4 ms·

So, the arguments are: 1. Pushkin supported the Russian unitary empire and subjugation of Ukraine. 2. Pushkin was instrumental in the development of the moder

by unmole 4y ago

So, the arguments are: 1. Pushkin supported the Russian unitary empire and subjugation of Ukraine. 2. Pushkin was instrumental in the development of the modern Russian language and is thus seen as symbolising the forced linguistic homogenisation imposed on Ukrainians. The first argument has some explaining power as to why Ukrainians wouldn't want to have a Pushkin memorial. The second argument is presented with a helping of founding myth: Russians are a homogeneous blob of NPCs, Ukrainians are autonomous and diverse individuals. This is a weak argument. For a thread that rails about conflating history with modern reality, it strangely sidesteps contemporary linguistic politics. The modern Russian state has federal divisions specifically for non-Russian ethnic groups called republics which are distinct from oblasts i.e. provinces. And these republics established official languages of their own as expressly allowed by the Russian constitution. Ukraine on the other hand clamped down on the use of Russian and Hungarian. Ukrainian is a co-official language in Russian occupied Crimea but Russian has no official status anywhere in Ukraine. And considering how unnecessarily long-winded the thread is, I wouldn't say it was particularly constructive.

ROTMetro 4y ago
Why do you ignore that the one Federation that didn't teach Russian in schools was forced to change their policy? Russia can have all the written rules they want, they follow them the same way they followed their statements during February that 'they had no intention to invade Ukraine', or agree to allow Ukraine shipment of grain then bomb the ports to ensure no ships will risk docking there, or their law making non-defensive wars illegal (hence this is not a war to them). China has freedom of speech and democracy guaranteed by their constitution, would you defend China's open press and elections next as quickly as you are defending Russia's hollow laws? (not anti-Russians here, my grandfather was Russian, but definitely anti-Russia today).
- unmole 4y ago
  > Why do you ignore that the one Federation that didn't teach Russian in schools was forced to change their policy? What federation? I have no idea what you're talking about. I made a specific claim about the status of minority languages in Russia and Ukraine. Do you have any evidence to show that it is inaccurate? > Russia can have all the written rules they want What exactly are you implying in this specific instance? That minority languages aren't actually used? The state broadcaster runs services in a dozen or so minority languages.
  - ROTMetro 4y ago
    1. There was one republic that did not include Russian as the primary language for education, and they were forced to change that. I will try to dig up something on it, I didn't bookmark such a random thing. 2. They are free to have official languages, as long as they include Russian. They are not free to exclude Russian. Ukraine did not clamp down on Russian prior to Russia annexing 10% of Ukraine in 2014.
    - ghostwriter 4y ago
      > They are free to have official languages, as long as they include Russian. They are not free to exclude Russian. This is the most proper thing to implement in all national republics that form a larger federation. This policy makes sure that younger generations are not deprived of economic and cultural opportunities due to language barriers. > Ukraine did not clamp down on Russian prior to Russia annexing 10% of Ukraine in 2014. If the Ukrainian government feels like to clamp down on Russian due to their own uncivilized messing with the right to representation of East Ukrainians (mostly russian-speaking) via the violent coup against a democratically elected president that didn’t break a law, then it tells a lot about their self-awareness and general ability to reflect on the matter. Have they ever studied how civil wars get started?

by unmole 4y ago

ROTMetro 4y ago

Why do you ignore that the one Federation that didn't teach Russian in schools was forced to change their policy? Russia can have all the written rules they want, they follow them the same way they followed their statements during February that 'they had no intention to invade Ukraine', or agree to allow Ukraine shipment of grain then bomb the ports to ensure no ships will risk docking there, or their law making non-defensive wars illegal (hence this is not a war to them). China has freedom of speech and democracy guaranteed by their constitution, would you defend China's open press and elections next as quickly as you are defending Russia's hollow laws? (not anti-Russians here, my grandfather was Russian, but definitely anti-Russia today).

unmole 4y ago
> Why do you ignore that the one Federation that didn't teach Russian in schools was forced to change their policy? What federation? I have no idea what you're talking about. I made a specific claim about the status of minority languages in Russia and Ukraine. Do you have any evidence to show that it is inaccurate? > Russia can have all the written rules they want What exactly are you implying in this specific instance? That minority languages aren't actually used? The state broadcaster runs services in a dozen or so minority languages.
- ROTMetro 4y ago
  1. There was one republic that did not include Russian as the primary language for education, and they were forced to change that. I will try to dig up something on it, I didn't bookmark such a random thing. 2. They are free to have official languages, as long as they include Russian. They are not free to exclude Russian. Ukraine did not clamp down on Russian prior to Russia annexing 10% of Ukraine in 2014.
  - ghostwriter 4y ago
    > They are free to have official languages, as long as they include Russian. They are not free to exclude Russian. This is the most proper thing to implement in all national republics that form a larger federation. This policy makes sure that younger generations are not deprived of economic and cultural opportunities due to language barriers. > Ukraine did not clamp down on Russian prior to Russia annexing 10% of Ukraine in 2014. If the Ukrainian government feels like to clamp down on Russian due to their own uncivilized messing with the right to representation of East Ukrainians (mostly russian-speaking) via the violent coup against a democratically elected president that didn’t break a law, then it tells a lot about their self-awareness and general ability to reflect on the matter. Have they ever studied how civil wars get started?