5 ms·

New GIMP 2.6 Gives Photoshop a Run for Its Money

64 points by qhoxie 18y ago

thwarted 18y ago
"That means that closing an image no longer closes the app and it also means there’s drag-and-drop support for opening images." I have Gimp 2.4.7 on Fedora9 and it doesn't close the app when you close any or all image windows, and there is support for drag-and-drop opening to either an already created image window or to the tool palette window.
sharjeel 18y ago
Gimp has been developed by developers for developers. They don't understand how designers use imaging applications and apparently they dont want to know either. For example they've been told so many times that non-modal dialogs on ms windows sux. Your workspace windows appearing on the taskbar not only clutter everything, it also makes your ork harder by switching between windows. Just to cater this thing a project called gimpshop was forked but gimp community should have included it in the core. hoever they've always shot down this idea. If they want to compete with photoshop they should focus on usability rather than features. The scripting features might be awefully cool for developers but for designers who have to sometimes make hundreds of clicks to get one pixel straight, usability matters the most.
- halo 18y ago
  Did you read the article? >"Perhaps the most welcome change to the UI is that the palettes (toolbox and docks in GIMP parlance) are now utility windows, which means that they won’t show up in your dock or task bar as separate windows" Apparently it doesn't yet apply to the Windows build (I haven't tried), but they have fixed the two single biggest and most obvious GUI annoyances - multiple pointless and confusing menus and multiple windows in task-bar. Another one of the biggest requested features - CMYK support - is on its way. It's /long/ overdue, but Gimp is actually seems to be making huge strides in the right direction.
  - swilliams 18y ago
    Good for them, but I don't understand how they waited until 2008 to get this in. It seems like such a basic UI concept to me.
- nihilocrat 18y ago
  I think a lot of mac users (no, not me) would like to have a word with you about putting everything in one main window. This is completely anecdotal, but I remember hearing a few mac users enjoy the fact that its apps tend to follow the 'lots of windows' model versus the 'one large window with many sub-windows' model a la most Windows apps.
- rcoder 18y ago
  > If they want to compete with photoshop they should focus > on usability rather than features. The scripting features > might be awefully cool for developers but for designers > who have to sometimes make hundreds of clicks to get one > pixel straight, usability matters the most. Perhaps the same designers who love to complain about the increasing licensing costs of the Adobe stack should step up and start putting their money where their mouth is? If a few hundred design nerds donated even a fraction of the upgrade costs for CS4 to developers working on GIMP, they could probably get all kinds of nifty usability and functional fixes into the next release.
netcan 18y ago
I think the GIMP is one of the biggest casualties of pirating. It's ironic.
- SwellJoe 18y ago
  How so? Since the thing that matters most is that the people who develop it, and the people who use it and get involved, are enjoying the software, I don't see how not having those users that pirate Photoshop is any negative. I've been an Open Source developer for over 10 years...and while it's nice to have a lot of users (particularly if you want to make money on the software in some way), the kind of users you have is more important than the quantity. I'd take one good Open Source fanatic over a dozen Photoshop pirates any day. The pirates don't do anything and they have little respect for the developers of the software. If I were building the GIMP, why would I want them to use my software? If the goal of the GIMP developers is "kill Photoshop", then I guess piracy is a negative...but if the goal is "make awesome software", then there's nothing pirates can do to impact them in any way. I kinda suspect the goal for most Open Source developers is "make awesome software" first, and stuff related to proprietary competitors is way down the list, or not even relevant. (Again, assuming money doesn't enter into the equation...in which case, the story is somewhat different.) For what it's worth, I've been a GIMP user since the very first public release (I remember the first mention on Slashdot), and I haven't used anything else in that time...never needed to. Regardless, I think GIMP is clearly one of the great success stories of friendly, consumer-oriented, Open Source software...and it gets better and more successful with every release.
  - wheels 18y ago
    > Again, assuming money doesn't enter into the equation...in which case, the story is somewhat different. Which anecdotally, isn't the case for the lead devel, since he started yesterday as the lead devel for a new startup around the corner from Directed Edge. :-)
  - netcan 18y ago
    You've already responded to my 'how so'. I would've said 'more users' you've said 'crap users.' Fair enough. It's just that photo editing software has a relatively high learning curve. I think (anecdotal, I have no references for this) that due to the cost of photoshop many users start experimenting on pirated copies. Mostly kids & hobbyists. Years later they may buy a copy or take it with them to the workplace. By that stage, they're used to photoshop to the extent that it's the only option.
deleted 18y ago
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PStamatiou 18y ago
GIMP doesn't give anything a run for its money if I can't figure out how the menus are laid out. I've tried and tried but I'm not going to spend 20 minutes trying to figure out how to do an unsharp mask when my Mac with CS3 is sitting right next to my linux box. Call me stubborn. I'll have to install it and see what they mean by "The result is a version of GIMP that behaves much more like Photoshop and makes a very capable replacement for those not locked into an Adobe workflow." for GIMP 2.6 (edit: yeah I know there is gimpshop but i was just saying for the sake of argument..)
- apgwoz 18y ago
  This release actually changes around some things, which may make it a better experience.
- ajross 18y ago
  It amuses me that you have internalized the meaning of a technique called (without irony) "unsharp mask" but can't spend 20 minutes reading a tutorial to figure out how to do it in a different tool. It's not for you. You have photoshop and like it, and apparently don't mind paying for it. Slamming competing software when it is blindingly obvious that you have no intention of using it is basically just knee-jerk jealousy.
cbarning 18y ago
Still no 'Direct Select' tool in GIMP, which is basic of basic tools in Photoshop and any other photo editing program.
- thwarted 18y ago
  GIMP has supported editing all components of a path, converting to a selection, moving the entire path, and adjusting the handles, for a while. If I remember correctly, it was buggy until around GIMP 1.2. The second half of the video on this page, after the "Direct Select" tool is chosen at 0:16, is completely doable in The GIMP. http://shapeshed.com/journal/photoshop_101_path_and_direct_selection_tools/ http://shapeshed.com/journal/photoshop_101_path_and_direct_s...
deleted 18y ago
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maxklein 18y ago
The GIMP is an example of a user interface that has sucked for many many years, but because certain people are used to it being that way, it was never changed.
- irrelative 18y ago
  I agree that the UI in GIMP is pretty bad, but I really don't find Photoshop's UI to be so clever and easy to use that it blows away the GIMP. I even prefer the keyboard shortcuts in GIMP better: "m" for move (it's "v" in Photoshop... what?), "r" for rectangular select (it's "m" in Photoshop). If you've used one for a while, the other seems weird and clunky with an almost identical feature set. Having used the GIMP more lately, I'd say in response: Photoshop is an example of a user interface that has sucked for many many years, but because certain professionals are used to it being that way, it hasn't changed.
  - lisp_padawan 18y ago
    that's because 'm' is used for marquee, which allows both rectangular and elliptical as well as single pixel column (vertical and horizontal) selections. 'v' is used because 'm' is already taken and 'v' does make sense for the moVe command, especially if you stress the second syllable There is a method to the madness!
  - jcl 18y ago
    For the record, rectangular select is "m" in Photoshop because the Photoshop tool is called the "Marquee" tool (because the flashing dots around the selection look like a theater marquee). So move gets "v" instead. "V" is actually a better key for move than "m" because it's more convenient to hit with the left hand; many experienced Photoshop users work with the left hand on the lower left corner of the keyboard and the right hand on the mouse/graphics tablet.
    - Hexstream 18y ago
      Oh please, stop assuming Qwerty or we'll still be stuck with this shitty layout in 500 years!
helveticaman 18y ago
Now that this version exists, we need one that gives Photoshop a run for its money.
livecrunch 18y ago
Thanks god they made it ! I love this release! Nix* 4evr
burp 18y ago
I'd be curious to know which version of Gimp between windows and linux gets more downloads .

64 points by qhoxie 18y ago

"That means that closing an image no longer closes the app and it also means there’s drag-and-drop support for opening images." I have Gimp 2.4.7 on Fedora9 and it doesn't close the app when you close any or all image windows, and there is support for drag-and-drop opening to either an already created image window or to the tool palette window.

sharjeel 18y ago

Gimp has been developed by developers for developers. They don't understand how designers use imaging applications and apparently they dont want to know either. For example they've been told so many times that non-modal dialogs on ms windows sux. Your workspace windows appearing on the taskbar not only clutter everything, it also makes your ork harder by switching between windows. Just to cater this thing a project called gimpshop was forked but gimp community should have included it in the core. hoever they've always shot down this idea. If they want to compete with photoshop they should focus on usability rather than features. The scripting features might be awefully cool for developers but for designers who have to sometimes make hundreds of clicks to get one pixel straight, usability matters the most.

halo 18y ago
Did you read the article? >"Perhaps the most welcome change to the UI is that the palettes (toolbox and docks in GIMP parlance) are now utility windows, which means that they won’t show up in your dock or task bar as separate windows" Apparently it doesn't yet apply to the Windows build (I haven't tried), but they have fixed the two single biggest and most obvious GUI annoyances - multiple pointless and confusing menus and multiple windows in task-bar. Another one of the biggest requested features - CMYK support - is on its way. It's /long/ overdue, but Gimp is actually seems to be making huge strides in the right direction.
- swilliams 18y ago
  Good for them, but I don't understand how they waited until 2008 to get this in. It seems like such a basic UI concept to me.
nihilocrat 18y ago
I think a lot of mac users (no, not me) would like to have a word with you about putting everything in one main window. This is completely anecdotal, but I remember hearing a few mac users enjoy the fact that its apps tend to follow the 'lots of windows' model versus the 'one large window with many sub-windows' model a la most Windows apps.
rcoder 18y ago
> If they want to compete with photoshop they should focus > on usability rather than features. The scripting features > might be awefully cool for developers but for designers > who have to sometimes make hundreds of clicks to get one > pixel straight, usability matters the most. Perhaps the same designers who love to complain about the increasing licensing costs of the Adobe stack should step up and start putting their money where their mouth is? If a few hundred design nerds donated even a fraction of the upgrade costs for CS4 to developers working on GIMP, they could probably get all kinds of nifty usability and functional fixes into the next release.

netcan 18y ago

I think the GIMP is one of the biggest casualties of pirating. It's ironic.

SwellJoe 18y ago
How so? Since the thing that matters most is that the people who develop it, and the people who use it and get involved, are enjoying the software, I don't see how not having those users that pirate Photoshop is any negative. I've been an Open Source developer for over 10 years...and while it's nice to have a lot of users (particularly if you want to make money on the software in some way), the kind of users you have is more important than the quantity. I'd take one good Open Source fanatic over a dozen Photoshop pirates any day. The pirates don't do anything and they have little respect for the developers of the software. If I were building the GIMP, why would I want them to use my software? If the goal of the GIMP developers is "kill Photoshop", then I guess piracy is a negative...but if the goal is "make awesome software", then there's nothing pirates can do to impact them in any way. I kinda suspect the goal for most Open Source developers is "make awesome software" first, and stuff related to proprietary competitors is way down the list, or not even relevant. (Again, assuming money doesn't enter into the equation...in which case, the story is somewhat different.) For what it's worth, I've been a GIMP user since the very first public release (I remember the first mention on Slashdot), and I haven't used anything else in that time...never needed to. Regardless, I think GIMP is clearly one of the great success stories of friendly, consumer-oriented, Open Source software...and it gets better and more successful with every release.
- wheels 18y ago
  > Again, assuming money doesn't enter into the equation...in which case, the story is somewhat different. Which anecdotally, isn't the case for the lead devel, since he started yesterday as the lead devel for a new startup around the corner from Directed Edge. :-)
- netcan 18y ago
  You've already responded to my 'how so'. I would've said 'more users' you've said 'crap users.' Fair enough. It's just that photo editing software has a relatively high learning curve. I think (anecdotal, I have no references for this) that due to the cost of photoshop many users start experimenting on pirated copies. Mostly kids & hobbyists. Years later they may buy a copy or take it with them to the workplace. By that stage, they're used to photoshop to the extent that it's the only option.

deleted 18y ago

[deleted]

PStamatiou 18y ago

GIMP doesn't give anything a run for its money if I can't figure out how the menus are laid out. I've tried and tried but I'm not going to spend 20 minutes trying to figure out how to do an unsharp mask when my Mac with CS3 is sitting right next to my linux box. Call me stubborn. I'll have to install it and see what they mean by "The result is a version of GIMP that behaves much more like Photoshop and makes a very capable replacement for those not locked into an Adobe workflow." for GIMP 2.6 (edit: yeah I know there is gimpshop but i was just saying for the sake of argument..)

apgwoz 18y ago
This release actually changes around some things, which may make it a better experience.
ajross 18y ago
It amuses me that you have internalized the meaning of a technique called (without irony) "unsharp mask" but can't spend 20 minutes reading a tutorial to figure out how to do it in a different tool. It's not for you. You have photoshop and like it, and apparently don't mind paying for it. Slamming competing software when it is blindingly obvious that you have no intention of using it is basically just knee-jerk jealousy.

cbarning 18y ago

Still no 'Direct Select' tool in GIMP, which is basic of basic tools in Photoshop and any other photo editing program.

thwarted 18y ago
GIMP has supported editing all components of a path, converting to a selection, moving the entire path, and adjusting the handles, for a while. If I remember correctly, it was buggy until around GIMP 1.2. The second half of the video on this page, after the "Direct Select" tool is chosen at 0:16, is completely doable in The GIMP. http://shapeshed.com/journal/photoshop_101_path_and_direct_selection_tools/ http://shapeshed.com/journal/photoshop_101_path_and_direct_s...

deleted 18y ago

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maxklein 18y ago

The GIMP is an example of a user interface that has sucked for many many years, but because certain people are used to it being that way, it was never changed.

irrelative 18y ago
I agree that the UI in GIMP is pretty bad, but I really don't find Photoshop's UI to be so clever and easy to use that it blows away the GIMP. I even prefer the keyboard shortcuts in GIMP better: "m" for move (it's "v" in Photoshop... what?), "r" for rectangular select (it's "m" in Photoshop). If you've used one for a while, the other seems weird and clunky with an almost identical feature set. Having used the GIMP more lately, I'd say in response: Photoshop is an example of a user interface that has sucked for many many years, but because certain professionals are used to it being that way, it hasn't changed.
- lisp_padawan 18y ago
  that's because 'm' is used for marquee, which allows both rectangular and elliptical as well as single pixel column (vertical and horizontal) selections. 'v' is used because 'm' is already taken and 'v' does make sense for the moVe command, especially if you stress the second syllable There is a method to the madness!
- jcl 18y ago
  For the record, rectangular select is "m" in Photoshop because the Photoshop tool is called the "Marquee" tool (because the flashing dots around the selection look like a theater marquee). So move gets "v" instead. "V" is actually a better key for move than "m" because it's more convenient to hit with the left hand; many experienced Photoshop users work with the left hand on the lower left corner of the keyboard and the right hand on the mouse/graphics tablet.
  - Hexstream 18y ago
    Oh please, stop assuming Qwerty or we'll still be stuck with this shitty layout in 500 years!

helveticaman 18y ago

Now that this version exists, we need one that gives Photoshop a run for its money.

livecrunch 18y ago

Thanks god they made it ! I love this release! Nix* 4evr

burp 18y ago

I'd be curious to know which version of Gimp between windows and linux gets more downloads .