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A good way around this for people who absolutely want a new car is to buy electric and enjoy the fuel and maintenance savings. Inflation has hit EVs too, but at

by natch 4y ago

A good way around this for people who absolutely want a new car is to buy electric and enjoy the fuel and maintenance savings. Inflation has hit EVs too, but at least the other costs are a lot lower, bringing the TCO to on par or better.

Someone1234 4y ago
This same song gets sung no matter how much more an EV costs over an ICE vehicle. EVs likely do save $10K~ over the life of the vehicle, but EVs cost $20K more than a similarly sized/styled ICE right now. For example the Model 3 Vs. Corolla is $20K difference. If you spend $4K extra on the Corolla Hybrid instead the fuel savings advantage for the EV reduces. EV proponents always want to pretend Hybrids and Plug-In Hybrids don't exist. It is also all predicated on driving a lot. As EV prices continued to increase, proponents just increased the "assumed mileage" to make their arguments. I literally read someone's post about "cost savings" that assumed 30K miles/year. That's almost commercial usage levels. To be clear, I'm extremely pro-EV but I tire of the "just ignore the sticker" talk vis-à-vis pricing. EVs are darn expensive and the $10K savings don't magically change that and are based on a whole host of assumptions that may not apply. The next model year Bolt EV and EUV may be significant vehicles, because they're going to be priced low enough to where the $10K lifetime savings may actually make them a little cheaper than their ICE contemporaries.
- natch 4y ago
  You start by using insulting language and talking about hybrid vehicles which do not offer the same fuel savings as EVs, do not have the mechanical simplicity and elegance of EVs, and thus do not have the lower maintenance costs of EVs, as well as having a significantly shorter expected lifetime, while also supporting intransigent auto makers and stinking. Then you agree with me by saying that upcoming EVs will be cheaper than ICE cars. (I think we can agree that in the context what is meant is a cheaper TCO). And $10k is a very conservative number which doesn’t even account for a lot of benefits, from safety, to externalities like pollution emitted by a hybrid or other ICE car, to the probable much longer lifetime of an EV relative to an ICE car, as well as being able to look at yourself in the mirror. Also your choice of a Corolla for comparison is surprising. We should compare prices of cars with similar features, not low end cars against high end cars. This pretty much invalidates your comparison which claims a $20k price difference. And even if you still believe what you think, one way to look at it is that we are all going to be paying for climate change one way or another. If we pay a little up front to save on gas, maintenance, safety, fun, reducing pollution, and supporting companies that give a shit, we will reap even more benefits later.

by natch 4y ago

Someone1234 4y ago

This same song gets sung no matter how much more an EV costs over an ICE vehicle. EVs likely do save $10K~ over the life of the vehicle, but EVs cost $20K more than a similarly sized/styled ICE right now. For example the Model 3 Vs. Corolla is $20K difference. If you spend $4K extra on the Corolla Hybrid instead the fuel savings advantage for the EV reduces. EV proponents always want to pretend Hybrids and Plug-In Hybrids don't exist. It is also all predicated on driving a lot. As EV prices continued to increase, proponents just increased the "assumed mileage" to make their arguments. I literally read someone's post about "cost savings" that assumed 30K miles/year. That's almost commercial usage levels. To be clear, I'm extremely pro-EV but I tire of the "just ignore the sticker" talk vis-à-vis pricing. EVs are darn expensive and the $10K savings don't magically change that and are based on a whole host of assumptions that may not apply. The next model year Bolt EV and EUV may be significant vehicles, because they're going to be priced low enough to where the $10K lifetime savings may actually make them a little cheaper than their ICE contemporaries.

natch 4y ago
You start by using insulting language and talking about hybrid vehicles which do not offer the same fuel savings as EVs, do not have the mechanical simplicity and elegance of EVs, and thus do not have the lower maintenance costs of EVs, as well as having a significantly shorter expected lifetime, while also supporting intransigent auto makers and stinking. Then you agree with me by saying that upcoming EVs will be cheaper than ICE cars. (I think we can agree that in the context what is meant is a cheaper TCO). And $10k is a very conservative number which doesn’t even account for a lot of benefits, from safety, to externalities like pollution emitted by a hybrid or other ICE car, to the probable much longer lifetime of an EV relative to an ICE car, as well as being able to look at yourself in the mirror. Also your choice of a Corolla for comparison is surprising. We should compare prices of cars with similar features, not low end cars against high end cars. This pretty much invalidates your comparison which claims a $20k price difference. And even if you still believe what you think, one way to look at it is that we are all going to be paying for climate change one way or another. If we pay a little up front to save on gas, maintenance, safety, fun, reducing pollution, and supporting companies that give a shit, we will reap even more benefits later.