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Consider the two ideas in your question. 1. Old laptops are suitable for light use. 2. You are fine using an old laptop. Neither of those suggests you are ac

Consider the two ideas in your question. 1. Old laptops are suitable for light use. 2. You are fine using an old laptop. Neither of those suggests you are actually likely to spend money on a CPU upgrade. The history of upgradable consumer computers bears this out. Intel has Tik'd and Toc'd several times in the 14 years since 2008. Basically, an upgrade board would need to be an entire computer...RAM has marched on too. So has USB. It doesn't make sense to keep that SKU in stock for a market segment that doesn't upgrade their compute.

hnlmorg 4y ago
NUC's are a motherboard. They'll typically have a processor included (maybe always?) but also have onboard USB, HDMI and other components. Sometimes even a WiFi radio, though my NUC doesn't. You then supply the storage, RAM and any external accessories. That means you can upgrade your CPU and still see upgrades in USB, RAM and so on and so forth, like you wanted, too. I'm not exactly a member of the Intel fan club but I've got to admit that the NUC is a pretty awesome bit of kit. Crudely speaking, it's halfway between a Raspberry Pi and a desktop PC. So I think it's really well suited for the kind of purpose described in the article. I've got a NUC from around a decade ago to use as a HTPC and it's still going strong even now.
- brudgers 4y ago
  On a laptop from 2008, you won't have USB 3.0, 5ghz wifi, support for 16GB DIMM's (and maybe not even 8GB). But even more to the point, your ten year old NUC is good enough. If you were the sort of person who upgraded, you would have upgraded. While a C64 isn't good enough for most people today, a ten year old laptop is right up until it breaks.
  - yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
    > On a laptop from 2008, you won't have USB 3.0, 5ghz wifi, support for 16GB DIMM's (and maybe not even 8GB). It's modular. No USB 3.0, true, but WiFi should be doable by replacing that card, and at least mine has 8GB of RAM (which, granted, is more than the manufacturer specifically supports and is actually the maximum that machine can handle).
  - hnlmorg 4y ago
    You've completely ignored what I've said and argued a completely different points. > On a laptop from 2008, you won't have USB 3.0, 5ghz wifi, support for 16GB DIMM's (and maybe not even 8GB). As I said, NUCs include all the stuff you've described. So upgrading the NUC in your laptop absolutely would upgrade USB et al. A NUC is a small form factor motherboard with an Intel CPU integrated. Just like upgrading your motherboard in a PC would upgrade USB et al, upgrading the NUC board would too. So your comment here doesn't apply to the product we're specifically talking about. > But even more to the point, your ten year old NUC is good enough. If you were the sort of person who upgraded, you would have upgraded. I said I use it as a HTPC. A HTPC is, by definition, not as a primary computing device. It's literally just a set top box. If my last laptop was upgradable by swapping the board with a new one (in the same way as the laptop being advertised here is) then I absolutely would have done that instead of buying a new one. I loved that laptop -- still do. But it just aged too far for me to use it as my daily development machine. > While a C64 isn't good enough for most people today, a ten year old laptop is right up until it breaks. I don't even understand your point here. You're comparing apples to oranges and don't even make a point out of it. For what it's worth, I do still have a bunch of 80s (and 70s too) 8-bit micros and still use them regularly. Sometimes for retro gaming, sometimes to teach my kids programming. Sometimes I just power them on for no particular reason aside nostalgia. It's sad how those machines are still working flawlessly yet modern systems 1/10th of the age are routinely breaking. Just goes to show how complex things have gotten and how disposable we consider our hardware these days. Just as your comments on this topic also do.
    - brudgers 4y ago
      Have you bought one of these new devices yet?
      - hnlmorg 4y ago
        My existing laptop is only 6 months old, so no. But I would consider this device when I'm looking to purchase a new laptop (and would have considered this device had I known about it 6 months ago).
jinto36 4y ago
"fine with using it as-is" and "would buy some upgrade parts if they were available" are not necessarily exclusive. I've known plenty of people for whom upgradeable laptops make no sense- by the time newer parts come out, their poor devices have been accidentally thrown down the stairs multiple times and are only being held together by hopes and dreams. For others who are a little gentler on their devices, if upgrade parts were not absurdly expensive, and if other aspects of the "core" interaction experience were still modern-ish- basically if we haven't moved to 8K OLED screens etc- then why not just update what you've got?
yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
I also said > and which would be my favorite machine if I could upgrade the CPU. Which means "if I could spend some money to upgrade the CPU, it would go from okay for light use to good for all uses, and that would be a good deal since I love everything about the machine other than the slow processor". Regarding your other points - yes, upgrading the CPU in isolation might be impractical. On the other hand, I like the chassis enough that I've already thought about replacing the whole mainboard with a Pi based version, so swapping in a NUC is still pretty reasonable sounding.
- brudgers 4y ago
  Upgradeable laptops have always sounded reasonable and never been a solution to a problem people are actually willing to pay the price of solving. For example if a rPi is an attractive upgrade, limited compute isn’t the motivating issue.
  - hnlmorg 4y ago
    I'd have thought the reason is pretty obvious: - They're more expensive to design and build - yet they also get a lower return on investment since consumers now have a cheaper upgrade path It's the usual problem with consumerism: companies couldn't give a crap about the environment nor longer term reusability because they're ultimately far less profitable than forcing people into perpetually buying new every few years.
    - brudgers 4y ago
      The upgrade path is almost never cheaper because who wants to stock lower margin sku’s? And because backward compatibility requires bespoke supply chains — and now is a time when that cost is obvious. You can build a new laptop out of whatever is available.
      - hnlmorg 4y ago
        NUCs have been around for a decade already. The supply chains are already well established and the hardware already very accessible to consumers. Just because this is your first discovering of the hardware it doesn't mean that a great many people haven't already been using NUCs in a variety of settings. Also a laptop is more than just the motherboard and processor. You have the casing, keyboard, touchpad, cooling systems, battery, PSU, monitor, etc.

hnlmorg 4y ago

NUC's are a motherboard. They'll typically have a processor included (maybe always?) but also have onboard USB, HDMI and other components. Sometimes even a WiFi radio, though my NUC doesn't. You then supply the storage, RAM and any external accessories. That means you can upgrade your CPU and still see upgrades in USB, RAM and so on and so forth, like you wanted, too. I'm not exactly a member of the Intel fan club but I've got to admit that the NUC is a pretty awesome bit of kit. Crudely speaking, it's halfway between a Raspberry Pi and a desktop PC. So I think it's really well suited for the kind of purpose described in the article. I've got a NUC from around a decade ago to use as a HTPC and it's still going strong even now.

brudgers 4y ago
On a laptop from 2008, you won't have USB 3.0, 5ghz wifi, support for 16GB DIMM's (and maybe not even 8GB). But even more to the point, your ten year old NUC is good enough. If you were the sort of person who upgraded, you would have upgraded. While a C64 isn't good enough for most people today, a ten year old laptop is right up until it breaks.
- yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
  > On a laptop from 2008, you won't have USB 3.0, 5ghz wifi, support for 16GB DIMM's (and maybe not even 8GB). It's modular. No USB 3.0, true, but WiFi should be doable by replacing that card, and at least mine has 8GB of RAM (which, granted, is more than the manufacturer specifically supports and is actually the maximum that machine can handle).
- hnlmorg 4y ago
  You've completely ignored what I've said and argued a completely different points. > On a laptop from 2008, you won't have USB 3.0, 5ghz wifi, support for 16GB DIMM's (and maybe not even 8GB). As I said, NUCs include all the stuff you've described. So upgrading the NUC in your laptop absolutely would upgrade USB et al. A NUC is a small form factor motherboard with an Intel CPU integrated. Just like upgrading your motherboard in a PC would upgrade USB et al, upgrading the NUC board would too. So your comment here doesn't apply to the product we're specifically talking about. > But even more to the point, your ten year old NUC is good enough. If you were the sort of person who upgraded, you would have upgraded. I said I use it as a HTPC. A HTPC is, by definition, not as a primary computing device. It's literally just a set top box. If my last laptop was upgradable by swapping the board with a new one (in the same way as the laptop being advertised here is) then I absolutely would have done that instead of buying a new one. I loved that laptop -- still do. But it just aged too far for me to use it as my daily development machine. > While a C64 isn't good enough for most people today, a ten year old laptop is right up until it breaks. I don't even understand your point here. You're comparing apples to oranges and don't even make a point out of it. For what it's worth, I do still have a bunch of 80s (and 70s too) 8-bit micros and still use them regularly. Sometimes for retro gaming, sometimes to teach my kids programming. Sometimes I just power them on for no particular reason aside nostalgia. It's sad how those machines are still working flawlessly yet modern systems 1/10th of the age are routinely breaking. Just goes to show how complex things have gotten and how disposable we consider our hardware these days. Just as your comments on this topic also do.
  - brudgers 4y ago
    Have you bought one of these new devices yet?
    - hnlmorg 4y ago
      My existing laptop is only 6 months old, so no. But I would consider this device when I'm looking to purchase a new laptop (and would have considered this device had I known about it 6 months ago).

jinto36 4y ago

"fine with using it as-is" and "would buy some upgrade parts if they were available" are not necessarily exclusive. I've known plenty of people for whom upgradeable laptops make no sense- by the time newer parts come out, their poor devices have been accidentally thrown down the stairs multiple times and are only being held together by hopes and dreams. For others who are a little gentler on their devices, if upgrade parts were not absurdly expensive, and if other aspects of the "core" interaction experience were still modern-ish- basically if we haven't moved to 8K OLED screens etc- then why not just update what you've got?

yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago

I also said > and which would be my favorite machine if I could upgrade the CPU. Which means "if I could spend some money to upgrade the CPU, it would go from okay for light use to good for all uses, and that would be a good deal since I love everything about the machine other than the slow processor". Regarding your other points - yes, upgrading the CPU in isolation might be impractical. On the other hand, I like the chassis enough that I've already thought about replacing the whole mainboard with a Pi based version, so swapping in a NUC is still pretty reasonable sounding.

brudgers 4y ago
Upgradeable laptops have always sounded reasonable and never been a solution to a problem people are actually willing to pay the price of solving. For example if a rPi is an attractive upgrade, limited compute isn’t the motivating issue.
- hnlmorg 4y ago
  I'd have thought the reason is pretty obvious: - They're more expensive to design and build - yet they also get a lower return on investment since consumers now have a cheaper upgrade path It's the usual problem with consumerism: companies couldn't give a crap about the environment nor longer term reusability because they're ultimately far less profitable than forcing people into perpetually buying new every few years.
  - brudgers 4y ago
    The upgrade path is almost never cheaper because who wants to stock lower margin sku’s? And because backward compatibility requires bespoke supply chains — and now is a time when that cost is obvious. You can build a new laptop out of whatever is available.
    - hnlmorg 4y ago
      NUCs have been around for a decade already. The supply chains are already well established and the hardware already very accessible to consumers. Just because this is your first discovering of the hardware it doesn't mean that a great many people haven't already been using NUCs in a variety of settings. Also a laptop is more than just the motherboard and processor. You have the casing, keyboard, touchpad, cooling systems, battery, PSU, monitor, etc.