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Eh, I don't buy the public square argument. The online world is a cesspool filled with bots and crazy people. I don't need to voice my opinion on Twitter, nor

Eh, I don't buy the public square argument. The online world is a cesspool filled with bots and crazy people. I don't need to voice my opinion on Twitter, nor is Twitter a place I need to be. What matters is how we relate to the people around us, in our communities. Your neighbor isn't a bot, the barista at the coffee shop isn't a russian troll. We need to stop taking the "online world" so seriously and connect with the people around us more.

ratww 4y ago
The real world is also a cesspool filled with crazy people and people trying to abuse the system (something analogous to bots). Also spammers and harassers. The difference is that on the real world public squares there’s no amplification effect that we have on those platforms, save for some very closely watched exceptions (politicians, celebrities). Also very little anonymity.
- b112 4y ago
  The real world is also a cesspool filled with crazy people and people trying to abuse the system (something analogous to bots No, the real world is an excellent place, filled with great people everywhere. There is no comparison with the twitter/facebook mob, where 99,99% of people strive for your attention, for monetary gain.
  - ratww 4y ago
    > No, the real world is an excellent place, filled with great people everywhere. The internet is also filled with those same people. That includes Twitter and Facebook. The reason the bad ones are are extra loud in the internet is because some websites amplify their messages, whereas normal people don’t want the extra attention and prefer privacy.
OrangeMonkey 4y ago
If I am interpreting this correctly, and I may not be, it seems like you are saying "The online world does not contain public squares, and that is because we need to change what everyone else in the world considers a public square." If I am interpreting that correctly, I don't know what I can add here. I don't necessarily disagree, but I think we have moved past that possibility. How many of us know our neighbors and talk to them? I've lived in my home for a few years and I don't even know their names fully. But, I now know yours and the fact we (at least slightly) disagree. Right or wrong, I think humanity has moved on and we are now connected.
- AlbertCory 4y ago
  I didn't know many neighbors until I started walking a cute, friendly dog. You should try that.
  - kQq9oHeAz6wLLS 4y ago
    Nearly all my conversations with neighbors involve dogs or flowers.
jonnycomputer 4y ago
Yeah, I don't think the problem is public squares, but force multipliers that certain actors, especially well-funded ones, can employ (meaning mostly state actors, but also corporations and other interest groups) can use to dominate digital public spaces.
smaryjerry 4y ago
The bot solution is extremely simple, add more layers of human verification or a paid tier. It hurts the user experience in one way but enhances it in another. Why not at least require verification once per 24 hours? The trolls in person is not any better, we have enormous amounts of crime/lies in the real world. Being online actually protects users physically so much that now arguments are more over what is harming users mentally online. It seems dramatically better to ONLY risk your mental state than risk physical and mental harm in the real world. Someone being online has gotten a bad rap because people can get feelings hurt, but at the same time there are countless options to protect your feelings online also without banning other people. People have the tools to build a bubble around themselves but for some reason instead they often choose to build a prison around others instead.
robswc 4y ago
I get that. The problem is Twitter/TikTok/Facebook does and will spill into the real world and truly effect you.

ratww 4y ago

The real world is also a cesspool filled with crazy people and people trying to abuse the system (something analogous to bots). Also spammers and harassers. The difference is that on the real world public squares there’s no amplification effect that we have on those platforms, save for some very closely watched exceptions (politicians, celebrities). Also very little anonymity.

b112 4y ago
The real world is also a cesspool filled with crazy people and people trying to abuse the system (something analogous to bots No, the real world is an excellent place, filled with great people everywhere. There is no comparison with the twitter/facebook mob, where 99,99% of people strive for your attention, for monetary gain.
- ratww 4y ago
  > No, the real world is an excellent place, filled with great people everywhere. The internet is also filled with those same people. That includes Twitter and Facebook. The reason the bad ones are are extra loud in the internet is because some websites amplify their messages, whereas normal people don’t want the extra attention and prefer privacy.

OrangeMonkey 4y ago

If I am interpreting this correctly, and I may not be, it seems like you are saying "The online world does not contain public squares, and that is because we need to change what everyone else in the world considers a public square." If I am interpreting that correctly, I don't know what I can add here. I don't necessarily disagree, but I think we have moved past that possibility. How many of us know our neighbors and talk to them? I've lived in my home for a few years and I don't even know their names fully. But, I now know yours and the fact we (at least slightly) disagree. Right or wrong, I think humanity has moved on and we are now connected.

AlbertCory 4y ago
I didn't know many neighbors until I started walking a cute, friendly dog. You should try that.
- kQq9oHeAz6wLLS 4y ago
  Nearly all my conversations with neighbors involve dogs or flowers.

jonnycomputer 4y ago

Yeah, I don't think the problem is public squares, but force multipliers that certain actors, especially well-funded ones, can employ (meaning mostly state actors, but also corporations and other interest groups) can use to dominate digital public spaces.

smaryjerry 4y ago

The bot solution is extremely simple, add more layers of human verification or a paid tier. It hurts the user experience in one way but enhances it in another. Why not at least require verification once per 24 hours? The trolls in person is not any better, we have enormous amounts of crime/lies in the real world. Being online actually protects users physically so much that now arguments are more over what is harming users mentally online. It seems dramatically better to ONLY risk your mental state than risk physical and mental harm in the real world. Someone being online has gotten a bad rap because people can get feelings hurt, but at the same time there are countless options to protect your feelings online also without banning other people. People have the tools to build a bubble around themselves but for some reason instead they often choose to build a prison around others instead.

robswc 4y ago

I get that. The problem is Twitter/TikTok/Facebook does and will spill into the real world and truly effect you.