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Jiddu Krishnamurti – How to Live in This World

26 points by truth_seeker 4y ago

juunpp 4y ago
Can we get some background on this?
- AareyBaba 4y ago
  In the late 1800's there was increasing interest in mysticism and eastern religions in the West. One lady, Helena Blavatsky an Ukrainian co-founded a movement called Theosophy which made it's way to India and merged with a mish-mash of Indian nationalists and Hindu philosophers around 1880-1890. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Blavatsky#India:_1879%E2%80%931885 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Blavatsky#India:_1879%E... As a young boy JD Krishamurthy (born 1895 in south India) was picked by leaders of the Theosophical Society of India as a 'vehicle' for an expected World Teacher. JDK quickly gained a following and wrote profound philosophical books that people found hard to understand which only increased his popularity among those seeking Eastern mysticism. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiddu_Krishnamurti https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiddu_Krishnamurti Like many Indian godmen and spiritual entrepreneurs, JD Krishnamurthy set out for the most lucrative market for his work: California. He spent the rest of his life churning out psychobabble and settled in lovely Ojai valley (having an affair with his best friend's wife). For a sampling of JDK's profound wisdom you should check out his quotes [3]. Here's a sampling: “One is never afraid of the unknown; one is afraid of the known coming to an end.” ― Krishnamurti “Real learning comes about when the competitive spirit has ceased.” ― J. Krishnamurti “Tradition becomes our security, and when the mind is secure it is in decay.” ― J. Krishnamurti [3] https://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes/850512.J_Krishnamurti https://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes/850512.J_Krishnamurt...
  - 1sembiyan 4y ago
    You left out the fact that JK rejected the notion of a world teacher and disbanded that particular association. He also rejected theosophy as a whole, and any organization that claims to know any such thing as a “Truth”. It’s interesting that he would reject the money and power that came with it just because he didn’t believe in it. Most godmen and “spiritual entrepreneurs” wouldn’t.
    - AareyBaba 4y ago
      Nevertheless, his writings are incoherent word soups and an utter waste of time.
      - pmoriarty 4y ago
        Just because you can't comprehend something doesn't mean that no one can.
        deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
      - 1sembiyan 4y ago
        I can’t get into his writings, but I know others that do (and I am not talking about Naval Ravikant). So a waste of just our time, perhaps, and yet cannot be dismissed.
      - marc_io 4y ago
        This lack of clarity in Krishnamurti's material was recognized even by David Bohm himself [1], but he also claimed that K made a great contribution to the study of consciousness. See David Moody's The Unconditioned Mind, chapter 15.
  - juunpp 4y ago
    > Having an affair with his best friend's wife. Was that also part of his profound wisdom? kek Thank you for the summary. The quotes certainly resonate.
    - bergenty 4y ago
      Doesn’t sound like it. Seems like a cheap shot from the GP since I’m not sure what the relevance is.
  - moomoo11 4y ago
    No disrespect meant but this reminds me when I took a 7g mushroom dose. I felt like a capital G guru and my friends would come to me for wisdom.
    - _def 4y ago
      It takes a lot of dedication to get there without drugs
  - _def 4y ago
    Here is another quote: "Do not repeat after me words that you do not understand. Do not merely put on a mask of my ideas, for it will be an illusion and you will thereby deceive yourself."
mark_l_watson 4y ago
I went in a Krishnamurti binge last year. I most liked his conversations with physicist David Bohm, a good friend of his: https://www.bohmkrishnamurti.com/ https://www.bohmkrishnamurti.com/ I found some of his books tiring after a while. Good stuff though generally.
pdimitar 4y ago
I got about 40% in and got bored. He's mostly just trying to rephrase the questions asked to him and shifts the topic to whatever he wants to talk about. Some of the stuff I found somewhat interesting and realistic -- like his claim that many end-states of systems are predetermined due to us clearly seeing their inputs but we still want those end-states to be different, which causes us misery -- but most of his words are kind of shallow and no actual solution is proposed. I get the idea: I can't change the world so I should change my perception of it in order to avoid misery. I get that and partially subscribe to it. But I'm not ready to become like one of these stoners with moronic sheepish smiles: "the world is how it is, man, don't worry about it". So none of us should ever attempt a change in the world then? I don't buy it. Thus, not my thing for the moment.
- mlboss 4y ago
  I would go one more level meta and say that your will to change the world is also part of what you see. The end goal is to be an impartial observer of your mental state as well for the world around you.
  - pdimitar 4y ago
    I have managed this a few small periods in my life and I'll admit it's much better for the mental health. That being said, I swung too far in the direction "meh, won't try anything" while there and I didn't like it. I don't find it impossible to be impartial and without expectations but I also found it extremely boring.
- truth_seeker 4y ago
  You must read it with relax mind. Do some outdoor sports activity and get tired physically , take a rest for few minutes and then read it. Spoiler Alert : Towards the end of the blog, he actually telling you the real meaning of Vipassana or how to live meditative life.
  - pdimitar 4y ago
    The problem is that this relaxed mind state kind of expects you to not expect anything which I find problematic. But likely haven't tried well enough, dunno.
jossclimb 4y ago
I feel like this sort of stuff is useful if you renounce the world and sit in an ashram reflecting everyone's questions back towards them, but carries very little applicable use that can make a difference in someone's life. If someone has these sorts of questions, what is the point in my life etc, I recommend something much more actionable such as CBT. It will start having results right away, and save you have to work out metaphysical riddles first.
- truth_seeker 4y ago
  No, JK was very much against ashram and traditional Guru-disciple bonding. He is pursuing to renounce our projection about he world which comes from memory and thoughts, not the world itself. " Don’t bother about freedom. First, see that you are in prison: the social prison, economic prison, political prison, religious prison, the prison which you have created yourself out of your desire, ambition, fears and pleasures. When you understand your prison, the prison that thought collectively and individually has created, the prison of our confusion, misery and suffering, when you understand that, look at it, go into it, see the structure and the nature of it, then out of that comes freedom. Then it is not a reward. One who is seeking a reward is never free. " - Public Talk 4 in Santa Monica, California, 24 March 1974

26 points by truth_seeker 4y ago

juunpp 4y ago

Can we get some background on this?

AareyBaba 4y ago
In the late 1800's there was increasing interest in mysticism and eastern religions in the West. One lady, Helena Blavatsky an Ukrainian co-founded a movement called Theosophy which made it's way to India and merged with a mish-mash of Indian nationalists and Hindu philosophers around 1880-1890. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Blavatsky#India:_1879%E2%80%931885 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Blavatsky#India:_1879%E... As a young boy JD Krishamurthy (born 1895 in south India) was picked by leaders of the Theosophical Society of India as a 'vehicle' for an expected World Teacher. JDK quickly gained a following and wrote profound philosophical books that people found hard to understand which only increased his popularity among those seeking Eastern mysticism. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiddu_Krishnamurti https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiddu_Krishnamurti Like many Indian godmen and spiritual entrepreneurs, JD Krishnamurthy set out for the most lucrative market for his work: California. He spent the rest of his life churning out psychobabble and settled in lovely Ojai valley (having an affair with his best friend's wife). For a sampling of JDK's profound wisdom you should check out his quotes [3]. Here's a sampling: “One is never afraid of the unknown; one is afraid of the known coming to an end.” ― Krishnamurti “Real learning comes about when the competitive spirit has ceased.” ― J. Krishnamurti “Tradition becomes our security, and when the mind is secure it is in decay.” ― J. Krishnamurti [3] https://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes/850512.J_Krishnamurti https://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes/850512.J_Krishnamurt...
- 1sembiyan 4y ago
  You left out the fact that JK rejected the notion of a world teacher and disbanded that particular association. He also rejected theosophy as a whole, and any organization that claims to know any such thing as a “Truth”. It’s interesting that he would reject the money and power that came with it just because he didn’t believe in it. Most godmen and “spiritual entrepreneurs” wouldn’t.
  - AareyBaba 4y ago
    Nevertheless, his writings are incoherent word soups and an utter waste of time.
    - pmoriarty 4y ago
      Just because you can't comprehend something doesn't mean that no one can.
      - deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
    - 1sembiyan 4y ago
      I can’t get into his writings, but I know others that do (and I am not talking about Naval Ravikant). So a waste of just our time, perhaps, and yet cannot be dismissed.
    - marc_io 4y ago
      This lack of clarity in Krishnamurti's material was recognized even by David Bohm himself [1], but he also claimed that K made a great contribution to the study of consciousness. See David Moody's The Unconditioned Mind, chapter 15.
- juunpp 4y ago
  > Having an affair with his best friend's wife. Was that also part of his profound wisdom? kek Thank you for the summary. The quotes certainly resonate.
  - bergenty 4y ago
    Doesn’t sound like it. Seems like a cheap shot from the GP since I’m not sure what the relevance is.
- moomoo11 4y ago
  No disrespect meant but this reminds me when I took a 7g mushroom dose. I felt like a capital G guru and my friends would come to me for wisdom.
  - _def 4y ago
    It takes a lot of dedication to get there without drugs
- _def 4y ago
  Here is another quote: "Do not repeat after me words that you do not understand. Do not merely put on a mask of my ideas, for it will be an illusion and you will thereby deceive yourself."

mark_l_watson 4y ago

I went in a Krishnamurti binge last year. I most liked his conversations with physicist David Bohm, a good friend of his: https://www.bohmkrishnamurti.com/ https://www.bohmkrishnamurti.com/ I found some of his books tiring after a while. Good stuff though generally.

pdimitar 4y ago

I got about 40% in and got bored. He's mostly just trying to rephrase the questions asked to him and shifts the topic to whatever he wants to talk about. Some of the stuff I found somewhat interesting and realistic -- like his claim that many end-states of systems are predetermined due to us clearly seeing their inputs but we still want those end-states to be different, which causes us misery -- but most of his words are kind of shallow and no actual solution is proposed. I get the idea: I can't change the world so I should change my perception of it in order to avoid misery. I get that and partially subscribe to it. But I'm not ready to become like one of these stoners with moronic sheepish smiles: "the world is how it is, man, don't worry about it". So none of us should ever attempt a change in the world then? I don't buy it. Thus, not my thing for the moment.

mlboss 4y ago
I would go one more level meta and say that your will to change the world is also part of what you see. The end goal is to be an impartial observer of your mental state as well for the world around you.
- pdimitar 4y ago
  I have managed this a few small periods in my life and I'll admit it's much better for the mental health. That being said, I swung too far in the direction "meh, won't try anything" while there and I didn't like it. I don't find it impossible to be impartial and without expectations but I also found it extremely boring.
truth_seeker 4y ago
You must read it with relax mind. Do some outdoor sports activity and get tired physically , take a rest for few minutes and then read it. Spoiler Alert : Towards the end of the blog, he actually telling you the real meaning of Vipassana or how to live meditative life.
- pdimitar 4y ago
  The problem is that this relaxed mind state kind of expects you to not expect anything which I find problematic. But likely haven't tried well enough, dunno.

jossclimb 4y ago

I feel like this sort of stuff is useful if you renounce the world and sit in an ashram reflecting everyone's questions back towards them, but carries very little applicable use that can make a difference in someone's life. If someone has these sorts of questions, what is the point in my life etc, I recommend something much more actionable such as CBT. It will start having results right away, and save you have to work out metaphysical riddles first.

truth_seeker 4y ago
No, JK was very much against ashram and traditional Guru-disciple bonding. He is pursuing to renounce our projection about he world which comes from memory and thoughts, not the world itself. " Don’t bother about freedom. First, see that you are in prison: the social prison, economic prison, political prison, religious prison, the prison which you have created yourself out of your desire, ambition, fears and pleasures. When you understand your prison, the prison that thought collectively and individually has created, the prison of our confusion, misery and suffering, when you understand that, look at it, go into it, see the structure and the nature of it, then out of that comes freedom. Then it is not a reward. One who is seeking a reward is never free. " - Public Talk 4 in Santa Monica, California, 24 March 1974