftTalker 4y ago
        Yep. One of the reasons that old-style classified ads in newspapers worked is that you had to pay to post an ad. Did people run scams in newspaper classifieds? Yes, but by and large the ads were legit. Today, legitimate online marketplace ads are drowned by the scam ads.
    - stevenjgarner 4y ago
      For those of us in families that are spread over the globe in a dozen time zones and separated in different countries, what other methods of connection even come close to social media? Facebook (and the rest) have provided a way for us to vicariously experience glimpses into each other's lives and in many cases reconnect with people who we never would have otherwise.
      - fnordpiglet 4y ago
        I would point out that email also serves here but with worse algorithms for displaying what you want to see :-)
      - owlninja 4y ago
        I can understand this for sure! In my experience Facebook degraded and a lot of people that just posted pictures with small updates moved to Instagram. Again, anecdotally, I have a pocket of friends in Prague and they mostly used Instagram. But now Instagram is moving the same way with a clutter of suggested posts or 'reels' - or whatever their version is.
      - jhugo 4y ago
        My extended family shares a paid Slack instance and it works great. Some of them are on Facebook as well, mostly for marketplace and groups; I don't use FB (I am not really interested in seeing glimpses of distant relatives' lives). I think there is a real future for services targeting the middle ground between the very public nature of Facebook and the very private nature of an email.
  - nrdvana 4y ago
    And they were on Facebook instead of MySpace because Facebook worked better for sharing news snippets. Then facebook changes to the "most interacted-with posts", then politics took a dump on everypne's sharing from about 2015 onward, then facebook changed to a bunch of spammy videos from "content creators", and most of everyone gave up and left. I lost track of the number of people saying (myself included) "Give me all my friends posts, in chronological order", and facebook just ignored us and slowly removed the ability to do anything close to that. Ironic how Google tried Google+ and failed because Facebook had all the users and content. If Google had just shelved theirs as-is for 10 years and pulled it back out now, people would flock to it because it would actually be a feed of your friends/family posts in chronological order, with user-customized filtering, again.
- fnordpiglet 4y ago
  Well, what people want if you define people as humans between the age of 18 and 24 and ignore the rest.
- irjustin 4y ago
  > I don't think it's what people want, per se. I think it's what some metrics say people want This is true and realistically this is what any business should be chasing. People don't know what they want is something I sincerely believe in. I do agree that people are good a voicing problems, but not desires.
  - jhugo 4y ago
    Engagement is a pretty shitty metric when used in isolation though. I've worked at places where changes that increased engagement were considered successful at higher levels even though the support team knew the increased engagement was caused by increased confusion and friction in using the product.
hiptobecubic 4y ago
Well not quite. Shutting it down takes effort. First you have to let it sit and rot away until it becomes a meme. Then you can squeeze another round of promotions out of the deprecation work.
- BlueTemplar 4y ago
  A meme is what is popular (= a unit of culture).
  - mst 4y ago
    "Memetic Unit of Culture" would be an excellent Banksian Culture ship name. Edit: Got to be a GCU really.
hiimshort 4y ago
I've enjoyed the analogy so adding onto it: Google would open up 5 competing, different burger places next to each other and then close them all down a year later, confused that none of them did well enough. All to open a new Taco stand on the other side of town and claim it's got the same great food you liked before (it doesn't).
- jfim 4y ago
  They'd also switch how one orders food every 18 months, and have them migrate to the new way of ordering food. Food ordering in gmail, food ordering as an app, food ordering using a kiosk, then back to an app, then merge it into the wallet app because why not.
  - matt_heimer 4y ago
    And the food is delivered using an old-school automat format where you can see people on the other side but never talk to them if anything is wrong.
    - EdwardDiego 4y ago
      They'd start giving out a free family meal, which is a medium combo version of their corporate banquet pack, and they'll promise it's free forever. Then after 15 years, they'll, give you three months to upgrade, then five months, then after three months of pushback, they'll begrudgingly let you keep having the free family meal, so long as you promise you're not using it to cater for a business event.
- me_again 4y ago
  Apple would sell exactly one kind of burger, which is great but costs $20. The wrapper is rose gold or space grey. Only Apple-certified condiments can be applied to the burgers, and a packet of ketchup is $5. Each year the faithful queue outside for the privilege of obtaining the latest burger.
  - thorncorona 4y ago
happymellon 4y ago
You missed out how Google would also take your order but when you get to the window there is just a piece of paper stuck to the glass telling you: There was something wrong with your order. Please do not try again as we will ban you. They will also lock you out of your car.

mysterydip 4y ago

I don't think it's what people want, per se. I think it's what some metrics say people want. Might be good for "engagement", but bad for retention in the long term. People were on facebook for the features facebook had.

grog454 4y ago
> People were on facebook for the features facebook had. People were on Facebook for the people that were on Facebook.
- TheSpiceIsLife 4y ago
  One of the features of Facebook was the people who were on Facebook.
  - andsoitis 4y ago
    Where have they "gone"?
    - TheSpiceIsLife 4y ago
      They were on Facebook. They still are, but they were too.
- owlninja 4y ago
  Anecdotally I quit Facebook in 2016 but of my friends and family that still use it, I would say most simply use it for marketplace. They may still view the updates that people still post to see what's going on but it doesn't seem to be near as about keeping in touch (I'm in the US).
  - yieldcrv 4y ago
    Marketplace and the groups for goods or meeting up are full scammers and time wasters People are under the illusion of some fleeting chance of working as advertised
    - SoftTalker 4y ago
      Yep. One of the reasons that old-style classified ads in newspapers worked is that you had to pay to post an ad. Did people run scams in newspaper classifieds? Yes, but by and large the ads were legit. Today, legitimate online marketplace ads are drowned by the scam ads.
  - stevenjgarner 4y ago
    For those of us in families that are spread over the globe in a dozen time zones and separated in different countries, what other methods of connection even come close to social media? Facebook (and the rest) have provided a way for us to vicariously experience glimpses into each other's lives and in many cases reconnect with people who we never would have otherwise.
    - fnordpiglet 4y ago
      I would point out that email also serves here but with worse algorithms for displaying what you want to see :-)
    - owlninja 4y ago
      I can understand this for sure! In my experience Facebook degraded and a lot of people that just posted pictures with small updates moved to Instagram. Again, anecdotally, I have a pocket of friends in Prague and they mostly used Instagram. But now Instagram is moving the same way with a clutter of suggested posts or 'reels' - or whatever their version is.
    - jhugo 4y ago
      My extended family shares a paid Slack instance and it works great. Some of them are on Facebook as well, mostly for marketplace and groups; I don't use FB (I am not really interested in seeing glimpses of distant relatives' lives). I think there is a real future for services targeting the middle ground between the very public nature of Facebook and the very private nature of an email.
- nrdvana 4y ago
  And they were on Facebook instead of MySpace because Facebook worked better for sharing news snippets. Then facebook changes to the "most interacted-with posts", then politics took a dump on everypne's sharing from about 2015 onward, then facebook changed to a bunch of spammy videos from "content creators", and most of everyone gave up and left. I lost track of the number of people saying (myself included) "Give me all my friends posts, in chronological order", and facebook just ignored us and slowly removed the ability to do anything close to that. Ironic how Google tried Google+ and failed because Facebook had all the users and content. If Google had just shelved theirs as-is for 10 years and pulled it back out now, people would flock to it because it would actually be a feed of your friends/family posts in chronological order, with user-customized filtering, again.
fnordpiglet 4y ago
Well, what people want if you define people as humans between the age of 18 and 24 and ignore the rest.
irjustin 4y ago
> I don't think it's what people want, per se. I think it's what some metrics say people want This is true and realistically this is what any business should be chasing. People don't know what they want is something I sincerely believe in. I do agree that people are good a voicing problems, but not desires.
- jhugo 4y ago
  Engagement is a pretty shitty metric when used in isolation though. I've worked at places where changes that increased engagement were considered successful at higher levels even though the support team knew the increased engagement was caused by increased confusion and friction in using the product.

hiptobecubic 4y ago

Well not quite. Shutting it down takes effort. First you have to let it sit and rot away until it becomes a meme. Then you can squeeze another round of promotions out of the deprecation work.

BlueTemplar 4y ago
A meme is what is popular (= a unit of culture).
- mst 4y ago
  "Memetic Unit of Culture" would be an excellent Banksian Culture ship name. Edit: Got to be a GCU really.

hiimshort 4y ago

I've enjoyed the analogy so adding onto it: Google would open up 5 competing, different burger places next to each other and then close them all down a year later, confused that none of them did well enough. All to open a new Taco stand on the other side of town and claim it's got the same great food you liked before (it doesn't).

jfim 4y ago
They'd also switch how one orders food every 18 months, and have them migrate to the new way of ordering food. Food ordering in gmail, food ordering as an app, food ordering using a kiosk, then back to an app, then merge it into the wallet app because why not.
- matt_heimer 4y ago
  And the food is delivered using an old-school automat format where you can see people on the other side but never talk to them if anything is wrong.
  - EdwardDiego 4y ago
    They'd start giving out a free family meal, which is a medium combo version of their corporate banquet pack, and they'll promise it's free forever. Then after 15 years, they'll, give you three months to upgrade, then five months, then after three months of pushback, they'll begrudgingly let you keep having the free family meal, so long as you promise you're not using it to cater for a business event.
me_again 4y ago
Apple would sell exactly one kind of burger, which is great but costs $20. The wrapper is rose gold or space grey. Only Apple-certified condiments can be applied to the burgers, and a packet of ketchup is $5. Each year the faithful queue outside for the privilege of obtaining the latest burger.
- thorncorona 4y ago

happymellon 4y ago

You missed out how Google would also take your order but when you get to the window there is just a piece of paper stuck to the glass telling you: There was something wrong with your order. Please do not try again as we will ban you. They will also lock you out of your car.