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>A software engineer is instrumental to how a company operates. >If you are smart, educated, and have enough work ethic to get a job at Facebook as a software

>A software engineer is instrumental to how a company operates. >If you are smart, educated, and have enough work ethic to get a job at Facebook as a software developer, you certainly have what it takes to work anywhere else. There is a lot to Facebook, and a lot of various internal and external software that requires SWEs. You lament that people in OP's position "are failing us" because they're not doing more to speak out about FB's bullshit, and that they are better-positioned to get a job elsewhere, yet I have only seen you spout negative rhetoric towards OP and make zero effort to understand more. You haven't bothered asking them what they worked on at FB, nor have you asked them why they are an ex FB engineer. You have no idea if they contributed to fucked up shit or if it's the fucked up shit that made them leave (isn't that departure what you want, after all?). Your general sentiment isn't wholly incorrect, it's your determination to kick nuance to the curb and paint everyone with a broad, negative brush that is the issue.

rglullis 4y ago
> they're not doing more to speak out about FB's bullshit "Actions speak louder than words". I care very little about what they are they "speaking out" about. My point is that Facebook's reputation is not new. Its privacy abuses, the practices for exploiting user data for their own benefit, their "move fast and break things" mentality that applies even to things that affect the social fabric of the whole world... everything has been out there in the open for at least 2010, when the first "delete Facebook" campaign came up. So, it's not like people went to work there without knowing what they signed up for. The were not being offered generous compensation packages to work on ways to make the company less abusive. Their UX designers were not being hired to find ways to make users less dependent on the app. No developer was rewarded for finding a clever ways to determine if the user was a teenager and therefore unable to have access to the website. No data analyst got any bonus because they implemented a system that reduced data collection and increased user privacy. Quite the opposite, actually. > You have no idea if they contributed to fucked up shit Anyone working on Facebook at a position that contributes to how the company operates and makes business is by definition working on "fucked up shit". Even the "cool open source projects". Even John Carmack while working at Oculus. Even the people working at WhatsApp who were from the beginning hoping to keep it clear from Facebook influence. Anyone receiving a paycheck from Facebook should be aware that their money comes at the expense of a lot of societal harm. They might be even okay with it (it is a good paycheck after all) but anyone with a modicum of ethical conscience would simply reject to work there.
- jjulius 4y ago
  I don't disagree with your general statement, but you have no idea when OP worked there, you have no idea why they joined, and you have no idea why they left. Were they there pre-2010? Did they join after thinking maybe it wasn't so bad and then quit when they found out it was? We don't know, because you won't ask. Again, I agree with your general views on FB. But when there's someone right in front of me, I'm gonna talk to them and find out more before I tell them that they shouldn't be allowed to be a member of society. Life is nuanced, and the degree to which we harbor hatred towards those doing harm is nuanced, too. I will always be initially apprehensive of someone like OP, but at a macro/individual level I will always work to understand more - it's the fair thing to do. If you want to ignorantly paint everyone with such a broad brush, go ahead.
  - rglullis 4y ago
    > I don't disagree with your general statement, but you have no idea when OP worked there, you have no idea why they joined, and you have no idea why they left. I already responded on another comment: it's not about the individual and it's not about wishing ill of anyone. Hate the sin, but love the sinner, and all that... In any case, I knew that OP's name was familiar, so I went to look at his history. If you do the same, you will find a comment where he will talk about "being excluded from the banking system". [0] The part he doesn't say (here, but it is on his LinkedIn) is that he was "CTO" on xSigma, which is one of the many "revolutionary DeFI" projects that took a lot of money from gullible fools and now have nothing of value to show for it. Not only that, he also uses that same comment as an opportunity to shill for his next project. IOW, even though I didn't enter the conversation to "pile on" against the individual, in this particular case the evidence is really stacked against him. [0]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31861753 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31861753

rglullis 4y ago

> they're not doing more to speak out about FB's bullshit "Actions speak louder than words". I care very little about what they are they "speaking out" about. My point is that Facebook's reputation is not new. Its privacy abuses, the practices for exploiting user data for their own benefit, their "move fast and break things" mentality that applies even to things that affect the social fabric of the whole world... everything has been out there in the open for at least 2010, when the first "delete Facebook" campaign came up. So, it's not like people went to work there without knowing what they signed up for. The were not being offered generous compensation packages to work on ways to make the company less abusive. Their UX designers were not being hired to find ways to make users less dependent on the app. No developer was rewarded for finding a clever ways to determine if the user was a teenager and therefore unable to have access to the website. No data analyst got any bonus because they implemented a system that reduced data collection and increased user privacy. Quite the opposite, actually. > You have no idea if they contributed to fucked up shit Anyone working on Facebook at a position that contributes to how the company operates and makes business is by definition working on "fucked up shit". Even the "cool open source projects". Even John Carmack while working at Oculus. Even the people working at WhatsApp who were from the beginning hoping to keep it clear from Facebook influence. Anyone receiving a paycheck from Facebook should be aware that their money comes at the expense of a lot of societal harm. They might be even okay with it (it is a good paycheck after all) but anyone with a modicum of ethical conscience would simply reject to work there.

jjulius 4y ago
I don't disagree with your general statement, but you have no idea when OP worked there, you have no idea why they joined, and you have no idea why they left. Were they there pre-2010? Did they join after thinking maybe it wasn't so bad and then quit when they found out it was? We don't know, because you won't ask. Again, I agree with your general views on FB. But when there's someone right in front of me, I'm gonna talk to them and find out more before I tell them that they shouldn't be allowed to be a member of society. Life is nuanced, and the degree to which we harbor hatred towards those doing harm is nuanced, too. I will always be initially apprehensive of someone like OP, but at a macro/individual level I will always work to understand more - it's the fair thing to do. If you want to ignorantly paint everyone with such a broad brush, go ahead.
- rglullis 4y ago
  > I don't disagree with your general statement, but you have no idea when OP worked there, you have no idea why they joined, and you have no idea why they left. I already responded on another comment: it's not about the individual and it's not about wishing ill of anyone. Hate the sin, but love the sinner, and all that... In any case, I knew that OP's name was familiar, so I went to look at his history. If you do the same, you will find a comment where he will talk about "being excluded from the banking system". [0] The part he doesn't say (here, but it is on his LinkedIn) is that he was "CTO" on xSigma, which is one of the many "revolutionary DeFI" projects that took a lot of money from gullible fools and now have nothing of value to show for it. Not only that, he also uses that same comment as an opportunity to shill for his next project. IOW, even though I didn't enter the conversation to "pile on" against the individual, in this particular case the evidence is really stacked against him. [0]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31861753 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31861753