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It's not just the ETAs that are pushing me away, but just the entire dealership process generally is annoying. I wanted to order a vehicle from GM and I have tr

It's not just the ETAs that are pushing me away, but just the entire dealership process generally is annoying. I wanted to order a vehicle from GM and I have tried close at least 10 dealerships at this point in the PNW. No one is straight up on the process of either getting an order in or what pricing will look like or when they might get an allocation. Some just say "sure, you're on the list" but who knows what that even means. One dealership (Bellingham, WA) wanted 25K deposit to even take an order. I basically gave up on that vehicle not because I can't wait or am not willing to play the price, but the BS process of going through one of these dealerships is too infuriating. Rivian I put my order in and at least I have an order date and understand that I'm in the queue and should be sometime MY24. If Cadillac came out with the exact same process as Rivian and it said I could get my vehicle ordered and enqueued for 12month deliver I would do it.

codazoda 4y ago
I think this is why Ford has said it’s going to do electric vehicles direct. I can’t remember if they’ll use a different brand or not. In Utah, where I am, it’s going to be a bit of a hill. I hear we have some laws to protect the local dealerships. Tesla dealers are just showrooms here and I don’t think they sell anything on-site. Could be wrong about all this.
- HWR_14 4y ago
  I don't think Ford's doing them direct. They did tell dealerships they couldn't raise their prices.
- jfim 4y ago
  I believe it should be the same brand, but they've split the business into Ford Blue (ICE vehicles) and Ford Model e (electric vehicles) in March of this year: https://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/news/2022/03/02/ford-accelerating-transformation.html https://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/news/2022... The Ford CEO has mentioned earlier this year that they're less than pleased at the various markups applied by dealerships, and would want to do set price, online sales (eg. https://techcrunch.com/2022/06/02/ford-wants-to-sell-evs-online-only-and-at-a-set-price/ https://techcrunch.com/2022/06/02/ford-wants-to-sell-evs-onl...).
JamesSwift 4y ago
> Rivian I put my order in and at least I have an order date and understand that I'm in the queue and should be sometime MY24 Is that "Model Year 24"? So they gave you an estimate of a year-long window, but also did not guarantee the date? How is that much different than "Youre on the list" with a traditional dealership?
- frumper 4y ago
  Dealership lists are more like we'll call you if one comes in, and we'll call everyone else on the list right after. First one here gets to buy it. Also, if we have a buddy that wants it, we'll give him a heads up before we call you.
  - oangemangut 4y ago
    Exactly. Also, many of them are very coy about what dealer markup will apply if they ever do get an allocation. You could also be on a list at a dealership that never gets an allocation for you, because they don't get many cars and there are too many people ahead of you. It's not only opaque but also untrustworthy.
smsm42 4y ago
I think some companies just distribute cars between dealerships and let them sort it out, others allow people to actually order a car they like. I tried with Toyota, and they weren't able to get me the car I wanted or even tell me where one could be around, for months - and looks like different dealership don't talk to each other so unless I make deposit with every dealership around, I won't be able to get what I want. Subaru, OTOH, allowed me to place order for exactly the vehicle I liked and get ETA (though not a definite date, just approximate) - even though lead times are still pretty long.

codazoda 4y ago

I think this is why Ford has said it’s going to do electric vehicles direct. I can’t remember if they’ll use a different brand or not. In Utah, where I am, it’s going to be a bit of a hill. I hear we have some laws to protect the local dealerships. Tesla dealers are just showrooms here and I don’t think they sell anything on-site. Could be wrong about all this.

HWR_14 4y ago
I don't think Ford's doing them direct. They did tell dealerships they couldn't raise their prices.
jfim 4y ago
I believe it should be the same brand, but they've split the business into Ford Blue (ICE vehicles) and Ford Model e (electric vehicles) in March of this year: https://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/news/2022/03/02/ford-accelerating-transformation.html https://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/news/2022... The Ford CEO has mentioned earlier this year that they're less than pleased at the various markups applied by dealerships, and would want to do set price, online sales (eg. https://techcrunch.com/2022/06/02/ford-wants-to-sell-evs-online-only-and-at-a-set-price/ https://techcrunch.com/2022/06/02/ford-wants-to-sell-evs-onl...).

JamesSwift 4y ago

> Rivian I put my order in and at least I have an order date and understand that I'm in the queue and should be sometime MY24 Is that "Model Year 24"? So they gave you an estimate of a year-long window, but also did not guarantee the date? How is that much different than "Youre on the list" with a traditional dealership?

frumper 4y ago
Dealership lists are more like we'll call you if one comes in, and we'll call everyone else on the list right after. First one here gets to buy it. Also, if we have a buddy that wants it, we'll give him a heads up before we call you.
- oangemangut 4y ago
  Exactly. Also, many of them are very coy about what dealer markup will apply if they ever do get an allocation. You could also be on a list at a dealership that never gets an allocation for you, because they don't get many cars and there are too many people ahead of you. It's not only opaque but also untrustworthy.

smsm42 4y ago

I think some companies just distribute cars between dealerships and let them sort it out, others allow people to actually order a car they like. I tried with Toyota, and they weren't able to get me the car I wanted or even tell me where one could be around, for months - and looks like different dealership don't talk to each other so unless I make deposit with every dealership around, I won't be able to get what I want. Subaru, OTOH, allowed me to place order for exactly the vehicle I liked and get ETA (though not a definite date, just approximate) - even though lead times are still pretty long.