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If Amtrak were more efficient, why would it need to become a parasite of gas users? It would thrive on its own.

by sfe22 4y ago

acdha 4y ago
Amtrak is in the position it’s in because they don’t own most of the rails they use, and the freight railroads which do run very carefully optimized operations because they’re competing against the heavily-subsidized road system, not to mention how the lack of something like a carbon tax means that more polluting trucks don’t pay for the damage they do. Putting taxes on the things we don’t want encourages use of alternatives. If we want to tackle climate change we should be taxing everything related to CO2 emissions, and using those proceeds to fund far less polluting transportation systems - especially trains which can easily be electrified & run on renewable power – is an important long-term step to reducing the CO2 footprint of things like manufacturing vehicles.
giyanani 4y ago
Road/car dominance wasn’t exactly established in a free market either. There’s a whole host of subsidies for building/maintaining roads paid for by everyone [1]. There’s the regulatory advantages driving has (ex: the common zoning requirement that new construction ensure enough parking space [2]). There’s the negative externalities of highways/roadways. (Ex: the health impacts of pollution[3], and the health impacts of sitting in a car rather than walking/biking (part of the way) to their destination [4]) [1] https://usa.streetsblog.org/2013/01/23/drivers-cover-just-51-percent-of-u-s-road-spending/ https://usa.streetsblog.org/2013/01/23/drivers-cover-just-51... [2] https://www.planning.org/planning/2018/oct/peopleoverparking/ https://www.planning.org/planning/2018/oct/peopleoverparking... [3] https://theicct.org/new-study-quantifies-the-global-health-impacts-of-vehicle-exhaust/ https://theicct.org/new-study-quantifies-the-global-health-i... [4] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8744747/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8744747/
phamilton 4y ago
Amtrak has positive externalities on gas users. More accessible public transit usage means less traffic and more efficient travel. [0] "Would you pay $X/month to have less traffic?" likely is a resounding "Yes" for some value of X greater than zero. Subsidizing public transit is a good idea, and benefits those who don't use it. [0] https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/near-free-public-transport-eases-congestion-germanys-roads-2022-07-22/ https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/near-free-public-transp...
- grandmczeb 4y ago
  You can just do this directly with a congestion tax, but those are extraordinary unpopular.

If Amtrak were more efficient, why would it need to become a parasite of gas users? It would thrive on its own.

by sfe22 4y ago

If Amtrak were more efficient, why would it need to become a parasite of gas users? It would thrive on its own.

Amtrak is in the position it’s in because they don’t own most of the rails they use, and the freight railroads which do run very carefully optimized operations because they’re competing against the heavily-subsidized road system, not to mention how the lack of something like a carbon tax means that more polluting trucks don’t pay for the damage they do. Putting taxes on the things we don’t want encourages use of alternatives. If we want to tackle climate change we should be taxing everything related to CO2 emissions, and using those proceeds to fund far less polluting transportation systems - especially trains which can easily be electrified & run on renewable power – is an important long-term step to reducing the CO2 footprint of things like manufacturing vehicles.

giyanani 4y ago

Road/car dominance wasn’t exactly established in a free market either. There’s a whole host of subsidies for building/maintaining roads paid for by everyone [1]. There’s the regulatory advantages driving has (ex: the common zoning requirement that new construction ensure enough parking space [2]). There’s the negative externalities of highways/roadways. (Ex: the health impacts of pollution[3], and the health impacts of sitting in a car rather than walking/biking (part of the way) to their destination [4]) [1] https://usa.streetsblog.org/2013/01/23/drivers-cover-just-51-percent-of-u-s-road-spending/ https://usa.streetsblog.org/2013/01/23/drivers-cover-just-51... [2] https://www.planning.org/planning/2018/oct/peopleoverparking/ https://www.planning.org/planning/2018/oct/peopleoverparking... [3] https://theicct.org/new-study-quantifies-the-global-health-impacts-of-vehicle-exhaust/ https://theicct.org/new-study-quantifies-the-global-health-i... [4] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8744747/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8744747/

phamilton 4y ago

Amtrak has positive externalities on gas users. More accessible public transit usage means less traffic and more efficient travel. [0] "Would you pay $X/month to have less traffic?" likely is a resounding "Yes" for some value of X greater than zero. Subsidizing public transit is a good idea, and benefits those who don't use it. [0] https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/near-free-public-transport-eases-congestion-germanys-roads-2022-07-22/ https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/near-free-public-transp...

grandmczeb 4y ago
You can just do this directly with a congestion tax, but those are extraordinary unpopular.