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Cheating was rampant in those games? Even nowadays the most liberal modding policy for multiplayer games is "modded copies cannot play with unmodded copies" to

Cheating was rampant in those games? Even nowadays the most liberal modding policy for multiplayer games is "modded copies cannot play with unmodded copies" to try and cordon of modded users from being able to scam/grief/etc the general player base. Is there any online game that has permitted modded clients playing with unmodded clients and had it go well?

AinderS 4y ago
> Cheating was rampant in those games? But what kind of cheats? Aimbotting and seeing through walls don't apply to VR chat. And no matter how modded your client was, you couldn't spam endless grenades in Counter Strike - the server knows how many grenades you have, and where you can throw them.
- asojfdowgh 4y ago
  Aimbotting/wallhacks are relevant, as there are games within VRChat where those are relevant. Due to starcraft 2's design, defogging hacks were plentiful. Anyone who has played TF2 for a significant amount of time has run into hackers landing impossible shots, e.g. through walls before EAC, there has been VAC (along with two separate community-ran anti-cheat services for source games), Battleye, Warden, etc. It seems universal amongst those involved, that client-side anti cheat helps way more than you expect.
falcolas 4y ago
Minecraft. World of Warcraft. FFXIV. Just to name 3 off the top of my head.
- asojfdowgh 4y ago
  And there is a hell lot of complaints about cheaters on hypixel, no?
- anonymoushn 4y ago
  Does squeenix explicitly allow FFXIV mods now?
  - madamelic 4y ago
    Ehhh. I'd say they tolerate it. Their policy is basically "Don't Ask, Don't Tell". So as long as you aren't yelling at people about DPS meters or streaming with obvious mods, they'll leave you alone.
- atraac 4y ago
  It's worth noting that WoW addons also backfired at certain points but for different reasons. Example being AVR that drew shapes over the 3d world marking boss mechanics, essentially trivializing them and leading to Blizzard locking out that API entirely from addons. It didn't affect other users, though gave a competitive advantage to some.
Karrot_Kream 4y ago
In a game this makes sense, cheaters ruin the competitive aspect of the gameplay. But here people are objecting because there's no competition. VRChat's claims are that modded clients result in security exploits for unsuspecting users and can cause instability for non-modded users. So the question arises, can VRChat plug these problems without resorting to anti-cheat? Was anti-cheat just the lazy option, or are there inherent aspects of the client which make it hard to plug these security exploits or the instability?

AinderS 4y ago

> Cheating was rampant in those games? But what kind of cheats? Aimbotting and seeing through walls don't apply to VR chat. And no matter how modded your client was, you couldn't spam endless grenades in Counter Strike - the server knows how many grenades you have, and where you can throw them.

asojfdowgh 4y ago
Aimbotting/wallhacks are relevant, as there are games within VRChat where those are relevant. Due to starcraft 2's design, defogging hacks were plentiful. Anyone who has played TF2 for a significant amount of time has run into hackers landing impossible shots, e.g. through walls before EAC, there has been VAC (along with two separate community-ran anti-cheat services for source games), Battleye, Warden, etc. It seems universal amongst those involved, that client-side anti cheat helps way more than you expect.

falcolas 4y ago

Minecraft. World of Warcraft. FFXIV. Just to name 3 off the top of my head.

asojfdowgh 4y ago
And there is a hell lot of complaints about cheaters on hypixel, no?
anonymoushn 4y ago
Does squeenix explicitly allow FFXIV mods now?
- madamelic 4y ago
  Ehhh. I'd say they tolerate it. Their policy is basically "Don't Ask, Don't Tell". So as long as you aren't yelling at people about DPS meters or streaming with obvious mods, they'll leave you alone.
atraac 4y ago
It's worth noting that WoW addons also backfired at certain points but for different reasons. Example being AVR that drew shapes over the 3d world marking boss mechanics, essentially trivializing them and leading to Blizzard locking out that API entirely from addons. It didn't affect other users, though gave a competitive advantage to some.

Karrot_Kream 4y ago

In a game this makes sense, cheaters ruin the competitive aspect of the gameplay. But here people are objecting because there's no competition. VRChat's claims are that modded clients result in security exploits for unsuspecting users and can cause instability for non-modded users. So the question arises, can VRChat plug these problems without resorting to anti-cheat? Was anti-cheat just the lazy option, or are there inherent aspects of the client which make it hard to plug these security exploits or the instability?