5 ms·

Laptops are consumables. By the time you want a CPU upgrade (let's say 2-3 years or even more), isn't it likely you want to replace the whole machine?

by sgt 4y ago

marssaxman 4y ago
I am glad that some of you feel this way, because it creates a never-ending supply of cheap but still very nice barely-used laptops for me to buy instead of new ones.
lupire 4y ago
On a modern laptop, the part that fails first is the OS. Hardware lasts 10 years, OS lasts at most 7.
baq 4y ago
used to be... the cycle lengthened. it may make sense to upgrade the CPU later.
hnlmorg 4y ago
There a few reasons people might not want to: + Cost (cheaper to upgrade) + Environmental impact (less being thrown into landfills) + They might already like the chassis (I really miss the keyboard layout and touchpad from my old laptop) Given laptops are supposed to be portable PCs (MacBooks aside) and PCs were always upgradable, it's a great pity we've stepped backwards into something a lot less customisable.
yardie 4y ago
I've hung onto my old MBP 2015 for way too long simply for the keyboard. If I could upgrade just the CPU I would, but it has rarely been the limiting factor. I've already changed the original SSD to a faster 1TB.
- bluedino 4y ago
  The Magic Keyboard on the 2019+ models is really nice, going back to my unibody MBP made it feel like wet cardboard.
yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago
I have, and still regularly use, a ThinkPad from 2008 which remains perfectly fine for light use and which would be my favorite machine if I could upgrade the CPU. Why do you think laptops are consumables?
- brudgers 4y ago
  Consider the two ideas in your question. 1. Old laptops are suitable for light use. 2. You are fine using an old laptop. Neither of those suggests you are actually likely to spend money on a CPU upgrade. The history of upgradable consumer computers bears this out. Intel has Tik'd and Toc'd several times in the 14 years since 2008. Basically, an upgrade board would need to be an entire computer...RAM has marched on too. So has USB. It doesn't make sense to keep that SKU in stock for a market segment that doesn't upgrade their compute.
  - hnlmorg 4y ago
    NUC's are a motherboard. They'll typically have a processor included (maybe always?) but also have onboard USB, HDMI and other components. Sometimes even a WiFi radio, though my NUC doesn't. You then supply the storage, RAM and any external accessories. That means you can upgrade your CPU and still see upgrades in USB, RAM and so on and so forth, like you wanted, too. I'm not exactly a member of the Intel fan club but I've got to admit that the NUC is a pretty awesome bit of kit. Crudely speaking, it's halfway between a Raspberry Pi and a desktop PC. So I think it's really well suited for the kind of purpose described in the article. I've got a NUC from around a decade ago to use as a HTPC and it's still going strong even now.
    - brudgers 4y ago
      On a laptop from 2008, you won't have USB 3.0, 5ghz wifi, support for 16GB DIMM's (and maybe not even 8GB). But even more to the point, your ten year old NUC is good enough. If you were the sort of person who upgraded, you would have upgraded. While a C64 isn't good enough for most people today, a ten year old laptop is right up until it breaks.
INTPenis 4y ago
It shouldn't be like that though. Yet another anecdote but my Lenovo Thinkpad X1 from 2017 is still a very high quality laptop. Of course it's an ultrabook so I don't imagine replacing anything on it.
- brudgers 4y ago
  The laptop market is driven by enterprise not individual consumers. There's little business case for upgradeable laptops due to depreciation schedules and labor costs. The history of upgradeable consumer and small business computers suggests that there's no actual demand. Probably because people who want the latest, want the latest, not a half-measure. There's good margins from FOMO. Logistics swamp margins in fear of FOMO products.
- gruez 4y ago
  > It shouldn't be like that though. It "shouldn't", but practicality considerations prevent that from happening. Even on desktops where theoretically every component is swappable, if you want to to upgrade your CPU you often have to replace the motherboard (because chipset compatability with the CPU) and maybe the RAM (because the CPU uses a newer DRAM generation). At this point the only thing you're retaining is the chassis, keyboard, and display which makes up a small overall cost of the laptop.
  - vladvasiliu 4y ago
    > At this point the only thing you're retaining is the chassis, keyboard, and display which makes up a small overall cost of the laptop. I don't really agree with this take. I've looked a bit around for laptops at the end of 2021, and it was my impression that the difference between cheaper and pricier laptops from a given manufacturer is exactly those bits that don't change that much: nicer screens, cases, speakers, etc. They all come with the same CPUs and take the same RAM and NVMe drives.
  - nicolaslem 4y ago
    > If you want to to upgrade your CPU you often have to replace the motherboard. That's true for Intel and their "Tick-Tock" cycle which breaks compatibility every other year. So far AMD's commitment to AM4 has shown that it's possible to upgrade a 5 years old motherboard to the latest CPU. Let's hope their next AM5 socket gets the same longevity.
dirkc 4y ago
It still feels like my Sony Vaio from 2012 had a better screen than my current laptop. I would have liked to keep that screen with the rest being new.
- vladvasiliu 4y ago
  I'm with you on this one. If I could move the CPU and RAM from my late 2021 HP laptop to my 2013 MBP I would do so in a heartbeat. Apart from that, the only things somewhat better on the HP are USB-C charging (allows me to use other people's chargers – I work in PC-land) and HDMI 2.0 port. I barely use the last one, and for all my needs the mac's DP connectors were enough (could run 4k@60Hz). Bonus points for those being thunderbolt, so they run at full speed with a screen attached. The mac's screen, touchpad, keyboard, speakers, wifi (!), lack of case creaking while on a flat surface are all simply superior. And this is a 9 yo computer that I've lugged around daily for some 7-8 years and would only go to sleep while in my bag.

Laptops are consumables. By the time you want a CPU upgrade (let's say 2-3 years or even more), isn't it likely you want to replace the whole machine?

by sgt 4y ago

Laptops are consumables. By the time you want a CPU upgrade (let's say 2-3 years or even more), isn't it likely you want to replace the whole machine?

marssaxman 4y ago

I am glad that some of you feel this way, because it creates a never-ending supply of cheap but still very nice barely-used laptops for me to buy instead of new ones.

lupire 4y ago

On a modern laptop, the part that fails first is the OS. Hardware lasts 10 years, OS lasts at most 7.

baq 4y ago

used to be... the cycle lengthened. it may make sense to upgrade the CPU later.

hnlmorg 4y ago

There a few reasons people might not want to: + Cost (cheaper to upgrade) + Environmental impact (less being thrown into landfills) + They might already like the chassis (I really miss the keyboard layout and touchpad from my old laptop) Given laptops are supposed to be portable PCs (MacBooks aside) and PCs were always upgradable, it's a great pity we've stepped backwards into something a lot less customisable.

yardie 4y ago

I've hung onto my old MBP 2015 for way too long simply for the keyboard. If I could upgrade just the CPU I would, but it has rarely been the limiting factor. I've already changed the original SSD to a faster 1TB.

bluedino 4y ago
The Magic Keyboard on the 2019+ models is really nice, going back to my unibody MBP made it feel like wet cardboard.

yjftsjthsd-h 4y ago

I have, and still regularly use, a ThinkPad from 2008 which remains perfectly fine for light use and which would be my favorite machine if I could upgrade the CPU. Why do you think laptops are consumables?

brudgers 4y ago
Consider the two ideas in your question. 1. Old laptops are suitable for light use. 2. You are fine using an old laptop. Neither of those suggests you are actually likely to spend money on a CPU upgrade. The history of upgradable consumer computers bears this out. Intel has Tik'd and Toc'd several times in the 14 years since 2008. Basically, an upgrade board would need to be an entire computer...RAM has marched on too. So has USB. It doesn't make sense to keep that SKU in stock for a market segment that doesn't upgrade their compute.
- hnlmorg 4y ago
  NUC's are a motherboard. They'll typically have a processor included (maybe always?) but also have onboard USB, HDMI and other components. Sometimes even a WiFi radio, though my NUC doesn't. You then supply the storage, RAM and any external accessories. That means you can upgrade your CPU and still see upgrades in USB, RAM and so on and so forth, like you wanted, too. I'm not exactly a member of the Intel fan club but I've got to admit that the NUC is a pretty awesome bit of kit. Crudely speaking, it's halfway between a Raspberry Pi and a desktop PC. So I think it's really well suited for the kind of purpose described in the article. I've got a NUC from around a decade ago to use as a HTPC and it's still going strong even now.
  - brudgers 4y ago
    On a laptop from 2008, you won't have USB 3.0, 5ghz wifi, support for 16GB DIMM's (and maybe not even 8GB). But even more to the point, your ten year old NUC is good enough. If you were the sort of person who upgraded, you would have upgraded. While a C64 isn't good enough for most people today, a ten year old laptop is right up until it breaks.

INTPenis 4y ago

It shouldn't be like that though. Yet another anecdote but my Lenovo Thinkpad X1 from 2017 is still a very high quality laptop. Of course it's an ultrabook so I don't imagine replacing anything on it.

brudgers 4y ago
The laptop market is driven by enterprise not individual consumers. There's little business case for upgradeable laptops due to depreciation schedules and labor costs. The history of upgradeable consumer and small business computers suggests that there's no actual demand. Probably because people who want the latest, want the latest, not a half-measure. There's good margins from FOMO. Logistics swamp margins in fear of FOMO products.
gruez 4y ago
> It shouldn't be like that though. It "shouldn't", but practicality considerations prevent that from happening. Even on desktops where theoretically every component is swappable, if you want to to upgrade your CPU you often have to replace the motherboard (because chipset compatability with the CPU) and maybe the RAM (because the CPU uses a newer DRAM generation). At this point the only thing you're retaining is the chassis, keyboard, and display which makes up a small overall cost of the laptop.
- vladvasiliu 4y ago
  > At this point the only thing you're retaining is the chassis, keyboard, and display which makes up a small overall cost of the laptop. I don't really agree with this take. I've looked a bit around for laptops at the end of 2021, and it was my impression that the difference between cheaper and pricier laptops from a given manufacturer is exactly those bits that don't change that much: nicer screens, cases, speakers, etc. They all come with the same CPUs and take the same RAM and NVMe drives.
- nicolaslem 4y ago
  > If you want to to upgrade your CPU you often have to replace the motherboard. That's true for Intel and their "Tick-Tock" cycle which breaks compatibility every other year. So far AMD's commitment to AM4 has shown that it's possible to upgrade a 5 years old motherboard to the latest CPU. Let's hope their next AM5 socket gets the same longevity.

dirkc 4y ago

It still feels like my Sony Vaio from 2012 had a better screen than my current laptop. I would have liked to keep that screen with the rest being new.

vladvasiliu 4y ago
I'm with you on this one. If I could move the CPU and RAM from my late 2021 HP laptop to my 2013 MBP I would do so in a heartbeat. Apart from that, the only things somewhat better on the HP are USB-C charging (allows me to use other people's chargers – I work in PC-land) and HDMI 2.0 port. I barely use the last one, and for all my needs the mac's DP connectors were enough (could run 4k@60Hz). Bonus points for those being thunderbolt, so they run at full speed with a screen attached. The mac's screen, touchpad, keyboard, speakers, wifi (!), lack of case creaking while on a flat surface are all simply superior. And this is a 9 yo computer that I've lugged around daily for some 7-8 years and would only go to sleep while in my bag.